MSQ Needs Further Condensing

[Rosenstrauch]

Nah, that was all some one I won't mention, but he was the guy we wound up fighting anyway. He sucked them up in order to power himself.

We used white auracite to kill Igeyorhm, and were forced to let Lahabrea get away—we only had enough for one Ascian, not two. But Lahabrea wasn't quick enough, and Thordan betrayed him, feeding his soul to Nidhogg's (second) eye in Ascalon.

Emet-Selch wasn't even introduced at that point—his first appearance is late in Stormblood. And his death, too, involved white auracite. Specifically, Thancred broke up the piece Urianger brought with for the fight into shards and impaled him with them. There's even an item in-game referencing this: The token dropped from clearing Hades EX is explicitly one of the shards used to bind him in place.

[Sauteed]

Perhaps you should re-watch some cut-scenes because you seem to be misremembering details.

Igeyorhm was killed by us using White Auracite and Nidhogg's eye
Lahabrea was the one who was 'sucked up' to power someone else.
Emet-Selch was killed by us using White Auracite and the excess primordial light within our body.

Nah I won't, I've got WAY more important stuff to do like argue the point of -needlessly- excessive MSQ time could be trimmed. And the cutscenes aren't entertaining enough for me to rewatch anyhow. Admittedly I started skipping them after the first time I did them years ago and the newer SHB sucked so bad (in my opinion) they were insta gibbed. I gave the 5.4 cutscenes a chance, and glad I did. Merlwyb gave great speeches.

[WhiteArchmage]

Perhaps you should re-watch some cut-scenes because you seem to be misremembering details.

Igeyorhm was killed by us using White Auracite and Nidhogg's eye
Lahabrea was the one who was 'sucked up' to power someone else.
Emet-Selch was killed by us using White Auracite and the excess primordial light within our body.

And in 4.x there WAS no Ascian (except...uh... in the backstory for Eureka and got dealt off off-screen), so we've in fact used White Auracite against all Ascians we've faced since its introduction, it's just that Lahabrea and Igeyorhm surprised us when we only had 1 on us.

Nah I won't, I've got WAY more important stuff to do like argue the point of -needlessly- excessive MSQ time could be trimmed. And the cutscenes aren't entertaining enough for me to rewatch anyhow. Admittedly I started skipping them after the first time I did them years ago and the newer SHB sucked so bad (in my opinion) they were insta gibbed. I gave the 5.4 cutscenes a chance, and glad I did. Merlwyb gave great speeches.

Complains about story details, doesn't watch the story... Sure, Jan.

[Sauteed]

Complains about story details, doesn't watch the story... Sure, Jan.

No i watched it, got bored with it. Didn't watch it repeatedly, and won't watch it again because it is boring. And the ShB story is in my opinion the worst, and earned itself some instant skipping when the cut scenes start. I will be purchasing story skips for all future characters for ShB btw if I'm still playing by then. Just that unenjoyable.

[Ammokkx]

There's a difference between synching down to do a FATE on your 80's or whatever else like a dungeon and helping someone get to semi relevant content like gazelleskin/dragonskin maps. Or even helping them level their crafts up with leves. They can grind them out but have to rely on the marketboard to get the items, or other friends to farm materials that have access to later areas. That isn't a "HUGE" issue with crafting, but wanting to do something other than some fates in northern Thanalan or some similar area, is not a bad thing to want to do.

...?????

I still don't see why you can't do any of what you're suggesting here on your main with the friend. My synced comment was more in reference to how you seemed to want to be on an equal playing field with someone you reccommend the game to, but again, they would be having to go through the MSQ anyway and doing it at the same time keeps you on-pace. In fact, I'd argue you'd be helping them "get to semi relevant content" a lot faster by just using your main than you would by starting up an alt for some reason.

Well ok then. Back to the meat of my point, there is no denying a very large portion of the plot point about white auricite is 100% filler time waste. I haven't read a developer say "this is time waste", but I have read some one who quoted them saying they literally made some of these quests to keep people busy during the down time between 2.0 and 3.0 with a goal of 15 minutes per quest. Which is basically saying "we made these quests in a way to keep you busy and paying your subscription". I'll pay my subscription and play the game if I'm having fun. I don't generally have fun doing laps around a map wondering if I'm being kept busy on purpose. I find enjoyment in the other filler content, like housing tho. That's 100% filler, and it's not "bad". Needs some help, but not in the actual house department. The Getting a house/ supply/and decorating process needs help. Floating/etc that is what could be trimmed from the experience.

