Positionals

[ssunny2008]

Behind the abrasive elitist attitude, he's not wrong.

It sounds like that, but i´m far away from being an elitist. I do think games, especially MMORPG`s, should be for everyone. I know enough players who can´t do better and need their time to learn something. I´m completely fine with that and i still enjoy it way more to play with them than having a full hardcore elitist pro logfarming mimimi group without any sense of humour or acceptance that somebody can make a mistake.
But enough is enough. It´s not like FF14 has so much hardcore elements or whatever to offer. What Sqwall wants to have is just bs. I mean, rework FoW into no positional requirements? How does it even make sense to you lose the 10% of FoF, when you would lose pretty much the same damage when you stuck in FoF and play the boss dumb down. Just ignore them! And this goes down the road... More than enough ppl gave tips here and in the other thread or even told how to play to still do a lot of damage with less positionals. But no... it hits a brickwall.

There is so much casual-content already and SE should even continue to dumb down everything in favor of lazy players or mighty casuals?! No! Hell no! Like 98% of the the whole game can be played and finished by everyone with any class and without taking care about positionals, the rotation, whatever. You just need a bit more time if you suck really that hard.
Stop trying to steal the last 2% of enjoyment of those who want to enjoy fluent gameplay combined with a more challenging class and different boss mechanics. Such nonsense needs to stop. That´s all i want.

[Mahoukenshi]

Stop trolling with your "higher than thou" attitude ssunny2008. You are not impressing anyone with that BS.

[ssunny2008]

Stop trolling with your "higher than thou" attitude ssunny2008. You are not impressing anyone with that BS.

"Oh hi, it´s me again. I just want to spread some nonsense for thumbs up once again!"

I couldn´t care less about others and what they might think of me. I´ll say what i mean its worth to say to clearify my statements. But you seem to be really "impressed" by me, since it´s not the first time you can write a sentence which obviously just focuses on me.

[Sqwall]

"Oh hi, it´s me again. I just want to spread some nonsense for thumbs up once again!"

I couldn´t care less about others and what they might think of me. I´ll say what i mean its worth to say to clearify my statements. But you seem to be really "impressed" by me, since it´s not the first time you can write a sentence which obviously just focuses on me.

Thread derailment incoming!

I have some thick bark due to people with comments like yours. So for that Thanks!

"Impressed"... hardly!

verb
/imˈpres/
1.
make (someone) feel admiration and respect.
"they immediately impressed the judges"

I think the term you were looking for was disdain

noun
noun: disdain; plural noun: disdains
the feeling that someone or something is unworthy of one's consideration or respect; contempt.
"her upper lip curled in disdain"

Sorry that I'm to cursory for you...my apologies. I hold the evolution of monk back unreservedly. Clearly you deserve my capitulation. Thank you for your condescending nature to nurture Monk for the job's further honing.

I will return to my mediocre fulfillment while gazing upward at the divinity you possess as our orator of inclination. I await your spectacular accordance with the developers to build the constitution for what monk is to become.

I await your guidance with hushed abated breath of the noteworthy additions only you can facilitate.

[Equitable_Remedy]

Thread derailment incoming!

Ok, but then don't.

Back on topic, positionals are fun and make combat more dynamic (because there are literally more things moving around), distinguishes melee from ranged, and adds a bit of skill for getting positional bonuses in around mechanics. That being said, I'm inclined to think that True North should be part of the monk ability set rather than a role action, but that's a small nitpick.

[Dzian]

Would you be happier if True North was expanded/enhanced?
Or do you feel they are wholly without merit?

True north and positionals should be scrapped entirely.

the devs consistantly dumb down and simplify jobs in ways that make them even more dull and boring yet they insist on keeping te stupid positionals system that is boring and pointless they add nothing to gameplay.

