Rework BLM static leylines to be an aura instead

[Rika007]

Summoner has a bunch of sources of movement -- 4 pet skills, Ruin IV, swiftcast, all phoenix skills... . Sure, it loves to sit and Ruin III a bunch too, but it's not nearly to the extent of BLM. Red Mage, in an emergency, could spend 5 of each mana to move, but of course this is not advised. Better to attempt to slidecast or time combo and/or finishers for bigger movement periods. If anyone has limited movement, it's the healers, who ideally move only on dot refresh or certain gcd heals. Choosing someone to stack on is fine; I have no problem with that. Much better if that job also didn't have 30sec of not leaving its position, no?

The majority of summoner's 'free movement' GCD's are monopolized by it's opener and it's Bahamut period, the way it breaks out is at the most you have 2 or 3 extra casts that allow for free movement every minute, not much of a difference from Red Mage and the 2 enchanted Reprise's you can get off between your melee windows so your cool downs don't drift. And even though Phoenix movement isn't AS punishing as Bahamut, you still want to limit it as much as possible as the chances of losing Scarlet Flames out due to the Demi following you like a loss puppy is too high, and that loss isn't insignificant. Having played all 3 jobs in a raid setting I would rate their maneuverability as Red Mage > Summoner > Black Mage if you are trying to play them at their absolute peak. But even then I wouldn't consider the gap on any of them significant.

Scholar is the only healer that truly lacks movement at this point. I did white mage throughout all of Eden's Gate Savage and was surprised just how much the addition of the Afflatus spells really helped in moving around. Astrologian has always been quite mobile due to its shorter cast times, and a skilled one can move just as easily as Bard's could in Heavensward. And Lightspeed is still a thing. Scholar feels just as rooted as Black Mage, so it just becomes a party thing on which one they prioritize.

I'm going by 'most', not 'worst'. The good BLMs -- the ones who anticipate mechanics, heal points, team buff timings, and actually move in to be in range -- are far too few. Other jobs are often moving to hit the BLM's range. Also, a static group is a completely different animal. This thread is for the sake of reducing the random BLM's worries as well as the party's worries in a pick-up run.

I'll just have to agree to disagree. Wither or not the best ones are too few, I hate anytime a class or hero based game starts balancing and making decisions on the more random PUG environment, it always ends up leading to either homogenization or dumbing down the class for the sake of those who can't work it out. Making the job less rooted isn't going to suddenly make those players better and less toxic. They still will stand too far away, they still won't come in for heals, they still will not learn mechanics, they still will shout at anyone who gets close to them even though they cancel a cast every 4 GCD's. And it should stay that way. That's how Black Mage should be at it's peak. It's skill comes not from it's rotation, but it's game sense. It's rewarding to learn a fight to the T and zoom all over the map and watch your numbers still blow by everyone else on a class that's supposed to have the agility of an oak tree.

Sorry you got offended that I called out the fact you're complaining about a job you DO NOT play. Thus, you have NO REAL PERSPECTIVE. As a higher-end player, I'm holding you a standard higher then the normal person on this forum. Predictably, you FAILED in your analysis of BLM's utilization of LL.

Well, as high end as someone can be one-tricking the easiest DPS job in the game. =) At least you're not a WHM main.

Honey, I agree with you on the overall theory of your argument, but let's not gate keep here. Someone who is great on even an 'easier' job is still better then 98% of the population on this game, even if their take is wrong, there will always be room for amicable arguments. We don't have to be pricks about it.

[Payotz]

I'm going by 'most', not 'worst'. The good BLMs -- the ones who anticipate mechanics, heal points, team buff timings, and actually move in to be in range -- are far too few. I'm going by 'most', not 'worst'. The good BLMs -- the ones who anticipate mechanics, heal points, team buff timings, and actually move in to be in range -- are far too few. Other jobs are often moving to hit the BLM's range. Also, a static group is a completely different animal. This thread is for the sake of reducing the random BLM's worries as well as the party's worries in a pick-up run.

