How Would You Design Red Mage!?

[SwordCoheir]

Since discussion on potential development of Red Mage started taking off in the other thread, there have been alot of good ideas tossed about, but some of the ideas kinda get lost in the discussions. I want to expand on people's ideas and see what people want to do by building up their own vision of Red Mage. Players who would like to repost ideas from the previous thread are welcome too do so.

You can base Red Mage off the Gladiator Class or build your own image purely from a new class like Musketeer or Arcanist, just keep in mind if you do the latter of the two remember that there is a

- 15 abilities/spells/weaponskills limit
- 11 traits
- Abilities should not be designed solely for for cross class abilities. (IE: Making an extended duration ability for buffs like Protect which is weaker on Non-CON/WHM jobs, and not having your own buff spells to use.)
-Jobs only gain 5 abilities, and 5 cross class abilities as well. So you need to remember to build the core of the job in the class level and expand on it in the Job level.

Below is a concept I drew up earlier today. I took it a little too far with the details and I honestly don't expect people to put the same amount of dedication into theirs, but I'd really like to see the extent of peoples imagination within the limitations of FFXIV's system.

Fair Warning: This is based off my personal interpretation of how classes are currently built, granted there is probably a mistake here and there. I tried to build Fencer / Musketeer as structurally similar to how other classes setup as possible, so it may not be quite what people expected.

Second Fair Warning: This is a huge detailed wall of text, I'm using hide tags to try and condense it all.

First Build:

Fencer / Musketeer

Fencer / Musketeer

Weapon: Epee, Saber, Rapier type weapons.
Offhand: Parrying Daggers (Weak secondary weapon, deals little damage but increases parry chances.)
Armors: Cloth, Leather, Jackets, Harness, Scale, Chainmail (Excluding Habergeons)

Damage Modifiers: Piety, Strength

Incapacitation Weaponskills: Coule’- Left Arm, Backsword- Rear

Weaponskills

Weaponskills


Reprise- Swing your blade around your opponents defenses when an opponent blocks, doges, or parries your attack.
TP Cost: 250, Recast: 15 Seconds

Frontal Combo Tree:

Passata-Soto > Coule' > Enfeebling Spell

Passata-Soto- Move under your targets oncoming attacks and strike under their defenses. Increases Dodge rate.
TP Cost: 1000, Recast: 10 Seconds, Duration: 5 Seconds

Coule'- Perform a feint attack and strike when their defense is down. Enhanced damage if you just dodged or parried an attack.
Combo Bonus:Increased Critical Damage
TP Cost: 1500, Recast: 20 Seconds

Enfeebling Spell- Normally cast any Enfeebling spell.
Combo Bonus: Guarantees enfeeble will land for full duration, bypasses built up resistance. (Will not reset resistance timer.)

Rear Combo Tree 1:

Thrust > Extension > Enfeebling Spell

Thrust- Dash forward and impale your enemy. Closes distance between player and opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, Recast: 10 Seconds, Distance: 5 Yalms

Extension- Deliver a ranged attack while distancing yourself from the target.
Distance: 5 Yalms
Combo Bonus: Reduces Enmity
TP Cost: 1500, Recast: 20 Seconds

Enfeebling Spell- Normally cast any Enfeebling spell.
Combo Bonus: Consume extra MP to inflict elemental damage in addition to the status ailment. (Will cause Elemental damage even if status ailment does not land.)

Rear Combo Tree 2:

Thrust > Backsword > Enfeebling Spell

Thrust- Dash forward and impale your enemy. Closes distance between player and opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, Recast: 10 Seconds, Distance: 5 Yalms

Backsword- Strike your target with the back of your blade inflicting Stun.
Combo Bonus: Increases Stun Duration and Accuracy.
TP Cost: 2000, Recast: 20 Seconds

Enfeebling Spell- Normally cast any Enfeebling spell.
Combo Bonus: Increases Duration and Potency.

