Housing Ownership Restrictions

[Miminming]

If the housing crisis comes to a head in Japan (like it has on the NA servers), then it may.

whay do you know about JP server? there's 0 housing for a while here too, and when there is it's a war too, but people tend to not complaining because they know that's the way the game works and most new player work their way and buying apartment until there's an opening, they know housing don't come easy and a limited server space not a given things.

[Penthea]

whay do you know about JP server? there's 0 housing for a while here too, and when there is it's a war too, but people tend to not complaining because they know that's the way the game works and most new player work their way and buying apartment until there's an opening, they know housing don't come easy and a limited server space not a given things.

It should be noted that in Japanese culture complaining is often seen as stirring the pot, which they often consider to be inappropriate behaviour even when the complaint is justified. It is partially why so many aspects of their social culture are so rigid because not conforming to the norm can get you shunned. In the west we are far more open about our opinions and individuality, formality matters far less, and it's significantly more common to see people here make their complaints with drive and passion.

We've all heard the stories about how in the JP servers there can be a community blacklist in which they decide they won't play with someone anymore but would never say anything about it to their face. They just collectively decide to silently exclude certain people. Whereas in the west if a person ends up with a large number of people not wanting to play with them it is very rare for this to occur without a heated conversation between the two parties.

When Shirogane first launched it was a disaster, and I recall people saying things like "wow even the Japanese players are complaining". I would be willing to place a large bet that this is partially why SE quickly introduced new wards afterwards with new purchase restrictions in place. Even their main target audience was openly incredibly unhappy with the situation, and not something anyone could attribute to "oh it's just western players being western".

And this makes me keenly interested in seeing how the launch of Ishgard will go.

[Arielen]

It should be noted that in Japanese culture complaining is often seen as stirring the pot, which they often consider to be inappropriate behaviour even when the complaint is justified. It is partially why so many aspects of their social culture are so rigid because not conforming to the norm can get you shunned. In the west we are far more open about our opinions and individuality, formality matters far less, and it's significantly more common to see people here make their complaints with drive and passion.

We've all heard the stories about how in the JP servers there can be a community blacklist in which they decide they won't play with someone anymore but would never say anything about it to their face. They just collectively decide to silently exclude certain people. Whereas in the west if a person ends up with a large number of people not wanting to play with them it is very rare for this to occur without a heated conversation between the two parties.

When Shirogane first launched it was a disaster, and I recall people saying things like "wow even the Japanese players are complaining". I would be willing to place a large bet that this is partially why SE quickly introduced new wards afterwards with new purchase restrictions in place. Even their main target audience was openly incredibly unhappy with the situation, and not something anyone could attribute to "oh it's just western players being western".

And this makes me keenly interested in seeing how the launch of Ishgard will go.

When you try to explain to a person what their own country's culture is like from your outsider perspective, it comes across as very, very racist.

[Penthea]

When you try to explain to a person what their own country's culture is like from your outsider perspective, it comes across as very, very racist.

This absolutely was not intended to be racist and if someone was offended about what I said I do sincerely apologise. I merely wanted to point out that Japanese culture is so different to the west. It's not entirely better or worse, it's just very different.

I'm not a fan of the idea that "oh look these people don't complain as much about X therefore X isn't as bad as we think" or "these people react in X way, therefore others should too". No specific culture, data centre region, data centre or server is the the most true indication of the state of anything in the game, the players' opinion about it, or how players should act. The person I quoted essentially said "the players on JP servers have a better understanding of how housing is supposed to work and this is why they complain less" which I felt was an attempt to invalidate how those elsewhere act and feel.

If a problem is bigger in one place than another that doesn't mean there is something quite wrong with how the majority of people act there. It can mean the problem is more obvious because of how they tend to vent their frustrations and/or their different population makes said problem have different effects on them.

Also just because a person complains a lot about something does not mean they don't know how it works, it can simply mean they disagree with it.

Again I sincerely apologise if I offended anyone. What I said was not done with the intention of any malice.

[Arielen]

Anyway that's what I meant yesterday when I said that no one demonizes you and that you do it yourself. You literally just tried to tell a Japanese person what Japanese people are like and I don't know if my pity outweighs my resentment and disgust right this second.

Anyway, my condolences to Miminming who is trying to contribute to a conversation and gets talked over. I have some questions of my own for you after speaking with some other players from the JP server on discord: do you think that the current housing prices are too high for how much money people make?

edit:

tldr for Penthea it seems like you've caught the idiot brain rot fungus of being racist and trying very hard to rationalize it, please shut up forever about "cultural differences"

[k99]

If the housing crisis comes to a head in Japan (like it has on the NA servers), then it may.