W-

what quests do you think they cut out?

There was this entire chain of Mor Dhona quests that were like "huhhey thanks for helping out but we need another material" and when you handed it in the guy want "huhhey thanks for helping out but we need another material" for like 7 quests at a time. Yeah, that was gigantic filler content and they cut that out. The stuff that actually remains in the game all has to do with actual plot, whether it be plot directly related to the ongoing primal threat or plot dealing with the side story of a character, like Tataru.

Housing isn't "filler" content, it's side content. Filler is something you're forced to go through to artificially pad game time, and I'm gonna be honest, I think they've just about removed every pure filler quest in the game. The ones that remain have a lot more ambiguity as to their filler nature and you could pose a fair argument for them needing to be there.

I don't think you have a very good grip on the MSQ, my dude.

[Sauteed]

...?????

I still don't see why you can't do any of what you're suggesting here on your main with the friend. My synced comment was more in reference to how you seemed to want to be on an equal playing field with someone you reccommend the game to, but again, they would be having to go through the MSQ anyway and doing it at the same time keeps you on-pace. In fact, I'd argue you'd be helping them "get to semi relevant content" a lot faster by just using your main than you would by starting up an alt for some reason.



W-

what quests do you think they cut out?

There was this entire chain of Mor Dhona quests that were like "huhhey thanks for helping out but we need another material" and when you handed it in the guy want "huhhey thanks for helping out but we need another material" for like 7 quests at a time. Yeah, that was gigantic filler content and they cut that out. The stuff that actually remains in the game all has to do with actual plot, whether it be plot directly related to the ongoing primal threat or plot dealing with the side story of a character, like Tataru.

Housing isn't "filler" content, it's side content. Filler is something you're forced to go through to artificially pad game time, and I'm gonna be honest, I think they've just about removed every pure filler quest in the game. The ones that remain have a lot more ambiguity as to their filler nature and you could pose a fair argument for them needing to be there.

I don't think you have a very good grip on the MSQ, my dude.

Trust me I'm not your dude, or your friend. No problem admitting I may be mistaken on plot points either (not gonna shy away from saying they're pretty boring plot points either), but the fact remains I'm absolutely of the belief the MSQ needs further pruning.
I got a good enough grip on the MSQ I did it right before they trimmed it with a character, and leveled on specifically after they trimmed it to see what got trimmed. I didn't set a stop watch, I just played some each day after I got off work, and the take away was..
They trimmed out 20 quests and made the Crystal Tower series mandatory. I kind of chuckled about it, I wasn't mad or upset. I was just wondering why they left in so much that could have been taken out as well, and made CT series mandatory. It's ludicrous it took this many years for them to address the length of time between 2.0 and 3.0 and the result was maybe a net gain or 3-5 minutes of a person's time being trimmed off? Maybe more if they insta queued into CT after doing all the cut scene'ing and running around involved with that series. Sure I'm stupid and a failure at being intimately versed with XIV lore, but too much is too much "dude".

Outside of the immediate topic of msq needing further pruning (which I am 100% for), reasons why I won't watch any of cut scenes is the dialogue of most of the characters is just bad. Most of the stuff going on doesn't matter either.. I'm glad a lot of it is there tho, because that is a huge drawing point for a lot of people. But if you can't reasonably see there's a lot of garbage in the way of that stuff people legitimately find interesting, it's not me that needs to get in touch with MSQ plot points or whatever else. I put with having to go through it, on top of various non "intended" gameplay issues like marketboard bots/scammers/lag issues/etc but of all elements within the game design's control a little trimming of the msq would be probably the most beneficial of their time, as well as letting players get a little more area to explore/ do stuff in a little earlier.. not advocating day 1 access to The Lochs or anything like that, but sooner than trudging through all of ARR and a hefty time in Heavensward before they can start getting around a bit more.

[Ammokkx]

I was just wondering why they left in so much that could have been taken out as well, and made CT series mandatory.

because

The stuff that actually remains in the game all has to do with actual plot, whether it be plot directly related to the ongoing primal threat or plot dealing with the side story of a character, like Tataru.

as for why CT is mandatory, if you'd bothered to actually watch the 5.3 cutscenes, the ending of 5.3 literally can not function unless the ending of the crystal tower raid is reached. Local best boi needs to be taking his nap or else we can't wake him up.