Job Abilities

Job Abilities

Attaque au Fer / Pressure- Pressure your target keeping him from attacking effectively reducing the targets attack power.
Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 20 seconds

Change of Engagement- Lure your target into a false sense of security leaving them open to attack reducing their defense.
Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 20 seconds

Lines- Increases the party’s success rate of incapacitating the target. (Fencer term when focusing on a particular part of the body, thought it was fitting)
Recast: 5:00 Minutes, Duration: 1:00 Minute

Magic Siphon / Runic Blade- Steal your opponents MP for your own.
Recast: 1:00 Minute

Spells

Spells

I'm leaving the MP costs up to the developers, but I was thinking low cost for the Enfeebling spell and mid-high MP cost for the combo that adds elemental damage to balance it out.

Blind- Reduces target's accuracy.
Cast: 3 seconds, Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 30 seconds

Poison- Deals damage over time on opponent.
Cast: 3 seconds, Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 30 seconds

Slow- Reduces target’s attack speed.
Cast: 3 seconds, Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 30 seconds

Gravity- Decreases target’s movement speed
Cast: 3 seconds, Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 30 seconds

Paralyze- Occasionally prevents opponent from performing an action.
Cast: 3 seconds, Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 30 seconds

Traits

Traits
Enhanced Physical Attack- Increases Attack power by +8.

Enhanced Attaque au Fer/Pressure- Lowers targets attack even further.

Enhanced Parry- Increases parry rate by +8

Swift Enfeebler- Reduces the recast time of Enfeebling spells by 15 seconds.

Enhanced Evasion- Increases physical evasion by +8.

Enhanced Magic Siphon/Runic Blade- Increases MP stolen from target by 25%.

Enhanced Magical Accuracy- Increases magic accuracy by +8.

Enhanced Change of Engagement- Lowers targets defense even further.

Enhanced Magic Potency- Increases magic attack potency by +8.

Enhanced Enfeebler- Increases the duration of Enfeeble spells by 15 seconds.

Enhanced Magic Siphon / Runic Blade II- Increases MP stolen from target by 50%.

Level Progression / Abilities Learned

Level Progression / Abilities Learned

Level > Type > Ability

1 > WS > Passata-Sotto
2 > JA > Attaque au Fer / Pressure
4 > WS > Reprise
6 > Spell > Blind
8 > Trait > Enhanced Physical Attack
10 > WS > Thrust

12 > Trait > Enhanced Attaque au Fer / Presssure
14 > JA > Magic Siphon / Runic Blade
16 > Trait > Enhanced Parry
18 > Spell > Poison
20 > Trait > Swift Enfeebler

22 > JA > Change of Engagement
24 > Trait > Enhanced Evasion
26 > WS > Coule'
28 > Trait > Enhanced Magic Siphon / Runic Blade
30 > WS > Extension

32 > Trait > Enhanced Magical Accuracy
34 > Spell > Slow
36 > Trait > Enhanced Change of Engagement
38 > Spell > Gravity
40 > Trait > Enhanced Magic Potency

42 > JA > Lines
44 > Trait > Enhanced Enfeebler
46 > Spell > Paralyze
48 > Trait > Enhanced Magic Siphon / Runic Blade II
50 > WS > Backsword

Red Mage

Weaponskills

Weaponskills

Rear Combo Tree:

Thrust > Endless Waltz > Banish / Scourge

Thrust- Dash forward and impale your enemy. Closes distance between player and opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, Recast: 10 Seconds, Distance: 5 Yalms

Endless Waltz- Dance like the wind and eviscerate your opponent with a series of quick powerful attacks.
Combo Bonus: Increases Critical attack rate for each successful hit.
TP Cost: 3000, Recast: 30 Seconds

Banish- Cast Banish on your opponent.
Combo Bonus: Lowers opponents magic attack.

Scourge- Cast Scourge on your opponent.
Combo Bonus: Lowers opponents magic defense.