The biggest reason for the difference between the two environments is because the rate of earning Gil on the NA side is roughly 5x, sometimes more, than the JP side. The time it takes to be within buying power for a small house takes the average player a very long time. Because of that, the natural availability of housing with auto demolition being on almost always ensures that houses will be available. The general population of the JP market is very self sufficient. People are largely more willing to acquire things on their own instead of buying from the market for high dollar items. The behavior of the market is different on NA. There is more laziness to go around, it's very easy to become super rich over night. That is why housing demand is so different when you have people becoming millionaires within their first week of playing the game. The number of people who can afford a house is so drastically different, to keep up with that demand would be impossible on NA side.

Having the old prices of housing beforenew prices of houses after they were slashed made more sense for JP players because the prices were astronomically too high for them to achieve and the system would sit dead because of it. Coupled with the fact that RMT crackdown is much more strict here than on NA (City states have no bots advertising), the population generally shuns RMT as a whole and utilization is very low in comparison to their Western counterparts. Unfortunately, changing the price structure blew the gates open on the NA side making it easy to buy up houses. There are people who buy houses in mass on JP, but again people are not crazy about houses or specific houses being unavailable. There is less preference for location or size as opposed to can I do housing or not. Apartment use is extremely high here even if there are plenty of houses available, which there usually are during normal auto-demolition periods.

I have purchased houses both in NA and JP numerous times, but the JP market has always been easily walking up to a placard and taking whatever you find. It is only the NA market that has been so savagely cutthroat year round. The two populations see housing differently as a consumer and view their alternatives differently as well. That is why very little, if any, tension is observed on the JP side with regards to housing vs. the West.

Adjusting the prices for housing based on region/server popularity may very well be the correct first step since Yoshi himself knew that altering prices would skew demand greatly depending on the location.

[Barraind]

The biggest reason for the difference between the two environments is

... that JP has 25% more housing for a smaller population.

They have a full datacenter more worlds combined on their 3 clusters, and the servers lock for character creation at a lower number than NA.

[Almagnus1]

<a whole ton of lies and self projection against arguments I never made after putting words in my mouth>

Thank you for showing why it's a massive waste of time trying to talk with you as you have zero interest in a civil discussion and are only here to start a fight.

Dude, you need to drop this. Demonizing a natural part of human nature (At least in the western world) is not going to win anybody over to your side. Plenty of people are taught from childhood that stuff is all that matters. People continue to compare their stuff with other peoples stuff and always finding themselves lacking. It's a difference of societal norms and what is accepted / not accepted.

Or, in a way you'll understand. Japan doesn't like to stir the pot, whereas America never lets go of the damn ladle. Bit on the nose, but it's legitimately what materialism is and guess which countries have such a standard as the norm? Now look at all those countries and see just where all the complaints and drama is coming from?

The US is an exceedingly diverse place, so don't assume just because you were taught that as a kid it's universal across the US.

... that JP has 25% more housing for a smaller population.

They have a full datacenter more worlds combined on their 3 clusters, and the servers lock for character creation at a lower number than NA.

Well, that explains why the solution of adding more wards is a Sisyphean solution.

[Catstab]

Thank you for showing why it's a massive waste of time trying to talk with you as you have zero interest in a civil discussion and are only here to start a fight.

I put zero words in your mouth and told zero lies. You would appear to be the one looking for a fight, launching accusations like those. The bracketed text just gives context to each of the quotes of mine you were responding to.

I refuted every one of your points. I'm saying your suggestion is a bad solution to the problem. If you read and understood my previous post, that should be obvious to you now.

To repeat what I said earlier: I have only been civil. My only point is "taking in game rewards away from people who earned them is anti fun, and will not be done." You know this to be true, that's why you aren't arguing, you're just claiming I'm being uncivil, which is ridiculous. If you can refute that point, please do so. If you can't, kindly stop bumping this thread and let the bad suggestion die.

[Kenky]

The US is an exceedingly diverse place, so don't assume just because you were taught that as a kid it's universal across the US.

As is the UK and most of Europe (which arguably is much more diverse than the U.S) yet guess who is also complaining that they can't get what they want when they want it? I mean, you can try and refute the country's ever-hungering greed by saying you don't do it, or don't condone it. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Greed runs the Western World and that isn't likely to change.

I would assume people could be adults and maybe not attack each other for pointless things, yet every day I am disappointed. Your previous comment to Catstab being laughably pitiful. You get called out and instead of taking the defeat, you act as if you're the victim.

Grow up and maybe, just maybe.. If you stop being the typical pot-stirrer, maybe people would care about what you say instead of point out your flaws and laugh at you.