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  1. #1
    Player
    Bacent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Kweh
    Posts
    1,834
    Character
    Bacent Rekkes
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 90

    Request: by 6.0 please change the rules on PF against run sellers

    I'm at 116 people right now in my blacklist, besides 4-5 of the people on there, the only people I blacklist are the people plaguing the party finder with their runselling.

    Every day just about there's a new PF I have to blacklist the runner for. We all know the spheal by now.

    CONTACT ME ON DISCORD TO BUY YOUR RUNS FOR ANY CONTENT IN THE GAME! WE WILL KEEP ADDING PEOPLE TO OUR GROUPS SO YOU WILL RUN OUT OF BLACKLIST SPACE EVENTUALLY!

    I've seen the exact same copy/paste PFs again and again, and blacklist does nothing to stop me from seeing them.

    On the worst days there will be about 80 or so PF Groups up, only for me to be able to see barely half of them because of these run sellers and me wanting nothing to do with them. Right now as I'm typing this there's 12 PF groups I can't see out of about 47, including many people putting the exact same copy/paste PF group at the same time with the only difference being in the discord number to contact them on. I've even seen level 1 characters putting those PF groups up just to get around blacklists. (Worst is then they say they take pre-payments for content not even out yet)

    I didn't really care about the run sellers when it was ONLY for gil, since a there weren't many groups up at all, but now there's too many people trying to get in on this and it's legit a pain in the ass to see.

    And again, I'm at 116 people blacklisted, and I moved to Odin from Cerberus when the free world jumps were offered to people a couple months before 5.0. That's barely a couple years to go from nothing to over half full and I'll run out of space to blacklist people at some point during the 6.X series.
    (9)
    Please show support for chocobo boots to be added -> http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/323512-Suggestion-for-an-item-to-be-added-to-gold-saucer-Chocobo-Boots

    Unhappy with how they implemented Mahjong? -> http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/381358-Mahjong-is-the-most-depressing-mini-game-you-ve-added-to-XIV

  2. #2
    Player
    LittleImp's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Posts
    1,204
    Character
    Lil Imp
    World
    Goblin
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    They're kind of annoying, but do they really disrupt the functionality of the party finder enough to justify spending time blacklisting that many of them? I use the PF daily and haven't really found it intrusive enough to warrant action.

    All the pfs advertising ERP on the other hand...
    (2)

  3. #3
    Player
    kaynide's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    2,881
    Character
    Kris Goldenshield
    World
    Tonberry
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 100
    While I feel your pain on the spam, run sells are not against the ToS.

    This kind of post pops up every couple of months.

    May I suggest a different server (jp servers have little spam comparatively) or just filtering shouts.

    The suck is you can’t filter PF...which I wish they did have.
    (0)

  4. #4
    Player
    Bacent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Kweh
    Posts
    1,834
    Character
    Bacent Rekkes
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by kaynide View Post
    While I feel your pain on the spam, run sells are not against the ToS.

    This kind of post pops up every couple of months.

    May I suggest a different server (jp servers have little spam comparatively) or just filtering shouts.

    The suck is you can’t filter PF...which I wish they did have.
    It's why I'm asking them to make it against the ToS, a couple other MMOs have made rules against this very thing and it should honestly be more wide spread. You have to trick the PF run sellers into admitting they take money from outside the game to do anything about it, and eventually I'm gonna run out of SE's limited blacklist space because I don't want to see those run sellers.
    (1)
    Please show support for chocobo boots to be added -> http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/323512-Suggestion-for-an-item-to-be-added-to-gold-saucer-Chocobo-Boots

    Unhappy with how they implemented Mahjong? -> http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/381358-Mahjong-is-the-most-depressing-mini-game-you-ve-added-to-XIV

  5. #5
    Player
    Rita1989's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    632
    Character
    Nenemi Nemi
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Lancer Lv 40
    Quote Originally Posted by kaynide View Post
    While I feel your pain on the spam, run sells are not against the ToS.

    This kind of post pops up every couple of months.

    May I suggest a different server (jp servers have little spam comparatively) or just filtering shouts.

    The suck is you can’t filter PF...which I wish they did have.
    Selling runs for real money is against the ToS that's why they will never speak a word about in game. Also for stuff like ultimate's I heard they log into your character for you which is also against the ToS.
    (1)

  6. #6
    Player
    kaynide's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    2,881
    Character
    Kris Goldenshield
    World
    Tonberry
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Rita1989 View Post
    Selling runs for real money is against the ToS that's why they will never speak a word about in game. Also for stuff like ultimate's I heard they log into your character for you which is also against the ToS.
    Not all runs are sold for RMT, and there is history of clearing with 7 members. There is almost an exact mirror of this post a few months back with relevant links.

    What people do with the gil is unrelated and obviously banable if RMT is involved.

    My point is, the isolated act of selling (or buying) a run is not against ToS.

    I will save time linking to basically this same topic from a while back:

    https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...ears-and-items

    With a relevant posts:

    Quote Originally Posted by kaynide View Post
    https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1ek4y1k7rA

    Ultima ultimate cleared with 7 people. I never specified any specific fight, just that if it were possible, people could make money.