Job Abilities:

Job Abilities

Sacrifice- Give up half your maximum HP in order to heal an ally and grant them temporary protection from harm.
Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 5 Seconds

Master of Magic / Chainspell - Allows player to cast spells without cast or recast time. Spells currently in cool-down will automatically be reset.
Recast: 15:00 Minutes, Duration: 20 Seconds

Spells

Spells

Banish- Deals Astral damage and heavy damage over time effect.
Combo Bonus: Lowers opponents magic attack.
Cast: 3 Seconds, Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 30 Seconds

Scourge- Deals Umbral Damage and heavy damage over time effect.
Combo Bonus: Lowers opponents magic defense.
Cast: 3 Seconds, Recast: 1:00 Minute, Duration: 30 Seconds

Level Progression / Abilities Learned

Level Progression / Abilities Learned

Level > Type > Ability

30 > JA > Sacrifice
35 > Spell > Banish
40 > Spell > Scourge
45 > WS > Endless Waltz
50 > JA > Master of Magic / Chainspell

Red Mage Quest Line

Red Mage Quest Line

Lv30
Quest: Know Hardships and Sacrifice
Reward: Sacrifice, Ability to become Red Mage
Focus: To impart knowledge of RDM lore, one must be able to dedicate themselves to a cause and know the pain, suffering, and joy in life before they can truly know if they’re ready for the future trials. Battle for someone / something that requires personal self-sacrifice to protect.

Lv35
Quest: Blinded by Light
Reward: Banish
Focus: Since RDM focuses on arts based on the path of light and darkness, one must know that light is not always truly good. Battle against an opponent who’s been blinded by own self righteousness, warping his form.
Recommend: Prince of Pestilence (Can’t remember if he was already used in any Job Quests)

Lv40
Quest: Drowning in Darkness
Reward: Scourge
Focus: Continuation of previous quest, now you must learn that darkness is not always truly evil. Battle an opponent who’s sorrow has warped his form.
Recommend: Unknown Soldier

Lv45
Quest: Lost Lineage
Reward: Endless Waltz, 4/5 Red Mage Artifact Pieces
Focus: Now you have proven yourself worthy of RDM lore, your next task is to seek out other relics of the lost order.

Lv50
Quest: Personification Extraordinaire
Reward: Master of Magic / Chainspell, 5th Red Mage Artifact Piece
Focus: Before your mentor can pass on the final piece of knowledge to you and let you become a true Red Mage, you must prove to him your progress and show your really ready to wear the armor that epitomizes a Red Mage master.

Second Build:

Fencer / Musketeer

Fencer / Musketeer

Weapon: Epee, Saber, Rapier type weapons.
Offhand: Parrying Daggers (Weak secondary weapon, deals little damage but increases parry chances.)
Armors: Cloth, Leather, Jackets, Harness, Scale, Chainmail (Excluding Habergeons)

Damage Modifiers: Intelligence, Piety

Incapacitation Weaponskills: None

Weaponskills

Weaponskills:

*No positional requirements for Combos.

** Weaponskills are affected by physical accuracy, but damage is magically based.

Combo Tree 1:

Water Blade > Watera Blade > Wateraga Blade

Water Blade- Imbue your blade with magic dealing, Water based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, MP Cost: 10~100, Recast: 10 Seconds

Watera Blade- Imbue your blade with magic dealing, Water based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 1500, MP Cost: 100~250, Recast: 20 Seconds
Combo Bonus: Poison Damage, Duration: 15-30 Seconds

Wateraga Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Water based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 2000, MP Cost: 250~500, Recast: 30 Seconds
Combo Bonus: Drown Effect, Duration: 15-30 Seconds

Combo Tree 2:

Astral Blade > Banishing Blade

Astral Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Astral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, MP Cost: 10~100, Recast: 10 Seconds

Banishing Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Astral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 2000, MP Cost: 100~250, Recast: 20 Seconds
Combo Bonus: Magic Defense Down, Duration: 15-30 Seconds

Combo Tree 3:

Umbral Blade > Scourging Blade

Umbral Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Umbral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, MP Cost: 10~100, Recast: 10 Seconds

Scourging Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Umbral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, MP Cost: 100~250, Recast: 20 Seconds
Combo Bonus: Magic Attack Down, Duration: 15-30 Seconds

Job Abilities

Job Abilities:

Arcane Seal- Boosts the power of your next magical based action. (Effects any move that consumes MP.)
Recast: 5:00 Minutes, Potency Increased: x1.5 effect (x2 with trait)

Runic Blade- Steal your opponents MP for your own.
Recast: 1:00 Minute

Focused Mind- Increases the duration of the next Enhancing spell used.
Recast: 3:00 Minutes, Duration Increased: x1.5 (x2 with trait)

