Housing Ownership Restrictions

[worldofneil]

The restrictions show the intended ownership model that SE would like for the playerbase to follow, and one that would also fairly distribute houses to the playerbase.

Whilst I agree that is possible... their own actions suggest that's not the case.

1) They published that website, but then changed the "rules" a week later. Since the in-game system is what is actually used, it looks more like someone didn't get a memo to actually update the website or they just don't care it's technically out of date because they already put it under a "temporary" section.

2) There's nothing in game that actually sends you to the website. We all know that there was a restriction in-game and it was removed. For over 2 years players can buy multiple FC houses without having any knowledge that this website even exists.

That reads like the GM asked the supervisor for a hot take, and the supervisor got it, so (more than likely) the supervisor didn't actually do much research so the take provided here may not be accurate of what SE actually thinks, and should be taken with a grain of salt.

Or maybe it is accurate... We've seen before that when something happens that SE don't like, they will fix it, fast. People friending their own alts or the whole Ungarmax thing for example. For less serious issues they still do hotfixes, like next week they're adding some hotfixes for the 5.3 content.

I do appreciate you're not happy with how things are, but housing has been this way for a very long time. Literally years. If SE really they wanted to change it, they would have so that inaction would suggest that for them it's "working as intended", even if you disagree.

[Almagnus1]

Or maybe it is accurate... We've seen before that when something happens that SE don't like, they will fix it, fast. People friending their own alts or the whole Ungarmax thing for example. For less serious issues they still do hotfixes, like next week they're adding some hotfixes for the 5.3 content.

I do appreciate you're not happy with how things are, but housing has been this way for a very long time. Literally years. If SE really they wanted to change it, they would have so that inaction would suggest that for them it's "working as intended", even if you disagree.

I think it's people taking using a favorable take from a GM as "evidence" when the reality is that:

[9:03 a.m.][GM]Gm Voxpainet >> I will not be able to elaborate further on matters of housing, however, as that is out of the scope of my services.

Which basically means the entire thing is a hot take from a GM, and shouldn't be considered anything other than that. And it's definitely not something we should be waving around as "evidence".

[Almagnus1]

You're shifting the goal posts for what constitutes as official evidence.
Should SE officially state on their website what is against the TOS regarding housing? Sure. But until SE does so, a GM is a very credible source.

It's not as explained above.

This is rather hypocritical. Considering that this post is about a ward owner on Spriggan, a formerly dead world before the autodemo freeze.

You gave no context for the post, and instead presented it as evidence. I treated it as such, don't be a hypocrite when I filet your "evidence" because it's really not.

[TwistedTea]

It's not as explained above.
You gave no context for the post, and instead presented it as evidence. I treated it as such, don't be a hypocrite when I filet your "evidence" because it's really not.

Lol, the context was provided if you read:

You stated:

It's also showing the cultural differences between what works in Japan (where there's a significantly higher housing turn over rate) and what doesn't in the North American and European markets. Changes should be made to account for the cultural differences that are also aggravating this problem.

My reply was addressing your above quote.

Here's an example of a ward owner who reported themselves to the GM:

At the end of the day, you're not SE or a GM; the official sources of evidence

I could respect a stance for universal restrictions across all servers. It does seem hypocritical to call out ward owners on dead NA/EU worlds but not on JP servers.

[Barraind]

I will never understand why people feel they need more then 1 fc and 1 personal house. I can perfectly understand if you got alts and one or more of them inherit a FC with a house. But intentionally going out and using the FC system to obtain more...I don't get it.

The investment into a large house + submarines and the seeds to start crossbreeding are regained by those systems in a couple months, for ~5-10 minutes of upkeep per day.

FC Houses are the single best ROI in ff14 if you're active.

[Almagnus1]

I could respect a stance for universal restrictions across all servers. It does seem hypocritical to call out ward owners on dead NA/EU worlds but not on JP servers.

I don't read Japanese, and I've enough experience with the translators to know that it's going to give me Engrish when I translate it and Hydalaen only knows what kind of response, so IMO there's no point in browsing a forum I can't natively read - so the take came from the data provided by Mew... which is pretty minimalistic tbh. It would be far better data if they broke it down by server, and then broke down the FC statistics to show how many and of what size owned the houses... but I suspect they don't want to disclose that information because it would only be ammo to use against them.

[Arielen]

I don't read Japanese, and I've enough experience with the translators to know that it's going to give me Engrish when I translate it and Hydalaen only knows what kind of response, so IMO there's no point in browsing a forum I can't natively read - so the take came from the data provided by Mew... which is pretty minimalistic tbh. It would be far better data if they broke it down by server, and then broke down the FC statistics to show how many and of what size owned the houses... but I suspect they don't want to disclose that information because it would only be ammo to use against them.

This list by Mew shows it by server but not by plot size or group size however.

I have to say (from personal experience of course) that it's difficult to measure use based on FC size. I have an FC of 5 but my CWLS of 42 members scattered across the DC use my house. FC size isn't necessarily an accurate measure of how well-used a house figures to be. So many people on Crystal have tiny FCs but cater to larger crowds due to event and such. Can't speak for what it's like on any other DC though; I've never played on another.

[Kenky]

That reads like the GM asked the supervisor for a hot take, and the supervisor got it, so (more than likely) the supervisor didn't actually do much research so the take provided here may not be accurate of what SE actually thinks, and should be taken with a grain of salt.

