Echo Vision Frequency

[Vyrerus]

So, we have Echo visions a lot. Pretty much at the scriptwriter's behest. Yet, I can only think of one character who's had an Echo vision of our past.

That would be Fordola.

Now, obviously, there are other characters who have the Echo or the Resonance. They could see our past, but I don't think anyone else has seen it.

Anywho, I guess this thread would be to speculate why, and to maybe list any characters that view us with the Echo that I've forgotten about?

I know we sometimes share Echo visions with other characters, like Krile or Minfilia. I also know that Mikoto saw the future with her Echo, though it was Cid's future, not ours, as I recall.

Seems kinda strange that nobody ever looks in on our past, and I mean, seems like the Resonant can force it. You'd think the Ascian's could force it too. Feels underused for other characters with the Echo. Thoughts?

[Iscah]

I'd have to rewatch the scene to be sure, but I never got the impression that Fordola deliberately looked into our past. It's just part of her constantly-triggering visions.

[Vyrerus]

I'd have to rewatch the scene to be sure, but I never got the impression that Fordola deliberately looked into our past. It's just part of her constantly-triggering visions.

It's not concrete, of course, but she can control when she activates her Resonance. She chooses to activate it in our presence, in response to us having one of her past and then goading her with it. She does this, in spite of knowing that she will most likely have a vision, so it follows that her intent was to view our past. Maybe she can't control the vision trigger, but her Echo does have an on and off switch.

[MrThinker]

It's not concrete, of course, but she can control when she activates her Resonance. She chooses to activate it in our presence, in response to us having one of her past and then goading her with it. She does this, in spite of knowing that she will most likely have a vision, so it follows that her intent was to view our past. Maybe she can't control the vision trigger, but her Echo does have an on and off switch.

I'm pretty sure that there is a scene in 4.1 where we discuss the Resonant with Alphinaud and he comes to the conclusion that Fordola cannot control the visions, because she had Krile's Echo copied.

As for others who have seen our past via the Echo, it is implied Ardbert and the other warriors experienced an echo of our past at the same time we had an Echo of their defeat of Mitron in our first encounter. Ardbert does the classic head grab we do at any rate.

EDIT: Also, I was under the impression that the Resonant, being an artificial Echo, held the same drawbacks of not being able to consciously draw upon it without training or experience.

[Seraphor]

I would say that both Emet and Elidibus have viewed our past via 'echo' ability. They both seemed to know it incredibly intimately despite not being witness to most of it.
As unsundered Ascians, they likely don't get the blackout and headache that typically accompanies an echo vision for the others.

[LineageRazor]

From a role-playing perspective, I doubt anyone is ever going to Echo-watch any events of the WoL that we haven't already experienced in-game. This is because doing so would step on the toes of folks who want to make up their own origins for their character. If the game decided to have someone witness that the WoL got their start because Garleans burned down their hometown, then anyone who wants to pretend that they grew up in the slums of Ul'dah or whatever are going to be mighty disgruntled. Echo-revealed facts about the WoL can go back no farther than that original cart/boat ride at the start of ARR.

And, if we limit our Echo visions to only things the player has already seen, then such visions are pretty much all redundant. There's not many good reasons to show them at all.

I'm pretty sure that there is a scene in 4.1 where we discuss the Resonant with Alphinaud and he comes to the conclusion that Fordola cannot control the visions, because she had Krile's Echo copied.

That's the impression that I got, as well - and further, that those visions were TORMENTING her. She couldn't help but witness again and again the horrors that she and her allies had inflicted on the Ala Mhigans, because every time one walked by she'd get a front-row seat into his or her past. It's part of the reason why she eventually, albiet somewhat grudgingly, started to walk the path of atonement. It becomes a lot harder to justify all that "collateral damage" on the path to a better tomorrow, when you have to experience that collateral damage firsthand.

[MoofiaBossVal]

The WoDs apparently saw the WoL's life story, in 3.1.

Fordola saw the WoL's life story in 4.1, as mentioned.

I don't think Elidibus saw in 5.3. I think he saw the color off the WoL's soul put couldn't quite put a finger on why it felt somewhat familiar. He never put 2 and 2 together that the Amaurotine WoL he idolized may have been standing right in front of him.

I'm guessing that Zenos might get a vision of the WoL's life story in 6.0, might change his perspective on the WoL.

[Vyrerus]

I'm pretty sure that there is a scene in 4.1 where we discuss the Resonant with Alphinaud

That scene takes place in the Resonatorium immediately following the prison scene where Fordola activaes her Resonance and views the WoL's past. Alphinaud pieces together how the imbuement process works and reasons out that they gave Fordola Krile's aetheric pattern. Arenvald derives from this and his own experience that she is like the WoL and himself, and cannot control the visions. The frequency at which visions occur is unknown to him, but he surmises that she must be having them day and night every time the guard changes.

