PL Woes

[Zaaku]

But PL doesn't create bad players. Players who lack any motivation to be good at their role will always be bad players, no matter what. Good players are people who do want to be good/better at their role and work toward that goal. It has nothing to do with how the levels are achieved, it has everything to do with how much motivation that player has to not suck at the game.

While this is true you cannot admit with a straight face that increasing the length of time and difficultly of the leveling process will not greatly diminish the sheer number of bad players. No one, no matter how inept at a game they may be, will learn NOTHING from leveling a job 4 hours a day for a month straight. Not to mention WHY would they? If you get stuck in the low 30's high 20's because you keep getting tossed from parties because you literally cannot function in the role you've chosen guess what? You stop playing it. Only a handful of stubborn time rich die hards would ever cap.

Am I saying everyone who reach 75 in FXI was proficient at their job? Several Nyzule Isle runs prove otherwise in my personal experience. That was something I only encountered a dozen or so times in 4 years of daily play. Challenging and extending leveling tends to make better players, weed out those without the aptitude for the role, and grants those who do cap a sense of relevance. That they survived the process of going from newbie to master and are now ready for end game.

[Tigercub]

You need a single level 42 skill from a job you have no intention of playing.
Your options are:

1) Wait hours at a time for a party, because nobody has low to mid level jobs anymore. And half of the community still doesn't use the party search functions.
2) Send yourself to sleep on extremely boring leves for very meager experience points. If you manage to slug through them at a reasonable pace, you can even run out.
3) You get a PL and do something productive in real life.

I'm not so much defending PL as much as I'm just saying that with this system it's not surprising to me at all that everyone gets power-leveled.

The game is also not difficult enough to teach people to play well. A ton of the people I've partied with just mash their skills. They wear level 10 gear on level 40 jobs. Stuff like that. It's not because they got PL'd, it's because the game doesn't require them to be anything other than lazy until level 50, and some people just never take the effort to improve their play.

[Bigbosshenry]

They wear level 10 gear on level 40 jobs. Stuff like that.

better than level 45+ gear on lv 10 jobs.

[Tigercub]

better than level 45+ gear on lv 10 jobs.

Yeah ^^ or that. They still get by just fine on reindeer suits and pressing 1.

[Suneater]

Ideally in my opinion it should be moderately time-consuming to level up (1-50 should take 2-3 weeks). They should change the class quests around a bit to be like a limit break system, perhaps as tutorials on how to play that class. As they are now with guild points abolished, they only serve to give free exp. SE did a great job implementing and making the job quests meaningful but they need to do something with the class quests now.

[Lux_Rayna]

Nope.

He was new. In fact this was his first week playing.

Full AF level 50 Mog access first weeker.

PLing is getting out of hand and while this may be an extreme case it goes to show the root of the problem. People can level fast too fast and in the process rob themselves of the experience they need to play the game. These are the noobs I guess, they don't know any better. What is truly frightening are the people who have 1-2 50's and PL everything else because they've "earned" it. Or they "learn the job at 40" when you can reach 50 within a day or so in the correct camps.

I can tell you exactly what you did wrong, or rather, what you failed to do. As a pt leader it is your *job* to make sure everyone knows what they are doing before you even leave. As an example, I will use my 1st Ifrit run. I was PLed as well, but lets face it a DD isn't exactly complicated, plus i partied from 40-50 enough to know how to make my skills work.

PT leader: Anyone new to Ifrit?

Everyone else: ......

Me: I am

*pt leader explains where to stand, who to follow, what to look out for, etc etc.*

You should at least ask beforehand if anyone needs clarification on the fight, and what needs to be done in it. That is why you're a pt leader. Success is more or less your responsibility, you build the team, you make sure everyone knows their role, and then you set out. You can't heal stupidity, nor predict stupidity, but you *can* at least try to cover your bases before fighting. Now of course if an idiot doesn't speak up, nothing you can do.

Don't assume because someone is lvl 50 that they know what they are doing. Its quite easy to lvl 1-50 on any job and not use the majority of your skills. That WHM could have partied the whole time and never used Esuna, its entirely possible. PLing isn't the problem, the problem is that lvling does not require difficult and strategic group content. Grinding doesn't make you a good player. Your logic is just incorrect.