I got a good enough grip on the MSQ I did it right before they trimmed it with a character, and leveled on specifically after they trimmed it to see what got trimmed.

...

It's ludicrous it took this many years for them to address the length of time between 2.0 and 3.0 and the result was maybe a net gain or 3-5 minutes of a person's time being trimmed off? Maybe more if they insta queued into CT after doing all the cut scene'ing and running around involved with that series. Sure I'm stupid and a failure at being intimately versed with XIV lore, but too much is too much "dude".

Listen, man, I don't know what to tell you, but you've admitted to not even watching the story of ShB because you think it's "dogshit". Everyone's entitled to your opinion, but if you're going to be this disinterested in the going-ons of one of the game's big selling points, you're not an authority on the subject.

Quests are there because they're telling a story. The ones who didn't advance the story got cut. It's as simple as that. Besides, if each quest took 15 minutes as you say, and they trimmed 20 quests, that's 300 minutes of time cut out, or 5 hours. That's quite a fair amount of filler quests to be cut.

I'm also not asking you to be well versed in the lore, but you fail to have a basic grip on the simple facts of the story laid out in front of you. I'm not asking you what the 6 elements of Eorzae are and which align with Umbral and Astral. I'm asking you "how did 3/4 ascians die on-screen" because it directly relates to a point you were making.

They cut what unquestionably needed to be cut. That's the long and short of it. To argue they needed to cut more, you need to argue why some sections of the story should be cut out. A story you, I'm sorry to say, don't have nearly enough of a solid grip on to make any kind of judgement call.

[TheMightyMollusk]

there is no denying a very large portion of the plot point about white auricite is 100% filler time waste.

A vital plot device continually necessary for dealing with Ascians does not qualify as either filler or wasting time.

[Iscah]

what bugs me is "streamlining" the msq then making the raid series mandatory so the "streamlining" which was absolutely necessary and needed enough according to SE themselves that they did it got un-streamlined and now takes the same if not more time to complete

People keep making this argument and I don't get it.

For story purposes the alliance raids HAD to be made mandatory, even if they left 2.X as it originally was.

So your options are:

1. Full running time of the original 2.X MSQ plus mandatory CT

2. Condensed running time of the updated 2.X MSQ plus mandatory CT

You cannot possibly argue that the streamlining of the MSQ made no impact on the amount of time required.

[Sauteed]

because



as for why CT is mandatory, if you'd bothered to actually watch the 5.3 cutscenes, the ending of 5.3 literally can not function unless the ending of the crystal tower raid is reached. Local best boi needs to be taking his nap or else we can't wake him up.




Listen, man, I don't know what to tell you, but you've admitted to not even watching the story of ShB because you think it's "dogshit". Everyone's entitled to your opinion, but if you're going to be this disinterested in the going-ons of one of the game's big selling points, you're not an authority on the subject.

Quests are there because they're telling a story. The ones who didn't advance the story got cut. It's as simple as that. Besides, if each quest took 15 minutes as you say, and they trimmed 20 quests, that's 300 minutes of time cut out, or 6 hours. That's quite a fair amount of filler quests to be cut.

I'm also not asking you to be well versed in the lore, but you fail to have a basic grip on the simple facts of the story laid out in front of you. I'm not asking you what the 6 elements of Eorzae are and which align with Umbral and Astral. I'm asking you "how did 3/4 ascians die on-screen" because it directly relates to a point you were making.

They cut what unquestionably needed to be cut. That's the long and short of it. To argue they needed to cut more, you need to argue why some sections of the story should be cut out. A story you, I'm sorry to say, don't have nearly enough of a solid grip on to make any kind of judgement call.

It's comical you say I don't have authority to make a judgement call on something, when you don't have authority to tell me I do or don't. I also didn't use a swear word, so the quotation marks aren't needed around your own defining of my view point. I skipped a lot of the cut scenes because they are just run on and ultimately in the way and could be more concise, and less in the way. Which is a MASSIVE reason why they should be trimmed down. My opinion might seem like dreadful to someone who gets excited to watch Game of Thrones or whatever is hip with the younguns but, reality is if I'm paying to play this game, and I feel like something needs to be addressed, I've been given a forum to share/discuss/be as valid/be as stupid/ as I can be and I've got just as much authority as someone who could recite every word from the MSQ and all it's little lore niblets. I don't feel like XIV makes wise use of it's available resources in terms of story/lore/capabilities. I don't need to be a walking Encyclopedia Eorzea to state I feel the MSQ needs massive pruning still.