Brittle Foe- Make your opponent more susceptible to incapacitation.
Recast: 2:00 Minutes, Duration: 1:00 Minute

Spells

Spells:

Sacrifice- Exchange your HP in order to heal an ally. (2 HP healed for every 1 HP lost, Self targetable.)
Cast: 3 Second, Recast: 10 Seconds, MP Cost: 100~250, HP Cost: 10% of Max HP

Fog- Increases the evasion and magic evasion of the target and party members within range.
Does not stack with Bewilder, Incantation, or Temper.
Cast: 3 Seconds, Recast: 10 Seconds, MP Cost: 25~250, Duration: 3:00 Minutes

Incantation- Increases the healing, magical attack, and enfeebling potency of the target and party members within range. Does not stack with Fog, Bewilder, or Temper.
Cast: 3 Seconds, Recast: 10 Seconds, MP Cost: 25~250, Duration: 3:00 Minutes

Bewilder- Decreases enmity generated by target and party members within range. Does not stack with Fog, Incantation, or Temper.
Cast: 3 Seconds, Recast: 10 Seconds, MP Cost: 25~250, Duration: 3:00 Minutes

Traits

Traits:

Enhanced Physical Attack- Increases Attack power by +8.

Enhanced Arcane Seal- Increases the potency of Arcane Seal by 50%.

Enhanced Parry- Increases parry rate by +8

Swift Caster- Reduces the cast time of spells by 1 second.

Enhanced Evasion- Increases physical evasion by +8.

Enhanced Runic Blade- Increases MP stolen from target by 25%.

Enhanced Magical Accuracy- Increases magic accuracy by +8.

Enhanced Focused Mind- Increases the duration of Enhancing spells by 50%.

Enhanced Magic Potency- Increases magic attack potency by +8.

Enhanced Sacrifice- Increases the amount of HP healed (2.5HP gained per 1HP lost).

Enhanced Runic Blade II- Increases MP stolen from target by 50%.

Level Progression / Abilities Learned

Level Progression / Abilities Learned

Level > Type > Ability

1 > WS > Water Blade
2 > JA > Arcane Seal
4 > WS > Astral Blade
6 > Spell > Sacrifice
8 > Trait > Enhanced Physical Attack
10 > WS > Umbral Blade

12 > Trait > Enhanced Arcane Seal
14 > JA > Runic Blade
16 > Trait > Enhanced Parry
18 > Spell > Fog
20 > Trait > Swift Caster

22 > JA > Focused Mind
24 > Trait > Enhanced Evasion
26 > WS > Watera Blade
28 > Trait > Enhanced Runic Blade
30 > WS > Banishing Blade

32 > Trait > Enhanced Magical Accuracy
34 > Spell > Incantation
36 > Trait > Enhanced Focused Mind
38 > WS > Scourging Blade
40 > Trait > Enhanced Magic Potency

42 > JA > Brittle Foe
44 > Trait > Enhanced Sacrifice
46 > Spell > Bewilder
48 > Trait > Enhanced Runic Blade II
50 > WS > Wateraga Blade

Red Mage

Weaponskills

Weaponskills:

Combo Tree 1:

Astral Blade > Banishing Blade > Heavenly Blade

Astral Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Astral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, MP Cost: 10~100, Recast: 10 Seconds

Banishing Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Astral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 2000, MP Cost: 100~250, Recast: 20 Seconds
Combo Bonus: Magic Defense Down, Duration: 15-30 Seconds

Heavenly Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Astral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 3000, MP Cost: 250~500, Recast: 30 Seconds
Combo Bonus: Increased Astral Damage

Combo Tree 2:

Umbral Blade > Scourging Blade > Chaotic Blade

Umbral Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Umbral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, MP Cost: 10~100, Recast: 10 Seconds

Scourging Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Umbral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 1000, MP Cost: 100~250, Recast: 20 Seconds
Combo Bonus: Magic Attack Down, Duration: 15-30 Seconds

Chaotic Blade- Imbue your blade with magic, dealing Umbral based magical damage to your opponent.
TP Cost: 3000, MP Cost: 250~500, Recast: 30 Seconds
Combo Bonus: Increased Umbral Damage

Job Abilities

Job Abilities:

