Housing Ownership System Abuse

[Sylvastreak]

I'm interested to learn what the REAL IDEAL amount of houses to own per person are per the pitchfork mobs on these forums.
....
Entertain me OF. What are the logical loops you'll jump through to demonize this incredibly legal method of owning multiple homes?
I am legit interested in opinions on this.

"Logical loops" Common sense would prevail if anyone had any left.
Fine, I'll "entertain" you, though I doubt it'll change your mind at all and of course I'll still get jumped on for thinking this is taking the mick out of the system.
People can currently have 1 fc house and 1 personal house per world per service account, yes. That is what SE says.

"Incredibly legal" yet still amoral, selfish and greedy, and still hoarding - which is what SE was trying to stop with this system along with housing reselling. It's within ToS (somehow), but it's still someone abusing the system that was put in place by using multiple service accounts to hoard up a large amount of housing, whether or not a GM thinks it's okay under whatever rule they reported themselves for. And I once again don't care if they can afford it. You're all defending this without considering if they're also ruining someone else's experience by denying them a house - and I mean REAL people, NOT service accounts. There IS the inappropriate behaviour clause in support and they WERE urged to use their best judgement, but chose to do it anyway and deprive people of housing in-game for their project.

It doesn't matter how many wards SE add to the game, you'll spend forever wanting more while defending people who are making it worse by owning ENTIRE WARDS.

No, I am not only annoyed at this instance. There are other people who have done this on other servers and they're just as bad, frankly. I am also irate that two people can take up an entire ward and just be grandfathered in no problem. I'm irate at people owning five houses on one server and being grandfathered in.
There should be an timer for them to let houses demolish and compensation - refund them the full cost of the house in gil, take the binding status off furniture so they can sell it, increase storage/placement spaces on all housing and especially mansions as that is definitely not high enough, going by other folks' complaints and repeated requests in the forums. Take them down to the same amount as everyone else across the game, no matter what DC.

Any way that will make it damn well clear to them that while this is legal it's also not fair on other players in the game, whatever people on here seem to jump through their own hoops to try and defend.

But of course, I'm just entertaining you so I doubt you've actually read any of this.

[ErysNight]

snip

I read it! Thanks for the reply!

I can appreciate your candid admittance of being annoyed by the Haves and I am familiar with those that owned the ward prior to 4.1 and got grandfathered in. I think it's fair to be annoyed if it's against your own personal ethics.

I'm not here to change anyone's mind and no lol, I don't think I'll be changing mine but we can still discuss!

I think our opinions split at the assumed intent behind SE changing the housing system. The only thing they actually verbalized was that in an attempt to stop reselling they changed the house system to have an invisible timer. They even asked us to report people reselling so RMT was their main concern.

I'd need a source on SE caring about hoarding. Especially considering many prominent and celebrated JP designers own full neighborhoods and it's accepted widely there. In fact, there is a level of double standard. JP designers are worshiped for it but NA/EU are demonized.

I've heard people say "well housing is worse on NA/EU" but at the time the grandfathered people acquired their homes it was not. This game got really popular during stormblood for some reason and Housing exploded. Anyone that's been here and into house can remember the wards full of max devalued houses.

I don't care if SE makes the housing rules more strict going forward. I only care if they decide to punish people for playing the game as they designed.

From the concept of morals and ethics, someone in this thread said it best, everyone's moral compass differs. It's a game, not real life. A layer of consequence is removed. As long as you don't break TOS then you are fulfilling your contract. There is no social contract because this isn't real life.

Now this might be where our opinions differ even further but yeah, I'm not limiting myself for internet strangers when I come to this game for escape from real life. It's amazing to have acquired what I have in 4 years. I'm incredibly proud, happy and honored to be able to support my community and the best part? Since it's not real life, I can just block toxic people and keep on going lol. SE is the only law I abide by and then I care for me and mine.

I'm ok with being selfish in this way then. Different strokes for different folks. Life is hard out here, I'm not letting a game make it worse lol.

[Jojoya]

I only care if they decide to punish people for playing the game as they designed.

What is punishment?

Games do change over time and so do their player bases. Sometimes games have to change what used to be okay to accommodate the current needs. Players have to give up things they used to have. As long as the rules are being applied equally to everyone, no one should be feeling "punished".

If the rule is one personal house per account, then removing any houses over that limit is not punishment. It's bringing that account in line with the current rules of the game. Removing every house from that account would be punishment.