    There is a difference in stance that “all ultimates can be done with 7”, and “fights which can be done with 7 will see clear sales”. My point is the latter.
    And

    Quote Originally Posted by kaynide View Post
    Not only is it not bannable, but is actually considered a legit transaction between players from the devs/GM point of view.

    (Eg. Post from 2017 with GM being quoted as saying such: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post4500631 )

    #28 on that thread:

    GM:"I see, according to the logs they seem to only be selling runs for Gil and that they have it listed cross-world by default."
    GM: "Selling runs for Gil is not against the terms of service."
    GM: "I feel that I have everything I need to begin my investigation. Before I take my leave is there anything else that I may be able to assist you with today?"
    I ask if they can request the advertisers to uncheck the option that has the listings being shown across the data center.
    GM: "No I can not"
    GM: "Players are allowed to do this and it would be interruption of their game play if I were to make them stop."
    Me: Even though it's across the data center? (paraphrased)
    GM: "That's correct."
    Me: How are they receiving gil across servers? (paraphrased)
    The GM then ends the conversation.
    (1)
    Last edited by kaynide; 02-07-2021 at 02:52 PM.

  7. #7
    Player
    Xatsh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Uldah
    Posts
    2,011
    Character
    Xatsh Vei
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Selling runs for in game gil is perfectly fine in my opinion. No different then a crafter selling gear to people, it is just battle classes selling their services.

    Problem is the "talk to us through discord only people" on party finder more times then not are run sellers for real money. They use the discord because SE cannot use any evidence of rmt that is not in in-game chat itself. So talk about selling stuff for RL money outside the game... SE does nothing. They are also doing it because they make you give them your login info so they can play your character through the clears since you cannot really 7 man savage stuff anymore with a dead person, which is also against TOS.

    Though my blacklist is almost capped out by blacklisting cancerous garbage I find in party finder trying to clear the run the legit way, no space to blacklist rmt anymore. At like 188 ppl blacklisted now.. need a blacklist expansion. So sick of people who endlessly complain about parser results on a progression group or just flat out do not heal/do a mechanics so they can max dps... SE really needs to take down FFLogs and parsers makes raiding pure cancer. Which using is also against TOS.... Sorta wonder why SE has a TOS if they do not enforce any of bigger issues plaguing the game.
    (0)

  8. #8
    Player Caitsithhh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Posts
    294
    Character
    Junji Lucilfer
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Xatsh View Post
    Selling runs for in game gil is perfectly fine in my opinion. No different then a crafter selling gear to people, it is just battle classes selling their services.

    Problem is the "talk to us through discord only people" on party finder more times then not are run sellers for real money. They use the discord because SE cannot use any evidence of rmt that is not in in-game chat itself. So talk about selling stuff for RL money outside the game... SE does nothing. They are also doing it because they make you give them your login info so they can play your character through the clears since you cannot really 7 man savage stuff anymore with a dead person, which is also against TOS.

    Though my blacklist is almost capped out by blacklisting cancerous garbage I find in party finder trying to clear the run the legit way, no space to blacklist rmt anymore. At like 188 ppl blacklisted now.. need a blacklist expansion. So sick of people who endlessly complain about parser results on a progression group or just flat out do not heal/do a mechanics so they can max dps... SE really needs to take down FFLogs and parsers makes raiding pure cancer. Which using is also against TOS.... Sorta wonder why SE has a TOS if they do not enforce any of bigger issues plaguing the game.
    Generally ppl that have issues with logs and parsers are people that don’t do well when actually examined. Yet think they’re good enough to tackle high end content. There’s no issue whatsoever with parsers and logs. It’s a very very tiny vocal minority that are smootbrain’d enough to talk crap to people in game about actual numbers. Chill

    Back to op, it’s totally legal and nothing wrong with it since there’s literally no Gil sinks in this game. Your blacklist OCD is a personal problem frankly...
    (2)

  9. #9
    Player
    Valkyrie_Lenneth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    8,038
    Character
    Lynne Asteria
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Viper Lv 100
    It shouldn't be a problem now, all the hardcore ultimate raiders are quitting, so there won't be anyone to sell runs, right?

    I wish that was the case anyway....


    Quote Originally Posted by Caitsithhh View Post
    Generally ppl that have issues with logs and parsers are people that don’t do well when actually examined. Yet think they’re good enough to tackle high end content. There’s no issue whatsoever with parsers and logs. It’s a very very tiny vocal minority that are smootbrain’d enough to talk crap to people in game about actual numbers. Chill

    Back to op, it’s totally legal and nothing wrong with it since there’s literally no Gil sinks in this game. Your blacklist OCD is a personal problem frankly...
    If it was totally legal and nothing wrong with it they wouldn't have any problem talking to you in game over pricing now would they?
    (3)

  10. #10
    Player
    GrizzlyTank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    1,714
    Character
    Livia Bloodletter
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 100
    Coming from WoW. Run sellers will slowly and surely strangulate communication over the in-game channels so it would be for the best to snuff it out early even if it's just for gil.
    (3)

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