DRK skill: Living Dead

[Fynlar]

To play devil's advocate here, but DRKs invuln isnt quite like the others.

It doesn't change the fact that it is still DRK's invuln skill, though. To which I ask again: why should theirs be automatic and the others not?

I want to clarify that I'm not saying the ability doesn't have its problems; people have already gone over them well enough in this thread so I won't repeat them. It's just this approach of "make LD automatic" isn't going to do anything in terms of solving those problems.

Technically speaking, its the longest invuln in the game at 20 seconds max,

No, it's not. People love to keep saying this, but the only time the ability is doing ANYTHING for you is when (if) Walking Dead triggers, which lasts for 10 seconds, not 20, and even then you're only getting that 10 if you get the last bit of healing needed to remove WD at the very last moment (which can pretty much only be consistently done with Benediction from an attentive WHM). Prior to the moment WD is triggered, Living Dead is doing absolutely nothing and you are still taking damage as you normally would, damage that would still need to be healed eventually even if WD did trigger.

Assuming you are using Living Dead in anticipation of an expected fatal hit, there is effectively no difference between using it immediately prior to that hit, or using it 10 seconds prior to that hit. You aren't getting 20 seconds of invulnerability by doing the latter, because until that hit occurs, your situation hasn't changed at all.

It's a similar sort of deal with Holmgang; it's "technically speaking" 8s duration, but again until (if) you take a fatal hit, the ability isn't actually doing anything for you, so the effective duration is generally less than 8s -- unless you can consistently pop it immediately before an expected fatal hit every time.

[Melichoir]

It doesn't change the fact that it is still DRK's invuln skill, though. To which I ask again: why should theirs be automatic and the others not?

I want to clarify that I'm not saying the ability doesn't have its problems; people have already gone over them well enough in this thread so I won't repeat them. It's just this approach of "make LD automatic" isn't going to do anything in terms of solving those problems.

I didnt say make it automatic. I dont think it should proc automatically like a trait. I think it should be reworked as I suggested - If you take Fatal damage, you have 0 self heal and will die if you dont receive your HP in outside heals OR end combat before the duration ends. If WD doesnt proc by the time the duration of LD ends, you recieve a large percent based heal. This gives it much more flexibility and makes it worth while to use. It also gives DRK an "Oh S***" self sustain ability that other classes have that DRK doesnt. So if your out on your own or without a healer, you can still use LD to some effectiveness with TBN to mitigate the hell out of damage and get healed by having LD Drop off.

No, it's not. People love to keep saying this, but the only time the ability is doing ANYTHING for you is when (if) Walking Dead triggers, which lasts for 10 seconds, not 20, and even then you're only getting that 10 if you get the last bit of healing needed to remove WD at the very last moment (which can pretty much only be consistently done with Benediction from an attentive WHM). Prior to the moment WD is triggered, Living Dead is doing absolutely nothing and you are still taking damage as you normally would, damage that would still need to be healed eventually even if WD did trigger.

No, the 'invuln time' is 20 seconds because the concept behind it is to stop spending heals on a DRK once LD has been activated. You are literally wasting heals or the invuln if you continue to heal a DRK once they have activated the skill, because either LD pops and all those heals you did were for nothing, or it doesnt pop cause you kept healing them and you wasted the potential 10 invuln. So if youre a smart healer, you stop healing once the skill has been activated because you want the damn thing to pop, regardless or not if you have a WHM or not in party because you are going to assume that they will take fatal damage. And yes, All healers can heal DRK to max during the 10 second phase. It just is a heavier resource drain on AST and SCH compared to WHM thanks to Bene. And thats not good.

In the most ideal situation, it would be roughly 10 seconds in the activation phase so no heals necessary, take fatal damage at the last moment which activates Walking Dead, about 10 seconds of that before you get the necessary HP to stop WD from killing you. This gives you technically around 20 seconds of 'invuln', or rather 20 seconds of time where you technically cant be killed IF timed perfectly. This isnt like War's Holmgang, where you can accidently be killed by a lucky crit or mistimed heal if you let the War's HP drop low before they use the invuln in an effort to maximize dps and reduce unnecessary healing. Once LD is activated, you cannot be killed (with the exception of very specific Boss Mechanics) for the bare minimum of 10 seconds, and up to 20 seconds.

Does it happen often where you get the max duration? No, almost never. Ive heard of it happening but Ive yet to see it myself. And mind you, prior to your fatal damage, a lot can be happening. Dot damage, Raid wide AoE, Autos, etc. So there is plenty that can hurt you in the 10 second time frame. Even with that considered there are some odd considerations to make too. Pop it to early with consistently high damage coming in, and you may proc WD sooner than you need, having it fall off (assuming you get the heals) before youre hit with a tank buster. No matter how you cut it, its a Janky Invuln compared to the others and isnt like the others. The biggest difference being the fact that unlike other classes, using yours kills you if you dont get HP back and you have no way to do that by yourself.