Not saying that I think removing the grandfather clause should be done, only that it's removal is not punishment.

[Sylvastreak]

snip!

To be fair the mention of hoarding was to do with the reselling specifically, iirc but my memory is absolutely naff on that front cuz I was dealing with some irl stressful stuff at the time.

I've never been on the JP servers and can't comment on their views as it's a wholly different culture in every way, not just with housing but with etiquette and general unspoken rules. The only window I've had on them was the "FFXIV: Dad of Light" tv series.

I tend to operate on the moral compass of "just because you can, doesn't mean you should" and while that may sound really hypocritical as the OP, I do think this should be addressed overall. I don't like the idea of having multiple service accounts on a game that already allows you to have so many characters per server and DC - although I can understand having one on say, PC and PS4 if you've got kids or something.

That said I also think all alts on a server should be allowed to have access to the same personal house to limit the need for someone's characters to have separate housing.

I have several characters all on the same service account and only one has their own house and fc house; the rest have fc rooms or apartments (or even nothing). I don't understand the need to have this many houses to yourself when you could easily spend the same amount of gil redecorating every so often, nor do I see how SE could possibly add enough housing wards within the physical servers' capacities if people continue to act like this and buy entire wards. Something will have to give eventually if we're to have even your idea of "equal" opportunities to get housing and the features with them. So yes, this still seems selfish and greedy to me, I'm afraid.
Personally don't use the aetherial wheel stands, but we do have airships in the FCs I'm in and while I agree that they should not be locked to FCs now that they can be solo built, I'm not sure where else exactly they would be implemented. Perhaps a Grand Company barracks type area? Crossbreeding facilities in apartments and fc rooms would be nice for avid gardeners, along with some sort of upgrade system for apartments. I'd note that they are equally available to everyone as apartments are permanent, all cost the same and are all the same size. They're also the same size as fc rooms.

[ErysNight]

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I respect your perspective, life is just everyone's experiences shaping their own views. So while you haven't personally found a reason that multiple homes might benefit you, others have. I don't mind people feeling some type of way about why beliefs and I don't expect to change someone elses'. I think I only ever jump on these threads because people seem unwilling to understand that FORCING your personal view on someone else is what's wrong.

If those are your housing standards and you hold yourself to one house, great for you. I know tons of people that don't even want housing to decorate (i noted earlier, decorating is just one of many functions of owing a plot) and I support that as well. So I also chime in when people complain about those with undecorated empty houses. It's up for the individual to decide the value, and people would be a whole lot happier if they minded their own business.

Ultimately, I think I'm a whole lot more lenient because this game always feels like a bonus layer of life. What I'm finding though is that people LIVE this experience and hold it almost as important as their real lives. So I can see how emotion can get built up there. So if players like those, encounter players like me who don't find this as serious because it lacks the consequences of real life, you'll continuously have these different opinions. It's ok to think someone is selfish, it's an opinion but it's not right to harrass them for it. I don't think forcing your way of life on someone is humane/right. (which is just my own moral compass lol, so I'm sure people will disregard that too haha)


I would hope that we get a community garden and a standard workshop as a room in the grand company. One that, like a real house relocates to your plot when you get an FC house. So that new FCs without a home can access their workshop right away.

[TwistedTea]

I'd need a source on SE caring about hoarding. Especially considering many prominent and celebrated JP designers own full neighborhoods and it's accepted widely there. In fact, there is a level of double standard. JP designers are worshiped for it but NA/EU are demonized.

QFT.

I wouldn't be surprised if SE is addressing housing before 5.4 because Covid affected housing significantly on JP servers as well. (Credits: Mew FC for scrapping the Lodestone data)

People seem to be hypocritical about ward owners who do it on 'dead' servers on NA/EU. I can respect a stance that's universal instead of this hand-waving "cultural differences."

[ErysNight]

QFT.

I wouldn't be surprised if SE is addressing housing before 5.4 because Covid affected housing significantly on JP servers as well. (Credits: Mew FC for scrapping the Lodestone data)

People seem to be hypocritical about ward owners who do it on 'dead' servers on NA/EU. I can respect a stance that's universal instead of this hand-waving "cultural differences."

Definitely a fare point. I went over to the JP Forums to check out their housing forums and there doesn't seem to be an uproar yet (but please note it's google translate) I'd be interested to see if they had posts like these there.