PL Woes

[Zaaku]

Find that very hard to believe, but I suppose it's possible. However, we're not entertaining rarities here. Player incompetence due to being powerleveled is the subject. As well, somehow we got off on attacking the OP for being a bad leader, which he very well may have been, but as I say they are both at fault. Give credit where credit is due.

Thanks... I think. I do agree with you though. A 75 Whm who didn't know Benny seems impossible. It took that players 3 solid MONTHS of playing 6 hours a day to reach his cap. I find it difficult to believe he was never called upon except that one moment at 75 to use it and only then realized it was in his abilities list. Even if that was the case that was exceedingly rare. Literally unheard of in my time in FFXI.

It is quite possible for someone who never touched the job until 40 to not have a bloody damn clue what they were doing even if they did cap. Which honestly you can go from 40-50 in 2 days anyways, so learning the job then is just plain utter ignorance. If you expect me to accept that everyone should have 2 days of 'training' after the PL rocket pocket parties and then determine if they are willing to learn how to get good then when even have levels at all?

Hell just let us all have 50's and you can pick a class whenever you log in. Apparently that is what PLers want anyways why not oblige them and toss the whole leveling thing completely. I cannot be bothered to put more then 10 hours of effort into attaining my cap lets play some of that awesome and fun end game! Surely those 6 events will never get boring day after day after day.

Leveling has to be a KEY component of the game experience. Hell I say the MOST important. In FFXI when you finally did cap you could have done end game. Many choose to simply level another job. Why would they do that?! It took them FOREVER to reach the max level. Who would ever doing something hard on purpose AGAIN? Because it was FUN. Was the battle mechanic inherietnly fun in and of itself? That is up for debate. Many will say it was just a long grind. Those people tended not to last long in the game. It was enjoyable because you got to feel yourself becoming more powerful. Take on more and more challenging foes and use new talents and abilities you've learn through dedication. It is the progressive feeling of becoming better and more able that drives you. A feeling that has been lost on todays generation. Hard work isn't something to run away from. Taking head on that which opposes you and overcoming it is what makes capping satisfying. Enriches the game play and your take home after you log off. Did I just spend 5 hours getting lost in Yuhtunga to join a PT which wiped 3 times and only got half a level today?


Yeah I did. I'm sure I can get that other half tomorrow... *happy sleep*

[Arcell]

Thanks... I think. I do agree with you though. A 75 Whm who didn't know Benny seems impossible. It took that players 3 solid MONTHS of playing 6 hours a day to reach his cap. I find it difficult to believe he was never called upon except that one moment at 75 to use it and only then realized it was in his abilities list. Even if that was the case that was exceedingly rare. Literally unheard of in my time in FFXI.

It is quite possible for someone who never touched the job until 40 to not have a bloody damn clue what they were doing even if they did cap. Which honestly you can go from 40-50 in 2 days anyways, so learning the job then is just plain utter ignorance. If you expect me to accept that everyone should have 2 days of 'training' after the PL rocket pocket parties and then determine if they are willing to learn how to get good then when even have levels at all?

Hell just let us all have 50's and you can pick a class whenever you log in. Apparently that is what PLers want anyways why not oblige them and toss the whole leveling thing completely. I cannot be bothered to put more then 10 hours of effort into attaining my cap lets play some of that awesome and fun end game! Surely those 6 events will never get boring day after day after day.

Leveling has to be a KEY component of the game experience. Hell I say the MOST important. In FFXI when you finally did cap you could have done end game. Many choose to simply level another job. Why would they do that?! It took them FOREVER to reach the max level. Who would ever doing something hard on purpose AGAIN? Because it was FUN. Was the battle mechanic inherietnly fun in and of itself? That is up for debate. Many will say it was just a long grind. Those people tended not to last long in the game. It was enjoyable because you got to feel yourself becoming more powerful. Take on more and more challenging foes and use new talents and abilities you've learn through dedication. It is the progressive feeling of becoming better and more able that drives you. A feeling that has been lost on todays generation. Hard work isn't something to run away from. Taking head on that which opposes you and overcoming it is what makes capping satisfying. Enriches the game play and your take home after you log off. Did I just spend 5 hours getting lost in Yuhtunga to join a PT which wiped 3 times and only got half a level today?


Yeah I did. I'm sure I can get that other half tomorrow... *happy sleep*

You can't just go and pull the "Why not just give us all everything right away!" hyperbole. That's simply not true and we all know it. Leveling was almost all the content in the game until recently. Given there are 7 classes to level combat-wise and after the first 2 it gets really boring. It's not like most games where you go through all that content ONCE to level a class to max. You go through it 7 times if you want all classes to cap. Maybe if the journey to 50 was actually interesting people wouldn't PL as much. The fact is that right now it's dead boring. Grind here, grind there, do a dungeon once, go grind in new spots, grind in more new spots, grind in Strongholds, 50! Grind could also be replaced with leves for similarly boring results.

Also comparing things to FFXI is pointless. FFXI at that point was a full game with no huge glaring issues and they had time to focus on content and the like. There's still not that much to do, especially while leveling because they are still fixing the game. Can you really blame some people for not wanting to do the same grind spots for every level range 7 times? Not to mention additional classes added in the future.

