Battle High needs to go.

[HyperiusUltima]

As much as I understand Battle High is a means for overcoming the opposition, the problem stems from Battle High granting benefits as long as you don't die. I think this should change, only to reflect who has been giving huge contributions and not some end-all be-all buff that can steamroll games. The moment a group has 5 Battle High Vs on DPS, everyone else is toast. Sure, you can burn them down, but they're difficult to kill not only because of the DPS they can do, but also the healing that's given by healers since they're going to get a lot of Assists.

The problem presented however by removing Battle High is that games will go longer. Is it worth removing the buff to only be an indicator of team contribution for games to run the clock down?

[Ixon]

Just get your own battle highs and kill their battle high's.

[Esmoire]

Just with killstreak benefits in games in general, I can see why they might seem bad to have someone who is ahead get more ahead, though the reality of not-dying being the mathematically correct way to win is not enough to condition self-preservation and to dissuade reckless action. Some kind of benefit that encourages you to not only stay alive but get a lot of kills while doing so is a nice way of supercharging psychological reward systems to get people to play better. It is no foolproof and a BH is not always indicative of good play, though good players will have them often.

There is also having to weigh the opposite outcry, of when people moan about there not being enough ways for an individual to make a big difference in 72-player PvP... which is entirely false. A player who plays well will of course make a sweeping impact with or without BH, though I think some kind of visual indicator for allies and enemies alike of who is performing well creates a lot of fun and interesting dynamics. The system that is having the same few melee DPS pulverize one team, is also the system that might, say, allow a veterans to leverage the load of someone new to PvP a little better and feel like you have a little more agency in your victory if you know how to play.

There are some general momentum problems where a winning team has a host of BHs which can lead to a more oppressive lead, though I don't think that is symptomatic with the BH system itself. Stuff like the impending changes to force freelance to break player distribution apart is a nice start, and they can look at more comeback systems if they feel they are necessary, though I regularly see teams in a dumpster at the start come around to something near the end of things so for the most part I think it's fine. I think melee are scaling too well with BH, though I think there are some lethality issues largely a result of the +15% damage on melee being unnecessary.

[Miminming]

Dont remove it, but maybe you can give ot to people who snatch the ground too... killing give to much reward in the new pvp, and ninja too op

[Ixon]

Dont remove it, but maybe you can give ot to people who snatch the ground too... killing give to much reward in the new pvp, and ninja too op

But.. it's PVP. Player VS Player. The main goal is to fight each other, everything else is a side objective. Sitting on nodes for 10+min is boring as hell.

[Rilasha]

This rendition of Battle High is what I think really is the problem (disregarding the change of premades to 4 and the GC sync stuff). The old Battle High required you to get four kills (then eight for Fever) without dying to receive a buff to damage done. You lost it all if you died once and had to start again. People easily got around it by killing the person, making them lose their damage boost. This also was a deterrent for having someone extend too far and getting too greedy for kills.

The new Battle High system allows you to stack it without killing anyone, with 2 points for an assist, while killing gives 10. I could assist 50 kills without a kill myself and get Battle High V and only cast Fire once on them each time. It is also coupled with the fact that if you die, you only lose half the damage boost that you had pre-death. So High V lowers to High II on death, which still gives a boost. The assist system allows for more Battle Highs across a team that is destroying others, which then leads into destroying the other players even more than before. There's no serious repercussion for dying if you only lose a portion of the boost compared to the whole boost.

With the old system, you could have one person with Fever and some pocket healers do outstanding damage and carry, but now that everyone on their team ALSO has access to the buff, it just leads to more snowball, even if you kill the person who is contributing the most.

Though there are some strength problems with some melee DPS that need to really be addressed (hello, ninja), this is what some of the general problems with new Battle High are.

[Nalien]

The tank/melee innate damage/defense buff needs to go. It was needed in 4.5 when they added it, but the recent changes to PvP and Battle High make it ridiculously overkill.

Only change I'd like to see to Battle High, given Yoshida has said they're planning to change the value of points earned from kills, is for points earned from kills to be based on peoples Battle High Meter. A basic example, but the amount one loses from dying on that meter, should be the value earned in objective points. That makes killing people with Battle High V very lucrative, while farming the same <10 Battle High points players over and over is practically worthless.

[OskarXCI]

The tank/melee innate damage/defense buff needs to go. It was needed in 4.5 when they added it, but the recent changes to PvP and Battle High make it ridiculously overkill

Maybe remove the damage buff but don't remove the defense buff.

If you remove the defense buff, people will go back to only playing as casters/ranged, like how it was before 4.5.

Consider playing as melee/tank yourself to make it harder for your opponents to kill you.

[Lindwyrm]

Never let this thread die. MAYBE it'd be fine if it was only tied to damage, but the fact that tanks are punished for wading into the thick of combat, and rewarded for playing extremely passive and just sniping kills? RDPS is punished for trying to use its AoEs and rewarded for sitting at max range just throwing out single-target? Melee DPS not only goes from kinda tanky steady damage to one-shot assassins, they also heal about 3 players' worth of damage with their combo??

It really needs to not boost healing, and the melee and tank healing stuff not be directly tied to damage. It encourages such a passive playstyle that just isn't healthy.

[Divinemights]

Never let this thread die. MAYBE it'd be fine if it was only tied to damage, but the fact that tanks are punished for wading into the thick of combat, and rewarded for playing extremely passive and just sniping kills? RDPS is punished for trying to use its AoEs and rewarded for sitting at max range just throwing out single-target? Melee DPS not only goes from kinda tanky steady damage to one-shot assassins, they also heal about 3 players' worth of damage with their combo??

It really needs to not boost healing, and the melee and tank healing stuff not be directly tied to damage. It encourages such a passive playstyle that just isn't healthy.

Are you raise your voice for those Ranges who always stand in meele range for no apparent reason, do not pay attention to the surrounding and still mindless button smashing even target already used Retaliation?

or...

Are you trying to complains for those Tanks who do not know how to set up kills for the team and just stand there still thinks they are the Tanks from Stormblood?

or..

Are you explain about meeles players of taking advantages from above two types because they are feeding them?