DRK skill: Living Dead

[baldman89]

quick suggestion, just wanna see what the community thinks.

I would like to see Living Dead made into a passive trait. all of its skill text and actual application is fine. i believe it should simply be a passive trait, instead of active use

[Fynlar]

Why should DRK's invuln be automatic whereas all the other tanks' invulns aren't?

[Melichoir]

Why should DRK's invuln be automatic whereas all the other tanks' invulns aren't?

To play devil's advocate here, but DRKs invuln isnt quite like the others.

Broadly speaking, it is the only invuln in the game that needs a second person to use it correctly. Hallowed Ground is straight forward Invuln, Holmgang and SuperBolide just reduce HP to one but both classes have self healing so you dont die instantly, and even then you can techincally pop a pot (I know its not super effective but it's something), so you got even the smallest amount of cushion.

LD is if it activates, you die unless your healed for your HP. DRK has no way to fully restore their own HP in the time frame to allow for this. This exception makes it drastically different than others. Technically speaking, its the longest invuln in the game at 20 seconds max, but thats only if you really plot that out and take fatal damage on the last second, and then get fully healed on the last second. In reality, unless its a tankbuster thatll kill you for sure otherwise, you sometimes end up in situations where your healers stop healing you to pop LD but you dont quite take fatal damage. So your HP gets low but LD doesnt pop cause you dont die, then something crits you and you die before your healer can react. It's a janky Invuln.

Now rather than have it proc automatically. What would be better actually would be to have it operate more like Excog, kinda. If you take fatal damage, the LD state procs and you dont die just like normal. You need to be healed for your HP. However if the effect drops off and you havent taken fatal damage, the skill heals you for a percentage of your max hp (Let's say 50%). Now if it doestn pop you get a huge restore so youre still safe for using it, but if it does pop, well better hope your healer is on top of it. It also gives it practicality in solo content as well. HP running low and your starting to worry? Pop LD, mitigate to hell and have it fall off for the restore. This gives you some level of skill in using it too.

Other things that could be done to make it more functional would be to change how the LD effect operates. Have it reduce self healing to 0 - so you cant self heal no matter what. However, if you leave combat before the effect ends, it doesnt kill you. It just falls off with you at 1 hp. Again, to give you some level of survivability, if you manage to kill your enemy in the time frame LD goes off, you dont die at the end of it cause you cant get your HP up.

[ForteNightshade]

Now rather than have it proc automatically. What would be better actually would be to have it operate more like Excog, kinda. If you take fatal damage, the LD state procs and you dont die just like normal. You need to be healed for your HP. However if the effect drops off and you havent taken fatal damage, the skill heals you for a percentage of your max hp (Let's say 50%). Now if it doestn pop you get a huge restore so youre still safe for using it, but if it does pop, well better hope your healer is on top of it. It also gives it practicality in solo content as well. HP running low and your starting to worry? Pop LD, mitigate to hell and have it fall off for the restore. This gives you some level of skill in using it too.

Other things that could be done to make it more functional would be to change how the LD effect operates. Have it reduce self healing to 0 - so you cant self heal no matter what. However, if you leave combat before the effect ends, it doesnt kill you. It just falls off with you at 1 hp. Again, to give you some level of survivability, if you manage to kill your enemy in the time frame LD goes off, you dont die at the end of it cause you cant get your HP up.

I actually rather like this idea. Perhaps make the amount healed a percentage of the damage you deal while under Walking Dead in the same vain Warrior can heal itself through Nascent Flash.

Usually people will know when you are going to use it in Savage raids so that's not a problem. It's anything below that that is the issue.

If only.

PF teaches you a scary lesson with LD because the sheer amount of healers who just don't pay attention to it is... concerning. If nothing else, they need to make it far more noticeable when WD activates. Like your name flashes obnoxiously or something.

[Seraphor]

Why should DRK's invuln be automatic whereas all the other tanks' invulns aren't?

Indeed.

