PLD IS NOT BROKEN

[Deathgiver]

A lot of you are missing some really basic points when it comes to this topic.
1) How much enmity you generate PLD vs MRD is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if you generate more hate than the DDs. Both tanks can do this well with all current content.
2) Survivability is also irrelevant. As long as you never drop below 1 hp you've survived as much as is necessary. Again btoth tanks can do this.
3) Speed actually makes most fights safer. It reduces the odds of the boss spamming hard hitting AOE attacks that can potentially cause wipes, number of time spawned adds, and allows your best DDs (MNK and BLM) to put up higher dps by finishing the fight before they run out of mp. This area is why War has such a big advantage.

Add to that the fact that a WAR actually becomes better as a tank the more damage they do through both hate management and self healing under Rampage and maybe you can understand why people might want some drastic changes.

[syntaxlies]

A lot of you are missing some really basic points when it comes to this topic.
1) How much enmity you generate PLD vs MRD is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if you generate more hate than the DDs. Both tanks can do this well with all current content.
2) Survivability is also irrelevant. As long as you never drop below 1 hp you've survived as much as is necessary. Again btoth tanks can do this.
3) Speed actually makes most fights safer. It reduces the odds of the boss spamming hard hitting AOE attacks that can potentially cause wipes, number of time spawned adds, and allows your best DDs (MNK and BLM) to put up higher dps by finishing the fight before they run out of mp. This area is why War has such a big advantage.

Add to that the fact that a WAR actually becomes better as a tank the more damage they do through both hate management and self healing under Rampage and maybe you can understand why people might want some drastic changes.

your forgetting that pld does not live up to the ultimate tank concept that SE told us about.

[Deathgiver]

your forgetting that pld does not live up to the ultimate tank concept that SE told us about.

Personally I think, if you only factor in durability and hate, that PLD is great as a tank. The lower HP is made up by some very potent self preservation skills. The issue is that the party DPS suffers significantly with a PLD in party vs a WAR, especially when you have a lot of adds that need to be dealt with. Increasing the duration and/or proc. rate and/or potency of the defence down debuff would go a long ways towards making PLD more desirable for single target content by upping the dps of the rest of the party, but still doesn't address the speed difference whne there are multiple adds to deal with.

[syntaxlies]

Personally I think, if you only factor in durability and hate, that PLD is great as a tank. The lower HP is made up by some very potent self preservation skills. The issue is that the party DPS suffers significantly with a PLD in party vs a WAR, especially when you have a lot of adds that need to be dealt with. Increasing the duration and/or proc. rate and/or potency of the defence down debuff would go a long ways towards making PLD more desirable for single target content by upping the dps of the rest of the party, but still doesn't address the speed difference whne there are multiple adds to deal with.

i dont know why pld doesn't have a stance option guard/attack. low dps in guard mode with a focus on blocking.

[Valmonte]

i don't know what the hell this PLD, thing is but its not a paladin. the same could be said about WAR/DRG/BRD
in all FF titles Warrior is a use it all class that has average tanking abillity's. Dragoon is an over juiced lancer just because it can jump and wear the DRG AF doesn't mean it is. the DEV team was on some powerfull hallucinogenics when they made the BRD, probably listing to disco as well.

they didn't give us our classic jobs, they gave us a rundown mess. and we sucked it up because it looks like what it most certainly is not.

[Arcell]

i don't know what the hell this PLD, thing is but its not a paladin. the same could be said about WAR/DRG/BRD
in all FF titles Warrior is a use it all class that has average tanking abillity's. Dragoon is an over juiced lancer just because it can jump and wear the DRG AF doesn't mean it is. the DEV team was on some powerfull hallucinogenics when they made the BRD, probably listing to disco as well.

they didn't give us our classic jobs, they gave us a rundown mess. and we sucked it up because it looks like what it most certainly is not.

Correction, they didn't blatantly copy/paste the jobs from other titles and put their own spin on them. Something that has happened before in FF. I'm glad they didn't just pull them directly from FF titles, FFXIV needs some things to differentiate itself.

[SwordCoheir]

Correction, they didn't blatantly copy/paste the jobs from other titles and put their own spin on them. Something that has happened before in FF. I'm glad they didn't just pull them directly from FF titles, FFXIV needs some things to differentiate itself.

I can get behind that, the fact that they have to adhere to stigmas only limits job creativity and development on their part. I think that's the major reason they purposely introduced new classes as the main jobs in the initial implementation of FFXIV in order to try and break away from those old standardized stigmas, that and jobs and classes don't always carry over from the console into MMO's well making it even harder to try and develop the jobs for.

[Valmonte]

Correction, they didn't blatantly copy/paste the jobs from other titles and put their own spin on them. Something that has happened before in FF. I'm glad they didn't just pull them directly from FF titles, FFXIV needs some things to differentiate itself.

then don't copy and paste what its not, its not a Warrior its what Marauder Was/Could have been, its not a Paladin its a Heavy Mage that can sword&board, its not a Dragoon its an OP Lancer. Every thing that defines these Jobs can not be found.

you call it a twist, i call it a disgrace to the franchise and fans worldwide who where expecting the classics to make a reappearance.

[Aceofspades]

LOLS!! please do not talk to me about comparisons between war and pld, i have been doing comparisons since the jobs came out. and it basicly breaks down to this :

WAR = offensive tank, deals massive damage and is capable of minor HP conservation and slightly higher HP regeneration.

PLD = Deffensive tank, allthough it dose very little damage, It can generate ample hate through simple vokes, combos, and aoe buffs/heals. Capable of deflecting a much larger percentage of damage then its WAR counterpart as well as puting out more reliable and constant heals it is a much safer tank. When operated to its full potential , PLD can reduce the amount of healers needed in a party in order to allow for DPS focused jobs.

overall, WAR adds speed where saftey isnt a concern, and PLD add saftey where survival is a concern. that and WAR dose have better crowd controll making it optimal for tanking adds (like in the princess fight, or skeles on batrall) or possable PL situations. Both tanks have their perks and down sides, but when it comes to overall survivability (wich in my opinion is #1 on the list of shit tanks should be able to do) PLD is undoubtly the best tank in the game. If you are dieing before a WAR , get out of the AF gear add some def and vit. if you have already done this , learn to use your abilities wiser. PLD is capable of deflecting 100% of any type of damage taken, keeping MP moderatly full and HP moderatly full. Ofcourse you will never deflect 100% of the damage, but if your abilities are used correctly and not just spamed when ever you get the opertunity to button mash it, then PLD take FAR less damage then war. Not sure why this fact is even up for debate.

[Gao]

PLD is undoubtly the best tank in the game.

Please clarify on how you can back up this statement? Not saying that one is better then the other just want an input on why you think this! =) Didn't see anything about how or what they need to do to be considered the best tank, so far I just read from what you have told us is that "People just needs to know how to use PLD correctly"