The issue at hand, to repeat myself, is that grinding does not require skill. It doesn't matter how ppl choose to lvl, they will not develop skill by mindlessly lvling. Skill is only developed through focused practice. Grinding = mindless. PLing = mindless. The method is irrelevant. Next time ask if anyone is new and go over the general strategy before leaving.

[Krausus]

I can tell you exactly what you did wrong, or rather, what you failed to do. As a pt leader it is your *job* to make sure everyone knows what they are doing before you even leave. As an example, I will use my 1st Ifrit run. I was PLed as well, but lets face it a DD isn't exactly complicated, plus i partied from 40-50 enough to know how to make my skills work.

PT leader: Anyone new to Ifrit?

Everyone else: ......

Me: I am

*pt leader explains where to stand, who to follow, what to look out for, etc etc.*

You should at least ask beforehand if anyone needs clarification on the fight, and what needs to be done in it. That is why you're a pt leader. Success is more or less your responsibility, you build the team, you make sure everyone knows their role, and then you set out. You can't heal stupidity, nor predict stupidity, but you *can* at least try to cover your bases before fighting. Now of course if an idiot doesn't speak up, nothing you can do.

Don't assume because someone is lvl 50 that they know what they are doing. Its quite easy to lvl 1-50 on any job and not use the majority of your skills. That WHM could have partied the whole time and never used Esuna, its entirely possible. PLing isn't the problem, the problem is that lvling does not require difficult and strategic group content. Grinding doesn't make you a good player. Your logic is just incorrect.

The issue at hand, to repeat myself, is that grinding does not require skill. It doesn't matter how ppl choose to lvl, they will not develop skill by mindlessly lvling. Skill is only developed through focused practice. Grinding = mindless. PLing = mindless. The method is irrelevant. Next time ask if anyone is new and go over the general strategy before leaving.

great post

[NoctisUmbra]

I can tell you exactly what you did wrong, or rather, what you failed to do. As a pt leader it is your *job* to make sure everyone knows what they are doing before you even leave. As an example, I will use my 1st Ifrit run. I was PLed as well, but lets face it a DD isn't exactly complicated, plus i partied from 40-50 enough to know how to make my skills work.

PT leader: Anyone new to Ifrit?

Everyone else: ......

Me: I am

*pt leader explains where to stand, who to follow, what to look out for, etc etc.*

You should at least ask beforehand if anyone needs clarification on the fight, and what needs to be done in it. That is why you're a pt leader. Success is more or less your responsibility, you build the team, you make sure everyone knows their role, and then you set out. You can't heal stupidity, nor predict stupidity, but you *can* at least try to cover your bases before fighting. Now of course if an idiot doesn't speak up, nothing you can do.

Don't assume because someone is lvl 50 that they know what they are doing. Its quite easy to lvl 1-50 on any job and not use the majority of your skills. That WHM could have partied the whole time and never used Esuna, its entirely possible. PLing isn't the problem, the problem is that lvling does not require difficult and strategic group content. Grinding doesn't make you a good player. Your logic is just incorrect.

The issue at hand, to repeat myself, is that grinding does not require skill. It doesn't matter how ppl choose to lvl, they will not develop skill by mindlessly lvling. Skill is only developed through focused practice. Grinding = mindless. PLing = mindless. The method is irrelevant. Next time ask if anyone is new and go over the general strategy before leaving.

The sheer amounts of truth and sense in this post are staggering.

+1

[Xoo]

I can tell you exactly what you did wrong, or rather, what you failed to do. As a pt leader it is your *job* to make sure everyone knows what they are doing before you even leave. As an example, I will use my 1st Ifrit run. I was PLed as well, but lets face it a DD isn't exactly complicated, plus i partied from 40-50 enough to know how to make my skills work.

Truth in this, but to this as well...

OP said the guy didn't know what Esuna was or the effect it had on the target. Even if he had explained it, he wouldn't have appreciated the necessity in it. This is the problem with the battle system as it is now. In XI, a WHM knew exactly what Erase did the first time their tank got hit with a debuff.

[Krausus]

Truth in this, but to this as well...

OP said the guy didn't know what Esuna was or the effect it had on the target. Even if he had explained it, he wouldn't have appreciated the necessity in it. This is the problem with the battle system as it is now. In XI, a WHM knew exactly what Erase did the first time their tank got hit with a debuff.

Don't forget Esuna is a job ability not like he would of had the ability forever, this whole issue and thread could have been avoid had the party leader did his job and actually lead the party.