This is honestly a bad reason to change the job. Why remove the parts that's enjoyable for the people who've actually dedicated themselves to practice the job for the people who can't be bothered to learn the job?
Your argument is the same thing as:

"Ok guys. What if we turn verfire/verthunder into veraero/verstone when white magic attacks is already casted? Oh and we should also get rid of the melee combo as well. I don't wanna have to go to the melee side, most mechanics interfere with it hard."

"Yeah let's get rid of positionals, and make melees non-melee. Most melees can't keep melee uptime up and aren't hitting positionals. Let's just get rid of it, this is just for reducing the random Melee's worries as well as the party's worries in a pug."

"Yeah, let's get rid of cast times in general. Most casters can't slidecast. Let's just get rid of it. This is just for reducing the random caster/healer's melees worries as well as the party's worries in a pug."


Also, current BLM can actually be as mobile when it needs it. Hell it can do Illya Orbs E/W just fine. Sharpcast, Triplecast, Swiftcast and Slidecasting will give BLM so much mobility during mechanics and even more so when thunder procs hard, and even then, in worse case scenarios, there's just Transposing into Ice and Spamming Umbral Soul or spamming Scathe. Leylines isn't even a problem as depending on fights, you just don't drop it on cooldown like every other raidbuff during E6S.

Lowering the skill floor and eliminating the gap between the skill ceiling and the skill floor will just make the whole job boring.
Look at how homogenized most tanks are now. Look at how less fun the healers are now. Look at how absolutely dumbed down MCH and BRD are now.

Keep what little complex jobs there is, complex. Not everything needs to be easy, and if everything needs to be catered to PuGs, then there will be no Savage and no optimization.

[Frizze]

You ever consider that some people are new to the game and don't have every single mechanic memorized.

And thats fine? Show me a BLM who says they did everything perfectly in every fight always and forever from day one onward, and ill show you a pathological liar. We all made mistakes, we all had growing pains. Most of us got better, though we dont all reach the same levels(i know im not top tier and would never claim such). But part of the joy of the class for many of us is seeing just how much you can improve by knowing the fights/mechanics/your rotation/your party. If this isnt to the liking of someone "new to the game", its a good thing they arent locked into the class. They can swap to another class and hopefully find one that feels right to them. And if they happen to pick another caster they even have a set of gear already.

[CKNovel]

You ever consider that some people are new to the game and don't have every single mechanic memorized.

I mean, the game would be boring if a new player could come in and instantly knew every mechanics.
Every new patch, there is new mechanics.

The difference between BLM and other jobs is the choices they have to resolve certain mechanics. Other than that, everyone has to deal with mechanics the same way. (Ranged MUST deal damage while moving for copping for they low damage but that's not a ranged thread)
BLM still has massive mobility tools and many moments where they don't move at all and are free to cast. It's quite rare that there is a Construct 8 like boss that requires a lot of movement for more than 10 seconds.

IMO, a Melee will have the same amount to learn. Except they can't pre-place themselves unless they are at melee range.

[Darsien]

Honey, I agree with you on the overall theory of your argument, but let's not gate keep here. Someone who is great on even an 'easier' job is still better then 98% of the population on this game, even if their take is wrong, there will always be room for amicable arguments. We don't have to be pricks about it.

Unfortunately, "kind" doesn't get through to this community. Rather be a right prick then an unheard saint.

The opinion of the inexperienced is irrelevant in the context of changing things for the experienced. Remember that. It'll help you not to make fundamentally flawed opinions, based on other player behavior, influenced by said inexperienced and a clear bias.

Massive mobility tools, which ones? The only one I can think of is that ability that pulls you to a party member and triple cast. But only one is reliable the one that pulls you to party member everything else is timed. swift cast is not a blm ability.

Xeno, Triple, any procs, Sharpcast-forced procs, Between the Lines, Aether Manip, and yes Swift are all powerful tools for BLM's mobility. Also, just because Swift's not exclusive to Black Mage doesn't mean it doesn't count, however you managed to come to that conclusion. With proper planning, there are currently no current content movement issues for Black Mage and all of those options are entirely reliable. If you wanna have some fun, you can get up to 9 consecutive free movement GCDs. 4 from Swift/Triple, 3 from Xeno (2 stacks, one rolled over), any Sharp Cast proc, any natural proc.