Since owning multiple houses is unfairly denying other players the ability to participate in the system going by the restrictions outlined at https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes.../housing_land/ , it's griefing. This line is shows that the ward owners should worry.

So, instead of simply taking the Moderators stance (especially when backed by a supervisor on this) and leaving it at that, you still try to find some form of loophole to make them guilty. Despite the fact that, even in other threads. You've been proven wrong.

It's not an abuse of systems. It's not griefing. It's not breaking any rules or violating any terms. If "unfairly denying other players the ability to participate in the system" was a bannable offense, or even an offense to begin with (not something you've made up, mind!) then sure. You might have some ground to stand on. But let's focus more on it for now..

Unfairly denying others the ability to participate? Incorrect. You can, just like every other player, spam a placard for your chance to own a house. Not to mention the Apartments that are essentially infinite being an option to those that wish to Participate in the housing system, without the toxicity of other players at a placard point. People seem pretty adamant in forgetting this fact. Wonder why..

But that's assuming you're talking about participating in owning a house. Not the FC-only systems like submersibles and airships. If that is the case, then every private house owner is punishable by that standard and that is.. What. About half of FFXIV's playerbase? (give or take) and nothing has been done. But if "denying participation" is such an offense, why haven't we been banned yet? Sure is a mystery!

Stop looking for loopholes or reasons to justify attacking other players because they are doing what they enjoy.

I sincerely doubt any of the other sects of the game would be under this much scrutiny. Do the Savage / Ultimate raiding teams get attacked because they beat a fight faster than one random, insignificant stranger? No. Do crafters and gatherers get attacked because they make optimized rotations to get squeeze every ounce of quality out of new items? No.

Yes, I'm aware it's pretty weird to compare raiding in an MMO to housing, but at this point, with how frequent people come up with "We should hate people because they have X and I dont", it's gotten to the point where nobody can really take you seriously anymore. It's just the same points and refusing to accept the answers given to you, plugging your ears and screaming until we go away and act as if you won. Grow. Up.

[Yshtola_Cat]

so the take came from the data provided by Mew... which is pretty minimalistic tbh. It would be far better data if they broke it down by server, and then broke down the FC statistics to show how many and of what size owned the houses... but I suspect they don't want to disclose that information because it would only be ammo to use against them.

Minimalist? What you are looking for is totally irrelevant to this discussion. I'd love to see you try to obtain the information yourself LOL! By the way, my FC has already been very public about what we do. We have no reason to be deceitful about housing and we do not make assumptions about who owns what. There's nothing to hide when you have organized groups who are using their houses while the silent majority does jack s****.

This list by Mew shows it by server but not by plot size or group size however.

I have to say (from personal experience of course) that it's difficult to measure use based on FC size. I have an FC of 5 but my CWLS of 42 members scattered across the DC use my house. FC size isn't necessarily an accurate measure of how well-used a house figures to be. So many people on Crystal have tiny FCs but cater to larger crowds due to event and such. Can't speak for what it's like on any other DC though; I've never played on another.

Difficult is an understatement. The lodestone is a giant piece of s*** if you're looking to get data out of it.



Lacking any kind of free time to set up a Google Data Studio document and google sheet is struggling to keep up with 4,000,000 cells. No ETA on that, but I'm hoping to get something out by the end of Fall. If you have something very specific, I could get a list like this one (most popular FC plot/all servers):

[Almagnus1]

Unfairly denying others the ability to participate? Incorrect. You can, just like every other player, spam a placard for your chance to own a house. Not to mention the Apartments that are essentially infinite being an option to those that wish to Participate in the housing system, without the toxicity of other players at a placard point. People seem pretty adamant in forgetting this fact. Wonder why..

And what happens if the FC that likes being on somewhere like Cactuar wants to find a home?

Stop looking for loopholes or reasons to justify attacking other players because they are doing what they enjoy.

I'm not the one who's attacking other players here, I'm looking for a way to better optimize housing distribution so that more can enjoy it because housing is such a scarce resource.

And if you perceive that to be an attack on you (or your playstyle), then that's a problem that exist solely in your head.

I'd love to see you try to obtain the information yourself LOL!

I haven't put in the time to work with XIVAPI to pull the data and make sure it's valid. Most of what I was looking into involved using a packet sniffer to pull the data from the ingame traffic and storing it as it's being sent from the server to the client in plain text so I'd get the addresses and FC tags - which means I can do a focused Lodestone pull via XIVAPI for the FC tag on that world and verify it with the address.

And honestly, I got sidetracked into other projects so that got put onto the backburner. Speaking frankly, no amount of data I can provide, or arguments I will make will ever be sufficient for those who are abusing the current system because they will always see themselves in the right and most of them (like yourself) cannot be reasoned with because they only think that people like myself are incompetent simpletons that are doing this out of jealousy. When you're fighting that perpetual uphill battle... why waste the effort?

Lacking any kind of free time to set up a Google Data Studio document and google sheet is struggling to keep up with 4,000,000 cells. No ETA on that, but I'm hoping to get something out by the end of Fall. If you have something very specific, I could get a list like this one (most popular FC plot/all servers):

You've got a website, why aren't you pumping the data into the website's database, and going from there?

While a spreadsheet is a great tool for analysis (at least as far as Excel is concerned - the Google Spreadsheet is a POS), a spreadsheet is a horrible way to store data, much less make it accessible to anything else.