Hard work isn't lost on this generation but monotonous, painful grinds that only serve as timesinks might be. The borderline masochistic era of MMOs is long gone now. Things have been streamlined and improved. Leveling should be a journey sure, but it shouldn't be a bulk of the content.

Should leveling be slowed down a bit? Sure, especially the first 20 levels or so. That has little to do with PL since that's going to happen no matter what. If people can PL, people will PL. There's no way to stop it without restricting how legit players do things as well, hence the old claiming system which was awful.

[Peptaru]

Hard work isn't lost on this generation but monotonous, painful grinds that only serve as timesinks might be. The borderline masochistic era of MMOs is long gone now. Things have been streamlined and improved. Leveling should be a journey sure, but it shouldn't be a bulk of the content.

All the endgame content is monotonous, painful grinding... people still do it, cuz they get shinies. People only want more power and they damn well want it very quickly. Step 2, sit in town saying the game is boring and you've nothing left to do.

[Xoo]

All the endgame content is monotonous, painful grinding... people still do it, cuz they get shinies. People only want more power and they damn well want it very quickly. Step 2, sit in town saying the game is boring and you've nothing left to do.

This as well. Why do you people even play this game if all you concede is boring, boring and even more boring...?!

[Vaer]

Also comparing things to FFXI is pointless. FFXI at that point was a full game with no huge glaring issues and they had time to focus on content and the like.

Actually, FFXI had glaring issues, just there was no path of communication between the player base and the dev team. Whenever they came out with new content you basically had to deal with it. There were no official forums to complain on, while there were fansites the little communication there was were interviews that happened once or twice a year.

The communication was so bad sometimes it took forever to get bugs fixed. i.e Resist debacle, Sneak Attack proccing from the front (Not gonna lie, I lol'd), etc.

Pretty much "don't like it, deal with it" attitude of the dev team. The dev team pretty much did whatever they wanted. This was back then when there weren't a lot of MMO choices though, times have changed. You can't just ignore half/all of your player base anymore.

[Davorok]

How about a "New Player" Icon that only disappears when we have completed certain content? You could at least spot the PL's that way and shame them. Currently though, there is no motivation to level (classes) through questing.

Personally, I would like to see the entire "Beginning & Mid Game Content" trashed and remade. Here are some of the things I would like to see:

Class Quests that must be completed to unlock Abilities/Spells.

Class Quests that must be completed for Limit Breaks.

Story Quests that must be completed to gain access to the Class Quests.

Class/Story/Side Quests that award must-have items. These items can be epeen gear, NM pop items, artifacts for unlocking content, etc.

GuildLeves (at least 1 per camp) that must be completed to unlock that Aetherite.

Behest changed to something like this: Check counter in city for next (level appropriate) Behest, sign up at counter, auto PT launches when full, if PT is not full Behest auto-scales difficulty then launches. (We can still join at the camps but will Auto-PT with those from cities.)

Repeatable Sidequests (repeatable on each Class).

HNM's, Item-pop NM's, Place-holder NM's, some open world, some instanced, some quest related (required), some easy, some hard, some 100% drop, some frustratingly rare.

Bottom line is this, (whether my suggestions or something else) we desperately need a more Robust, Engaging Beginning and Middle for this game to be anything other than endless Endgame Dungeon runs.

[Krausus]

Thanks... I think. I do agree with you though. A 75 Whm who didn't know Benny seems impossible. It took that players 3 solid MONTHS of playing 6 hours a day to reach his cap. I find it difficult to believe he was never called upon except that one moment at 75 to use it and only then realized it was in his abilities list. Even if that was the case that was exceedingly rare. Literally unheard of in my time in FFXI.

It is quite possible for someone who never touched the job until 40 to not have a bloody damn clue what they were doing even if they did cap. Which honestly you can go from 40-50 in 2 days anyways, so learning the job then is just plain utter ignorance. If you expect me to accept that everyone should have 2 days of 'training' after the PL rocket pocket parties and then determine if they are willing to learn how to get good then when even have levels at all?

Did you ever consider that maybe he didn't unlock any of his job abilities until after he hit 50? If you are not as dumb as a rock then yes you can easily learn how to play any class in this game efficiently enough for the easy endgame content this game has in 2 days hell it takes less time then that, there is nothing difficult about playing any class especially a WHM. This could have all been avoided had you simply said "hey WHM please use Esuna if tank gets petrified". Instead you insult him and come qq on the forums.

Hell just let us all have 50's and you can pick a class whenever you log in. Apparently that is what PLers want anyways why not oblige them and toss the whole leveling thing completely. I cannot be bothered to put more then 10 hours of effort into attaining my cap lets play some of that awesome and fun end game! Surely those 6 events will never get boring day after day after day.

Thats a pretty strong assumption, I'm pretty sure most PLers are just happy enough to get to 40 quickly and are well aware that PLing is pretty much done at 40.

I know lots of folks that are great on their jobs that where PLed and I know plenty of folks that are mediocre on their jobs that didn't. PL isn't the issue ignorance is.