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  1. #1
    Player
    currentlemon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Posts
    262
    Character
    Celica Genhu
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 80

    WHM Blood Lily Rework/QoL Change

    A few weeks ago, I made a post regarding the changes I want for WHM. I admit, that was before I started playing the job again after a year. Granted, WHM in general is still an okay job. Definitely miles ahead of Stormblood WHM. But it's still an average job. We probably won't get any major changes until 6.0 (not holding my breath for 5.4 but it's still possible) but there is one QoL change I'd like the job to have. And it's the blood lily mechanic.

    I don't like the fact that Afflatus Misery is locked behind healing skills. Heck, some people on this forum don't like it either. It should be changed similar to how Black Mage gets its Polyglots. After a certain amount of seconds, a blood lily will appear.

    It's a simple change, really. Lilies generate every 30 seconds in battle. At 90 seconds, you get three lilies. So just change it so that a Blood Lily will appear on the job gauge every 90 seconds. See? Simple! I think a change like this is a great QoL change.

    If you disagree though, share your thoughts. We need to have more WHM talk anyway so I welcome the discussion.
    (0)

  2. #2
    Player
    MartaDemireux's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,044
    Character
    Hiraeth Petrichor
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    I prefer it how it is. I like having a spell that makes up some of the lost DPS due to having to use GCD heals. It's a unique function to WHM in a sea of role conformity.
    (11)
    * I fully give permission for any of my written ideas to be used by SE without recognition.

  3. #3
    Player Seraphor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    4,620
    Character
    Seraphor Vhinasch
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Afflatus Misery is designed to allow you to 'catch up' with DPS for the GCD heals you use.
    It's working as intended.
    (14)

  4. #4
    Player
    Liam_Harper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    3,470
    Character
    Liam Harper
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Also prefer the current version. It would make Rapture and Solace a straight up 300 potency dps loss and optimal play would be to ignore lilies entirely.

    0 mana heals that refund dps and create sorely needed weave/movement windows are great QoL.
    (7)

  5. 10-29-2020 03:47 PM

  6. #5
    Player
    Liam_Harper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    3,470
    Character
    Liam Harper
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by AmurT View Post
    While it probably is better for DPS reasons, I think I would prefer Misery to not be changed into another generic cooldown you use whenever it lights up (Assize).
    Now I think of it, I wonder why they haven't just turned Assize into a 2 charge instant GCD (with slight potency adjustment). That would allow us to hold it for healing and create more weave windows instead of requiring them.
    (1)

  7. #6
    Player Veis_Alveare's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    678
    Character
    Veis Alve'are
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 70
    Were something like this to happen I'd rather they delete Rapture and Solace entirely. Give us a 300 potency, instant dps ability that costs one lily instead and also feeds the Blood Lily as it does now. It'd keep the weaving/movement utility of lillies but open them up to be used for movement and weaving even when healing isn't necessary.

    And yes, I know you technically can use them now even when you don't need to heal but it can really be a dps grey area. Were it just an instant, free Glare it'd be a way to keep your GCD rolling productively. It'd also mean some more casts of our base GCD heals (like Medica II) in fights where you aren't able to cover damage with oGCDs alone.

    I'm also not opposed to lillies as they exist now, to be fair. I'm more offering this as an alternative to OP's suggestion.
    (0)

  8. #7
    Player
    darcstar62's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Posts
    54
    Character
    Cailee Caitlen
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by currentlemon View Post
    It's a simple change, really. Lilies generate every 30 seconds in battle. At 90 seconds, you get three lilies. So just change it so that a Blood Lily will appear on the job gauge every 90 seconds. See? Simple! I think a change like this is a great QoL change.
    I agree that it's kind of weird since sometimes since it bugs me to see my lilies full and I find myself hoping for some downtime so I can spam needless Raptures just to trigger Misery.
    (1)

  9. #8
    Player
    Gemina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Dravania
    Posts
    5,778
    Character
    Gemina Lunarian
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Seraphor View Post
    Afflatus Misery is designed to allow you to 'catch up' with DPS for the GCD heals you use.
    It's working as intended.
    In theory, yes. The end result though is RNG creates a multi case scenario. A good comparison is to use NINs dream within a dream. I know, "say what!?" The reason I pick this skill despite being and ogcd ability with its own mechanic is because it is a threefold attack. By 'threefold' that means there are three consecutive hits at 200 pot each for a total of 600, instead of an animation showing three hits that actually only hits once for 600 pot. What happens here is that each hit can crit, direct hit, or both. Same thing when it comes WHM 'replaced' GCDs when using Misery.

    In order for Misery to truly return those three GCDs, it would also have to be a threefold attack, which I am all for. Seeing three magical blasts akin to flowery fireworks would just be sick. We would lose those 100k single Misery casts, but when you see potentially three 50k+ in a sequence, it will be very satisfying indeed.

    What they would have to do at this point is make the lily mechanic less passive. I am ok with the afflatus skills being tied to the lilies, but WHM needs to do something to earn those lilies rather than just wait for them to generate.
    (0)

  10. #9
    Player Seraphor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    4,620
    Character
    Seraphor Vhinasch
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemina View Post
    In theory, yes. The end result though is RNG creates a multi case scenario. A good comparison is to use NINs dream within a dream. I know, "say what!?" The reason I pick this skill despite being and ogcd ability with its own mechanic is because it is a threefold attack. By 'threefold' that means there are three consecutive hits at 200 pot each for a total of 600, instead of an animation showing three hits that actually only hits once for 600 pot. What happens here is that each hit can crit, direct hit, or both. Same thing when it comes WHM 'replaced' GCDs when using Misery.

    In order for Misery to truly return those three GCDs, it would also have to be a threefold attack, which I am all for. Seeing three magical blasts akin to flowery fireworks would just be sick. We would lose those 100k single Misery casts, but when you see potentially three 50k+ in a sequence, it will be very satisfying indeed.

    What they would have to do at this point is make the lily mechanic less passive. I am ok with the afflatus skills being tied to the lilies, but WHM needs to do something to earn those lilies rather than just wait for them to generate.
    The chances of getting 3 consecutive hits to crit would be less than getting your single Misery to crit, yet they'd have to be balanced the same. So you'd see those bigger numbers a lot less frequently.

    Misery has a potency of 900. If it were three hits, they'd have to be 300 each.
    Let's say for simplicity's sake, a crit is 20% chance and increases damage by 20%.

    1 crit Misery would deal 1,080 potency damage.
    3x crit Misery would deal 1,080 potency damage (360+360+360)

    1 crit Misery has a 20% chance of triggering.
    3x crit Misery has a 60%*40%*20% chance, so 4.8%.

    If only 1/3 hits crit (60%-28.8% = 31.2% chance), it's 960 potency.
    If 2/3 hits crit (60%*40%-4.8% = 18.6% chance) then it's 1020 potency.

    If you average it out over thousands of casts, then the DPS output would be the same, but over the course of one fight, with maybe 5-10 casts in total, you're not likely to see any benefit from it. Your parses will be more consistent, but you won't see as much variation, and you'll lose those cases where you got lucky and did manage to get a few big crits out.
    (1)
    Last edited by Seraphor; 11-08-2020 at 11:04 PM.

  11. #10
    Player
    Grimoire-M's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Posts
    987
    Character
    Grimoire Mogri
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Alchemist Lv 90
    The other advantage to misery is it lets you squeeze more DPS out under raid buffs. While you effectively only get 3 out of 4 Glares from it, it lets you put those three Glares into a single GCD that can align with most 90/180s raid buffs, further mitigating the penalty for using them in the first place.
    (0)

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