If a samurai completely ignores positionals and just stays in one spot they'll lose a whole 5 kenki every 8 gcds or such.which equates to 20% of a 320 potency shinten (62 potency) over 8 gcds 18 seconds (give or take) 62 / 18 =3.444 potency per second which if i remember correctly is less than 0.5% of your average damage. the same goes for ninjas and dragoons. if a ninja just stays behind a boss totally ignores positionals they lose a whole 60 potency once every 30 or so seconds when they use armor crush 2 potency per second..

its not a fun or rewarding mechanic at all and should just be scrapped.

even monks with 2 charges of true north and riddle of earth can spend a ton of time completely ignoreing positionals.

they honestly add nothing noticable or even rewarding to gameplay. when they contribute for less than 0.5% of your damage.

[Satarn]

they honestly add nothing noticable or even rewarding to gameplay. when they contribute for less than 0.5% of your damage.

If they're so insignificant then you should have nothing to complain about in regard to their existence - just ignore them and let people who enjoy them do so. Not being a make or break difference in output is good for adding a bit more height to the skill ceiling, while keeping the floor where SE wants it - which is as low as possible.

[ssunny2008]

snip

In case of SAM it´s 10 kenki in one rotation and only 25 kenki are available at each rotation. You couldn´t even make use of Kaiten for Midare and Higabana without them. Then we´ve Shinten as powerful off gcd which gives as pretty decent damage boost since SAM is the only melee without those cd-based off gcd´s. Seigan is even slightly stronger. Gyoten needs 10 kenki aswell and is a really fast escape to hold uptime as long as it´s possible.
This means, those 10 kenki each rotation are very important and you´ll lose much more than those 0,5% damage if you ignore them or just play them "by accident" and only going to lose 5 kenki.

MNK relies completely on them, it´s the whole gameplay design... i see no need to argue more about that. It´s all whats left on the class and should NEVER leave it.

NIN / DRG are another thing yes. They could get ride of them on NIN and focus more on stealth or ninjutsus with internal cd, so you can´t just spam raiton or whatever. But backstabbing should be still someway important since you´re a NIN. It could be like a stackable passiv. You´ll get 1% more damage for every skill you use from behind stackable 5 times. If you attack from the side, you´ll lose 1 stack per attack. So you´re actually somehow forced to attack from behind.

DRG is actually the most boring melee in bossfights anyway. The rotation is simple, you use your gapclosers for damage and not to keep uptime. (Sometimes you do even die thx to animation stucks or mechanics like garuda in E6s.) Maintaining dragonheart is even simpler than maintaining old GL. You lost it? Press the button again. The whole kit needs some kind of rework, gapclosers should be gapclosers and not just damage off gcd´s. The kit has a soul, but it´s nothing but pressing buffs in a decent order and some cool skill animations. I wouldn´t care if they get ride of positionals on DRG, but the class needs way more stuff to care about.
On the other hand they could even use the jumps as buffs. One would bring you automatically behind the boss and buff the next 5 skills you do from behind. The 2nd jump would reposition you at the side and ofc the next 5 hits from the side would do increased damage. Those jumps shouldn´t be locked on cd, they should be created behind a ressource with a buffer, so you can adapt with them at certain mechanics without losing damage. Stuff like that would bring a bit more depth to the class, the player could always adapt and you wouldn´t waste your gapcloser on cd. You would be able to adjust as you want for more damage or more uptime. (In case of balancing just bring an internal cd on the buff, so you can´t use "from behind, from behind" all day long.)

[Seraphor]

True North.

If you don't like positionals, don't play melee?

[Payadopa]

Like 98% of the the whole game can be played and finished by everyone with any class and without taking care about positionals, the rotation, whatever. You just need a bit more time if you suck really that hard.
Stop trying to steal the last 2% of enjoyment of those who want to enjoy fluent gameplay combined with a more challenging class and different boss mechanics.

I mean, she isn't wrong. I don't envy people who start the game these days. You get this big bad villain build-up only to defeat them by pressing 1 1 1. That's the MSQ in a nutshell. And if you fail once, which I think is normal you immediately get a very easy option and the Echo. These days I wish I'd get the anti echo. Doesn't take anything away from anyone. Just give me an option that's not [make game insultingly easy].