Positionals

[IruruCece]

Yet that is what they are for pretty much all the melee classes but monk. Nice to hit. They account for such little dps. The SAM for example, the positional account for less than a percent of the dps, so small crit variation can and will completely hide it.

Except you're wrong about Samurai's positional contributions yet again (by ignoring other people's posts, no less), because you're ignoring that landing positionals results in more Kenki, which results in more use of Kenki, either during burst phases or mixed in throughout their combos, which adds up to more than "just" "less than a percent" of our DPS.

If I could choose, every time, I would still have the Samurai who uses positionals to maximize their meter gain and use more of their OGCD skill than the Samurai who thinks they're ONLY "nice to hit", doesn't try to hit them at all, and then complains about them on the forums.

I'm hardly the best Samurai, I don't even raid for Savage/Ultimate, and I still try to hit those positionals whenever I can because I understand that they help me do that little extra bit of damage. If I'm helping the boss die that little bit faster, I'm helping contribute to the team that little bit more. It's not about my own numbers alone, there are 3 or 7 or 23 other players whose own time in the game is as valuable to them as mine is to myself.

In my mind, there are two types of selfish DPS. There's the Jobs that contribute little to others mechanically beyond hitting hard, and then there's the DPS player that slums it because they know someone else will pick up the slack and they want the game to conform to their preferences every patch. The game shouldn't be catering to or balanced entirely around the latter.

[Nothv13]

Except you're wrong about Samurai's positional contributions yet again (by ignoring other people's posts, no less), because you're ignoring that landing positionals results in more Kenki, which results in more use of Kenki, either during burst phases or mixed in throughout their combos, which adds up to more than "just" "less than a percent" of our DPS.

If I could choose, every time, I would still have the Samurai who uses positionals to maximize their meter gain and use more of their OGCD skill than the Samurai who thinks they're ONLY "nice to hit", doesn't try to hit them at all, and then complains about them on the forums.

I'm hardly the best Samurai, I don't even raid for Savage/Ultimate, and I still try to hit those positionals whenever I can because I understand that they help me do that little extra bit of damage. If I'm helping the boss die that little bit faster, I'm helping contribute to the team that little bit more. It's not about my own numbers alone, there are 3 or 7 or 23 other players whose own time in the game is as valuable to them as mine is to myself.

In my mind, there are two types of selfish DPS. There's the Jobs that contribute little to others mechanically beyond hitting hard, and then there's the DPS player that slums it because they know someone else will pick up the slack and they want the game to conform to their preferences every patch. The game shouldn't be catering to or balanced entirely around the latter.

Pretty sure in one of the other threads, someone mathed it out and it was a tiny percent

[ItMe]

Pretty sure in one of the other threads, someone mathed it out and it was a tiny percent

Do you remember which thread?

[Nothv13]

Do you remember which thread?

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post5517824

[ItMe]

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post5517824

Thank you for the information.

[Sqwall]

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...nd-Suggestions

This has a perfect explanation of why positionals are stupid and a relic of a by gone time in FFXIV. It's also very well put together and a good read, but the bit about postionals being useless is SPOT ON!

[Rilifane]

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...nd-Suggestions

This has a perfect explanation of why positionals are stupid and a relic of a by gone time in FFXIV. It's also very well put together and a good read, but the bit about postionals being useless is SPOT ON!

Pretty much the whole post can be summed up with: "I don't like it because I get punished if I don't get it right, please change it to make it easier" with a lot of overdramatic phrasing. Extremely awkward, unnatural, bizarre, dangerous, punishing and so on. Everything that has even the slightest risk attached is listed as a complaint.

Every complaint listed is part of the of the job's design to offer a challenge for players who want to go beyond playing the basic rotation and mechanics safely. It offers the chance to optimise, to solve the puzzle of how to keep uptime, hit positionals, keep everything aligned, make the correct decision if something gets interrupted etc.
If someone doesn't enjoy that, don't play melee. If keeping a dot up without overwriting it too much or sticking to an optimised loop is seen as a good reason to dislike a class it's perhaps time to simply play something different.
The fact that ranged attacks interrupt combos while having low potency is one of the very few things I agree on as a complaint. But decision making? Keeping buffs aligned? Having to stay in melee range as a melee?

If all of these "complaints" were taken care of you'd basically have a physical ranged with occasionally melee range requirement hitting a training dummy.

[IruruCece]

Pretty sure in one of the other threads, someone mathed it out and it was a tiny percent

That's great, then people who don't want to even try shouldn't feel persecuted by the Devs for purposefully playing the job worse than a non-Savage/Ultimate raider!

[ssunny2008]

Pretty sure in one of the other threads, someone mathed it out and it was a tiny percent

Yeah, maybe if you´re stuck 24/7 behind the boss and get those 5 kenki, it might be 1% in short math. But we´re talking about NO positionals. This means a loss of 10 kenki each rotation. 10 kenki each 11 keys you get for more Shinten / Seigan, buffed Midare / Higabana or even to use your dashes to keep more uptime which lasts in more autohits / overall GCD´s.
If you don´t get that those 2 positionals and the use of those 10 kenki makes a real difference, then i don´t know. As i said before... it doesn´t matter if a skill has 10 or 100 potency. The correct use defines the gap between bad & good players. It´s not even a bad thing, since everyone can play nearly every content. But those who do their job correctly, will still shine and kill the last savage boss / ultimates even without bots or whatever. Everyone catered.
You don´t like them? Don´t play them, that´s the solution. You want them to get more meaningful? YES PLEASE! But that´s a thing that won´t happen thx to SE´s clear casual route and ppl who complain about everything.

[Nothv13]

Yeah, maybe if you´re stuck 24/7 behind the boss and get those 5 kenki, it might be 1% in short math. But we´re talking about NO positionals. This means a loss of 10 kenki each rotation. 10 kenki each 11 keys you get for more Shinten / Seigan, buffed Midare / Higabana or even to use your dashes to keep more uptime which lasts in more autohits / overall GCD´s.
If you don´t get that those 2 positionals and the use of those 10 kenki makes a real difference, then i don´t know. As i said before... it doesn´t matter if a skill has 10 or 100 potency. The correct use defines the gap between bad & good players. It´s not even a bad thing, since everyone can play nearly every content. But those who do their job correctly, will still shine and kill the last savage boss / ultimates even without bots or whatever. Everyone catered.
You don´t like them? Don´t play them, that´s the solution. You want them to get more meaningful? YES PLEASE! But that´s a thing that won´t happen thx to SE´s clear casual route and ppl who complain about everything.

And the math shows that is a very small percentage, surprisingly small.