Prohibit class/job changes inside dungeons

[Tibian]

Just remove speed runs they are kind of pointless anyway, of course this won't stop class stacking people will still go after the faster way to clear a dungeon.

There are several things they can do:-

1:- What the OP suggests, lock a player to the class they enter the instance as (this would actual be useful for the Job Quests also, seeing as people managed a way around that)

2:- Give each class an aura, meaning a more varied party make up will ensure better party buffs. (this would probably require removing strength in numbers and comradery) - Aura's can not stack from two of the same class.

3:- Remove strength in number and comradery if 3 or more of one class type is detected.

I thought about point two as a suggestion earlier on before I posted this. In the end I opted against it. If you increase Ranged accuracy via Bard, people will just stack ranged. If you increase MP regeneration via BLM, people will just stack BLM.

If bullet point two is to work, these bonuses need to be attributed to non-similar classes. Ie: Increased MP regeneration should be attached to WAR. Increased Ranged accuracy should be attached to BLM. Increased Defense should be attached to WHM. So on and so forth. This encourages a dynamic group makeup, but still would mean people could go "Tank/Healer/WAR/BLM/BLM/BLM/BLM/BLM." It also mandates that you should have a party of "every" class. I don't want to see a static one dimensional party of "PLD/WAR/BLM/BRD/WHM/MNK/DRG/Random Job," although it would still be more desirable than job stacking. Party makeup should be flexible. A group consisting of PLD/WAR/BLM/BLM/WHM/WHM/MNK/DRG should be just as capable of doing something as WAR/WAR/WHM/WHM/DRG/BRD/MNK/DRG. Ultimately I still decided against this method.

Bullet point three is also a suggestion, but I am not sure the removed bonuses would matter that much. I know on Coincounter it might cause an issue... but other fights I can't see this as a viable option.

Which still leaves point one as the most probable option for fixing classism and exclusions.

I like your ideas and suggestions though. Just needs a bit more fleshing out.

[Jinko]

I thought about point two as a suggestion earlier on before I posted this. In the end I opted against it. If you increase Ranged accuracy via Bard, people will just stack ranged. If you increase MP regeneration via BLM, people will just stack BLM.

Even if the buff is not stackable ?

It also mandates that you should have a party of "every" class. I don't want to see a static one dimensional party of "PLD/WAR/BLM/BRD/WHM/MNK/DRG/Random Job," although it would still be more desirable than job stacking.

Well lets not forget that in future more classes will become available lending new aura's and play styles and diversity to party mechanics.

Bullet point three is also a suggestion, but I am not sure the removed bonuses would matter that much. I know on Coincounter it might cause an issue... but other fights I can't see this as a viable option.

Well that's a balancing issue then isn't it, its down to SE to make fights more dependant on that bonus, so if it were taken away people would think twice.

Which is kind of my whole point with the aura's per class, as i said though I'm not really a fan of punishing players, I think it would be better to reward them for making a diverse party.

[Jinko]

Yea I'm not a fan of punishing them either, I think the current party buff system is kind of rubbish to say the least, I have started another thread as to not high-jack this one.

[SynysterBlitz]

All I get out of OP is that he is QQing.. like seriously.. I am sorry but why should we be limited to what we can do?? because you're to lazy to level another job that will increase your teams overall effectiveness..

I love being able to swap jobs, allows me to shine at 2 roles instead of one.. and there will always be the best setup for every content.. so people will still stack jobs cause thats a community driven aspect.. If you do not wish to do this, then by all means form a static that consists of 8 ppl who only have 1 job and good luck..

Don't try and limit the rest of us, cause you can't handle it nor find time to level another job.. Ive been working fulltime for years.. and I have all 50's so thats not an excuse.. it takes hours a day to get 50.. hell a weekend of leveling..