Fallback- Doubles MP cost, removes TP cost, and incurs a casting time to use magic weaponskills from a distance. Effect fades on reuse. (Essentially turns magic weaponskills to spells, makes back-lining an option mid-battle but high MP cost makes it unattractive for full time use.)
Recast: 1:00 Minute, Weaponskill Cast Time: 3 Seconds

Renewal- Resets the duration of all active Enhancements to full, and resets the recast of all abilities and spells for party members within range. (Will renew 15 Minute abilities currently active, but will not reset 15 Minute abilities recast.)
Recast: 15:00 Minutes

Spells

Spells:

Temper- Increases the attack of target and all party members within range. Does not stack with Fog, Incantation, or Bewilder.
Cast: 3 Seconds, Recast: 10 Seconds, MP Cost: 25~250, Duration: 3:00 Minutes

Level Progression / Abilities Learned:

Level Progression / Abilities Learned:

30 > JA > Fallback
35 > Spell > Temper
40 > WS > Heavenly Blade
45 > WS > Chaotic Blade
50 > JA > Renewal

[Volsung]

sword user with magic enhancing rapiers, gains mp by attacking, has combo's interchangable with spells. extra enfeeb/enhancing also.

That is what I would do

[DeadRiser]

Nice. I really like the weaponskill names you gave them. I just can't wait for new classes/jobs to level up ;-;

[illriginalized]

As long as they keep it within the boundaries of the FF series.. I don't care.

[Wevlum]

Some kind of mage/DD hybrid that has combos that use both its enfeeble spells and its ws. Cast silence->use weaponskill for example.

It'd take a lot of red crayon that's for sure.

[Shneibel]

but why only INT & PIE ?, I mean the RMD are melee/magic so isnt it suppose to be STR/PIE or STR/INT ?

[Wevlum]

but why only INT & PIE ?, I mean the RMD are melee/magic so isnt it suppose to be STR/PIE or STR/INT ?

Shrug, technically you'd expect archer to use str but they're dex and pie but yeah if it were an enfeeble class and that were the only spells they got, I don't see why it'd get int.

[SwordCoheir]

Shrug, technically you'd expect archer to use str but they're dex and pie but yeah if it were an enfeeble class and that were the only spells they got, I don't see why it'd get int.

Same way you'd expect GLA/PLD to be VIT rather than STR really, it doesn't make alot of sense with some jobs. PIE is guaranteed because of enfeebling potency, and MND and STR were already used by several jobs so I thought "Eh, why not INT.", it's kind of the red headed stepchild of stats.

Besides, I want people to build up their own version of RDM not fully adhere to mine. So if you wan't RDM to use STR, VIT, or the Moon Phase for all I care go for it. :P

[Jinko]

Wait .. this is a new thread ... seriously .. why ?

why can't you guys just keep all this information in one place, it would make it much easier on the community devs.

You say you have split the thread so that people's idea's don't get lost, but what will happen is one thread will just die off (and somehow I feel you just wanted to have your idea's as the OP)

P.s. This belongs in the battle mechanics sub forum.

[Eremor]

I posted a detailed build in the previous thread (and I was also annoyed at how the topic somehow meandered off to discussing Summoner...) maybe I'll repost it here maybe not, but I will mention here some points that I feel would be important to any Red Mage build.

First, if Red Mage is going to be anything other then a liability in melee it needs a powerful survival ability (but not so powerful that it breaks the job for other purposes). Red Mage needs to do more then just barely survive devastating AOE attacks as that would just produce a extra drain on the healer, and since it is unlikely that RDM would be a powerful DD job it pretty much needs to be able to take care of itself in order to be accepted in the front lines.

Second, a specific job role. In order to keep Red Mage from being pigeonholed into a single monotonous task (Refresh wh***) it needs to be designed to fill a specific role in parties, and it needs to be able to accomplish that role under any conditions (keep in mind the crowd control adjustments cover all traditional debuff spells).

Third and most importantly, it should be fun to play. Don't go adding a bunch of abilities that make sense for the job but require you to bend over backward while playing it to get the job to function properly. The abilities should flow together to create an enjoyable combat routine (not that it should be monotonous either), not a random button mashing mixup. (think about how you would lay out the abilities on your action bar and what if any conditions are needed to activate them)