But it's speculation on his part. Everything we're shown with the Resonant implies that they fully control when their powers are active by lighting up their special eye(s). It could be that Fordola knew she could see who was guarding her in this way, and was perhaps testing the waters to see if she could make an escape attempt. Only, the visions started occurring, and all she got out of it was pain. She doesn't control when the visions happen, but if she turns on her powers she's liable to get one. This kind of explains why she couldn't have escaped, say at meal time, despite the Resistance not having any aetheric siphons and what not.

[Vyrerus]

From a role-playing perspective, I doubt anyone is ever going to Echo-watch any events of the WoL that we haven't already experienced in-game. This is because doing so would step on the toes of folks who want to make up their own origins for their character. If the game decided to have someone witness that the WoL got their start because Garleans burned down their hometown, then anyone who wants to pretend that they grew up in the slums of Ul'dah or whatever are going to be mighty disgruntled. Echo-revealed facts about the WoL can go back no farther than that original cart/boat ride at the start of ARR.

And, if we limit our Echo visions to only things the player has already seen, then such visions are pretty much all redundant. There's not many good reasons to show them at all.


That's the impression that I got, as well - and further, that those visions were TORMENTING her. She couldn't help but witness again and again the horrors that she and her allies had inflicted on the Ala Mhigans, because every time one walked by she'd get a front-row seat into his or her past. It's part of the reason why she eventually, albiet somewhat grudgingly, started to walk the path of atonement. It becomes a lot harder to justify all that "collateral damage" on the path to a better tomorrow, when you have to experience that collateral damage firsthand.

Not really wanting them to show a pre-adventurer life. Just, you know, little memory slideshow clips like with Fordola, to make it more tangible when other characters have The Echo.

But, again, as far as we are shown, The Resonant control when their powers are active by lighting up their eyes. Though I suppose we could also say that this is just a cool visual for emphasis.

[Iscah]

I don't think Elidibus saw in 5.3. I think he saw the color off the WoL's soul put couldn't quite put a finger on why it felt somewhat familiar. He never put 2 and 2 together that the Amaurotine WoL he idolized may have been standing right in front of him.

I don't think we were ever "the Warrior of Light" pre-Sundering. The legendary warrior that Elidibus is channeling seems to be an early incarnation of Ardbert's soul-shard.

I'm guessing that Zenos might get a vision of the WoL's life story in 6.0, might change his perspective on the WoL.

Maybe he'll finally stop trying to push his "we both love violence for violence's sake" line on me then.

I feel like we've missed the opportunity for a shift of perspective for Zenos though. I remember when he first popped up again in 4.3 and we were wondering where he might go from there, and the answer has disappointingly turned out to be "straight back to what he was doing before".

If you're not going to take a man's physical death and revival in another body as a storytelling chance for some introspection and shift in perspective, when is it going to happen?

And since they've gone that way, I don't know where they could take it from here. As much as his relentless "there is nothing in this world but battle" thing gets dull, having him find compassion (or any degree of care for others) at this late stage would feel trite.

In some ways it's a path we've already trodden with Omega and its late realisation of the importance of the soul, but Omega was questioning along that line from the start and wanting to understand even if it was entirely ill-equipped to do so.

Zenos doesn't need to understand what drives us. He knows. He's entirely wrong about it (give or take your personal interpretation of your WoL's motives) but he knows - not that it really matters so long as we give him a good fight out of it.

But, again, as far as we are shown, The Resonant control when their powers are active by lighting up their eyes. Though I suppose we could also say that this is just a cool visual for emphasis.

I just rewatched the scene - she's arguing with Arenvald when her eye lights up and she gets flashes of our past, and she immediately grimaces. It doesn't feel deliberate to me.

Other scenes imply she's sensing other people's thoughts without even showing the Resonant eye effect, from wincing in cutscene #2 of "The Price of Freedom" (where we don't know what's going on with her yet) to an outright Echo-headache in #5 of "Return of the Bull". It lines up with Arenvald's observation and indicates that she is constantly getting these unwanted flashes of emotion, if not actual visions, from the people around her.

I don't know if that supports or detracts from my impression that her looking into our past isn't deliberate, but the simplest argument against is that there's no reason for her to be doing it in that moment. She doesn't choose to look into others' pasts and she wasn't even focused on us at the time.

I think she can voluntarily call on the intended effects of the Resonance - the heightened senses "listening" for her opponent's next move - and everything else is an unwanted side effect she can't control.

Maybe the eye effect in that scene is just to emphasise or confirm that yes, it is her Resonant powers giving her these visions.