*pst, OP. See what I'm talking about with experience? And this person apparently mains the class!

[Kitfox]

Well, as high end as someone can be one-tricking the easiest DPS job in the game. =) At least you're not a WHM main.

Excuse me, neither RDM nor WHM is the easiest job in the game. That'd be MCH.
-Sincerly, MCH main

[SnowVix]

If this change made it in, I'd drop Black Mage in a heartbeat. The entire fun of playing the class is in planning out leyline placement and movement so you don't lose out on it while still dodging AoEs within its bounds.

[Rika007]

Massive mobility tools, which ones? The only one I can think of is that ability that pulls you to a party member and triple cast. But only one is reliable the one that pulls you to party member everything else is timed. swift cast is not a blm ability.

The way it works out is Black Mage has essentially 8 free casts per every minute of a fight. 2 Xenoglossy's. 3 from Triple Cast. 1 Swift cast. 2 from sharp cast procs. You combine this with Between the lines and Aetherial Manipulation and you have all the movement you need to handle even the most intensive movement mechanics in the game at even a Savage or Ultimate raiding level. However it does require an acute knowledge of the fight to pull this off and flat out, to get that, you are going to fail a lot figuring it out. If you see a black mage zooming all over an Arena, never getting hit, blowing up the DPS, always being top of the aggro charts (or the other charts we don't name) and never once dropping a cast, lookin as mobile as a Bard or Dancer; you are watching a pro at work who has probably died to those same mechanic on several occasions to learn exactly how long and the exact inch they can place themselves to pull off it all.

I say this as a player who played Bard for every raid tier up to Shadowbringers, then swapped to caster for the final tiers. Black Mage is a very mobile class, far more then it gets credit for. It's why I'm one of the people who say the 'mobility tax' on Ranged DPS is a joke. Once you know a fight BLM is not taxing at all to maneuver around. It's why OP's point is so off base.

[Lauront]

No. Leylines are a big part of why BLM has such a high skill ceiling, and part of the reason why I personally find BLM's gameplay loop so engaging.
If you place Leylines on the wrong position, you get punished hard. If you know the fights, then you'll get rewarded. This contributes to the gap between good BLMs and average BLMs.
It also has enough mobility in its state as the radius of the effect is high, that you can just dance along the edges of the LL.
LL in general changes how BLM approaches fight as well, producing more replayability out of the fights if you're approaching it from a BLM perspective.


Leave BLM alone, there's little depth in the job design of the game as it is. Not everything needs to be easier.

^ This.

/10char

[Lauront]

You will know its the end, when the trailer for the new expac shows the WOL as a BLM. I can already see it, a reference for the battle scene with Garlemald meant to be familiar with the 2,0 opening movie, Then the WoL walks in watching from the background at the armies charging, raising his massive 2 handed Thaumaturge's arm, and waves it slightly, music going, big ol' meteor swarm comes down on a giant magitek mobile tank/fortress and it explodes, begins to break down as troops rush to exit it. RIP BLM as you know and love it

They could even do a tease with them in the dark robes of a BLM (or if they add one, a new darkness-based caster), flashing Azem's Convocation sigil, just for a bait and switch.

Lol probably. Although I honestly don't see them ever doing a caster or healer save maybe Red Mage. The derplander just has a specific aesthetic that lends itself to a more raw physical power type thing. I don't ever see them doing any of the healers, none of the casters, and then probably also remove Dancer and Bard.

What's wrong with buff mages?

Besides, the character being

Azem

means they're probably possess the aetheric reserves to make for a potent mage - maybe not necessary for BLM but every little helps. Rigid adherence to "what's been done" for its own sake can grow dull, and if they don't know how to make a mage play in an exciting way in a trailer, they just need to look at how other games manage to do it.