The main issue with LD is how you're completely reliant on the healer to execute your job mechanic.
It needs to be able to be used and resolved by yourself.
I think that it should take any remaining HP off your MP first.
For example, lets say you get healed to 20% HP, leaving 80% required to survive.
If you have at least 80% of your MP, you lose that instead. Less than 80% MP you still die, but at least you have the opportunity to resolve it yourself with resource management.

[SomeRandomHuman]

Indeed.

The main issue with LD is how you're completely reliant on the healer to execute your job mechanic.
It needs to be able to be used and resolved by yourself.
I think that it should take any remaining HP off your MP first.
For example, lets say you get healed to 20% HP, leaving 80% required to survive.
If you have at least 80% of your MP, you lose that instead. Less than 80% MP you still die, but at least you have the opportunity to resolve it yourself with resource management.

Then what about holmgang and GNB's invuln skills? They both set you to 1 hp and render you psudo-invincible for WAR and 8 seconds of invuln for GNB. When those end and you don't receive any healing you just die. Hallowed just flat out makes you invulnerable with no caveats. That's been a constant issue with the tank invuln skills. Hallowed will forever be the best one functionally and SE's refusal to ether outright nerf it or just re-align the other tanks to do the same thing.

[ForteNightshade]

Indeed.

The main issue with LD is how you're completely reliant on the healer to execute your job mechanic.
It needs to be able to be used and resolved by yourself.
I think that it should take any remaining HP off your MP first.
For example, lets say you get healed to 20% HP, leaving 80% required to survive.
If you have at least 80% of your MP, you lose that instead. Less than 80% MP you still die, but at least you have the opportunity to resolve it yourself with resource management.

This still penalizes Dark Knight as it's the only invuln where you can lose damage. In fact, it may actually be a gain for healers to let LD eat your MP if they lack oGCDs because healer DPS is comically high nowadays. All they need to do is slap a healing component on LD and leave it at that. Yes, it effectively becomes edgier Holmgang but if we're being honest, Superboilde is just Persona Hallowed Ground.

[Seraphor]

Then what about holmgang and GNB's invuln skills? They both set you to 1 hp and render you psudo-invincible for WAR and 8 seconds of invuln for GNB. When those end and you don't receive any healing you just die. Hallowed just flat out makes you invulnerable with no caveats. That's been a constant issue with the tank invuln skills. Hallowed will forever be the best one functionally and SE's refusal to ether outright nerf it or just re-align the other tanks to do the same thing.

Both WAR and GNB have self healing skills, and if you defeat the enemies in that time, you're good.
If DRK does it, they're dead either way.

It wouldn't be fool proof.
DRK too could only recover a fraction of their HP, which would mean they'd have to conserve MP in advance to survive, which is unlikely, but at least it would be possible.
Plus losing all that MP is still a penalty as you need MP for TBN.

[SomeRandomHuman]

Both WAR and GNB have self healing skills, and if you defeat the enemies in that time, you're good.
If DRK does it, they're dead either way.

It wouldn't be fool proof.
DRK too could only recover a fraction of their HP, which would mean they'd have to conserve MP in advance to survive, which is unlikely, but at least it would be possible.
Plus losing all that MP is still a penalty as you need MP for TBN.

Abyssal drain is a very potent self-healing ability that, when used properly, is capable of healing a similar amount of hp to a WAR's chaotic cyclone as well as soul eater having the same hp restoration as Storm's Path so WAR and GNB being able to self-heal is a moot point.

Then when we're talking about MP conversion then why should PLD not have their MP used for hallowed?

My point is: All the tank invulns should just be the flat 10 seconds of invuln on the... is it 10ish minutes CD? I appreciate that they tried to keep to the job theme, but Hallowed Ground is the only Invuln CD that doesn't have some kind of functionality issue.

[RyuDragnier]

Abyssal drain is a very potent self-healing ability that, when used properly, is capable of healing a similar amount of hp to a WAR's chaotic cyclone as well as soul eater having the same hp restoration as Storm's Path so WAR and GNB being able to self-heal is a moot point.

Yes, Abyssal Drain is a very "potent" 200 potency heal that is SO useful on a single target enemy.