Developers : Healer design mentality needs to change

[kidalutz]

Just going to point out that if they followed all three of your "ideas" that nobody would be healing chaos, more damage, and less healing power, with nerfed OGCD heals would make it so easy to lose a tank that nobody would get anywhere and t would slow dungeouns to a crawl. This really looks more like a case of I didn't think about long term impact vs. instant gratification and sounds more like three random ideas with darts thrown at them. Farthermore killing things as a healer out n the world and storyline already feels like a tedious chore than a fun leveling experience.

[RitsukoSonoda]

I'd go out on a limb and say the role system itself needs a change in mentality cause to me it feels like the following.

Healer = DPS that can also heal ppl
Tank = DPS that doesn't go splat when an enemy sneezes on them.
DPS = Squishy person that makes slightly bigger numbers.

[linayar]

I'd go out on a limb and say the role system itself needs a change in mentality cause to me it feels like the following.

Healer = DPS that can also heal ppl
Tank = DPS that doesn't go splat when an enemy sneezes on them.
DPS = Squishy person that makes slightly bigger numbers.

Unless you dynamically change solo content to reflect the role (add in NPCs to do the role that you're not or change the clear scenario per role), then every role needs to be a damage dealer at heart because combat is based on defeating your enemy via damage.

Well, I guess the alternative is to not have solo content and force grouping for all contents.

[Payadopa]

Idk, I've played PLD, DRK and GNB. All of them feel pretty different, even if they perform the same general function.

I think they feel pretty much the same. Granted, I can only speak of Paladin and Gunbreaker but Gunbreaker so far is just a PLD without a should but a regen. That's it. It looks nice, sure, but so far all abilities are pretty much identical.

[Bsrking5]

Unless you dynamically change solo content to reflect the role (add in NPCs to do the role that you're not or change the clear scenario per role), then every role needs to be a damage dealer at heart because combat is based on defeating your enemy via damage.

Well, I guess the alternative is to not have solo content and force grouping for all contents.

I dont see why not for 6.0 no more solo MSQ instances unless its those RP ones with fixed stats. the role quest already kindof do it and they could just double down on that. The MSQ is basically the only solo content anyways.

[linayar]

I dont see why not for 6.0 no more solo MSQ instances unless its those RP ones with fixed stats. the role quest already kindof do it and they could just double down on that. The MSQ is basically the only solo content anyways.

I mean, it could work, I suppose, but I don't see them not having solo quests. And even without solo quests, going through certain ARR zones (at least) while leveling could be easier if you can deal damage and just kill your enemies.

[Semirhage]

So give healers an actual rotation for their GCD heals. Combos and procs that actually matter and are worth using. A lot of DPS and tank classes have resources which accumulate through the use of abilities and are used for more powerful attacks, why can't healers have something similar? WHM's lilies accumulate completely passively, SCH fills their gauge with a single button dedicated to that purpose. AST's cards are the most engaging healer class mechanic but honestly the buffs seem fairly inconsequential.

That's one solution, yes. I don't object to it. My objection is to people who insist merely flipping the script without redesigning the embarrassingly skimpy GCD offerings the three healers have would make playing them fun. My opinion is that the healer GCD kits aren't significantly more engaging than their current damage kits.

I object to that "just force us to GCD heal" line of thinking so strongly because that's exactly what Square ruined the current healers trying to do. Now, they didn't do it successfully because they aren't luminaries when it comes to healer design, and almost comically their slashes to DPS and beefing of the healing abilities made skilled healers spend even more time dealing damage with a more boring DPS kit. People hate the current style of DoT -> 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1. I agree. "Forcing" healers to spend "the majority" of their GCDs on heals as-is would be soooooo different. HoT -> 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1...

[shao32]

Idk, I've played PLD, DRK and GNB. All of them feel pretty different, even if they perform the same general function.

I have played all tanks and they are pretty similar betwen them, not at the same level of the healers but they are close enough, for example in the defensive department we have:

- All tanks having rampart.
- Sentinel, vengeance variant with same effect and recast.
- Short CD (Sheltron,TBN,ect) that fullfill the same role in all of them.
- AOE mitigation even having heart of light and dark misionary being the exactly same skill but diferent icon, animation.
- An extra niche CD (except PLD)
- A single target shield/mitigation for your friends.
- A self heal CD (ecxcept DRK)

they are almost the same in his mitigation gameplay having the same modus operandi on all of them with the sole exception of a niche skill that make a slight diferency and thats all.
On the dps department they are more different with PLD and GNB being more unique but at the same time you can see they have some obvious similarities for example:

- All of them thave the same 2 step aoe combo with 3 of them having a 3º gauge move (decimate, quietus, fated circle) and they diferenciate mostly for the rate of this last skill and some oGCD, with PLD having requiem-cast window instead.
- They all have the same gap closer with WAR being slightly diferent.
- 3 of them have inner release type of mechanic as big burst mechanic, nothing more to say here.
- 2 of them have no mercy buff window

So in resume tanks have to much similarities in skills and how they operate between them with WAR and DRK basically being clones, or better say branches of marauder since in 5.0 DRK is a oversimplified WAR that have a "use all your oGCD" window every 60s. Compared to the DPS gameplay diversity tank diversity is laugable, is not as bad as our Healer friends but we have been hit hard too and i hope in 6.0 they make more effort on enchance diversity betwen all tanks being WAR and specially DRK the ones that get the most changes and improvements to make them more unique.

[Gemina]

Healers in FFXIV are impossible to salvage because of the dumb battle design based on one-shot gimmicks, making the concept of healing worthless. If you want to play healer, play another game (or pvp)

Salvaging the healers entails they are broken, or unplayable. That's not the case. There is a dissatisfaction present for sure, but that doesn't mean they all need reworks from the ground up. They function perfectly in all content, but the drawback to playing this role is DPSing situations are not very engaging, and this makes up a lot of time for healers because they do not need to be healing full-time.

The healer role is an anomaly in this system. The answer isn't as simple as giving them more to do DPS-wise because healers will inevitably tunnel-vision as a result. However, the answer also isn't pumping up the healing requirements for virtually the same reason why they can't be given true DPS rotations or mechanics. Healers need the most margin for error because they have to correct their mistakes, as well as those of their teammates. Unfortunately as a result of this, if everyone is playing mistake-free and optimal, this gives the healer little to do other than 1,1,1,1,1 until an ogcd is needed to bring the tank or group back to sustainable HP levels.

Part of me wants to say that last statement is all hogwash, and wants to believe that players would adapt to either more DPS skills, or increased healing requirements. Then I hop into a NM raid where a DPS player or one of the healers go down because they were not topped up to survive an unavoidable, and then they stay down since the healer is making no effort to raise the fallen players. I really wish this was a strawman argument; or even a really rare occurrence. It happens far too often though, and I am quite sure the devs are aware of it.

[Hyperia]

My biggest issue with healers in XIV is that they really don't heal. There a DPS with a healing utility... that's all they really are.

I went back to WoW for a free period to see what changed and woah... in that game, healers heal or people die. You don't dare do any DPS, its healing all the way, every heal, all the heals, everything is on CD and even then, there is good chance that people may die. You have to triage, you have to make hard calls, you pick and choose who lives and who doesn't.

In this game, slap a regen on them and there good, back to DPS.

If I had to choose, I'd prefer the battle to keep people alive in a world that is trying to kill you rather than toss a regen, use a lily and back to DPS. But... we don't live in that world so I'll spam Holy, Bene the tank and back to Holy spam.

I'd rather heal though...