[Enfarious]

You know, and I may have just not seen them all, but, if classes locked (not jobs you can still mnk > pug > mnk and what have you) AND there were sections of a dungeon that had to be cleared for full drops, not speed runs, but rather more like toto-rak in that you have to clear multiple sections to reach the "real" boss.
Unlike toto-rak having each section infested with mobs w/ resistances to different things:
Section 1: mobs absorb magic, strong to piercing, weak to blunt
Section 2: mobs immune to slashing, strong to blunt, weak to peircing
and so on, for let's see, to cover all classes in a fairish way, 5 sections should be plenty
You can optimize parties all you want, but you'll need at least 1 of each dmg type to clear fast, there goes class stacking.
It's no longer a matter of <20mins for last chest(let it be an achievement w/e)
It's now about surving the hordes of mobs that your BLM can't always nuke down, or you MRD can't effectively tank because mobs are immune to slashing dmg...

Derailing class stacking isn't that hard, it's just a matter of making content that requires variety in a party, and for the inevitable "what if the whm/blm/pld/w\e dc's" allowing class changes but not discipline changes would probably be a bit better. So you go in as a DoW you will stay DoW but you can change freely between them, this really only aleviates the stacking issue a bit since you could still go w/ 4 DoW and 4DoM and they switch to what's useful atm, but it still helps a bit.

Since the general tone of everything on these here forums is against class stacking and speed running rewards, not saying don't make speed doable, just don't reward people for it. If you can run a raid in 13 mins good on, you'll get more in than me in any period of time and thus have more opportunities to get drops, but don't punish me because my diverse group takes 28 mins for the same run w/ the same result except the time because we wanted to play jobs we actually enjoy.

Also don't get me wrong, I'm all for trying to out parse people, I'm all for getting the best gear out, and I'm all for bragging rights, hell make dungeon run like BCNMs in XI announce the best run time or w/e, but I shouldn't be punished for not being the fastest group to clear something, except things being timed which is reasonable I shouldn't get 22 hrs to clear a dungeon but again shouldn't be required to beat a certain time just to get the final chest. Think Nyzul or BCNM 15 mins for 5 floors or 29 mins the result was the same, you get w/e would drop for the clear because you cleared it not cause your time was better than avg.

Edit: I don't mean I want Nyzul or BCNM, just using it as an example of what I mean by time limits.

[HiirNoivl]

You know, and I may have just not seen them all, but, if classes locked (not jobs you can still mnk > pug > mnk and what have you) AND there were sections of a dungeon that had to be cleared for full drops, not speed runs, but rather more like toto-rak in that you have to clear multiple sections to reach the "real" boss.

This is more reasonable. And I think we're going to get something like that in Crystal Tower.

I don't know if our handicapped server can handle this kind of complex long running content. That's why there's so much copy paste in the content we're getting. I'm not surprised if for Garuda, we'll be hiding in Safe Spots again. (Uh oh! Here comes the Big Attack, pop lolSentinal.)

I think 2.0 will offer much better challenges with regard to content.

[Enfarious]

I'm willing to bet they've learned from this horrid mistake, and from the combination of FFXI as a learning tool, this mistake, and the feedback from all of us.
I will trust SE one more again, they've made a few mistakes recently, but they did back in the 90's too and they managed to recover from those, hell even FFXIII-2 was a substantial improvement, I wasn't pissed when I pre-ordered it w/ the hardcover guide, I trust this will manage to make the pre-ordered CE worth more than just the little leatherbound journal and the security key that I already had one of from XI.

[Deltara]

I think that job party buffs or "auras" as it seems to be catching on is one of the best ideas to ever come out of the forums.

[Akryon]

I think that job party buffs or "auras" as it seems to be catching on is one of the best ideas to ever come out of the forums.

Indeed. Think about the Role Bonuses from FFXIII. COM gives a damage boost to itself and allies, SEN gives damage reduction and so on. The only thing that should be different in FFXIV is that they shouldn't be stackable like they are in FFXIII to encourage job diversity.

As long as the buffs aren't too specific (i.e. BLM shouldn't just increase magic damage - it should do something that benefits a wide array of jobs) it could work exceptionally well.

[Rukkirii]

Very interesting suggestion here! We made sure to pass along your discussion, suggestions and ideas to Yoshida to get his thoughts. He told us that for 2.0 they are discussing on imposing some restrictions on class/jobs (or the ability to change once you have entered) on certain raids/dungeons. He reiterated that these restrictions would not be set for all raids/dungeons, however.

PS. I apologize for the wait!