Extreme trials and the DF

[Ultimatecalibur]

Which, in my own opinion, has always been weird. The mentor roulette should only consist of duties already present in other roulettes (again, in my own opinion), but that's a different can of worms.

The Mentor roulette was pretty much introduced to fill out EX queues with players who knew how to do the fights with filling any in progress or stalled duties being a secondary benefit.

[ForteNightshade]

I think they should get their own roulette, tbh. Would a ton of people use it? Probably not, at least not without the right incentive. But they created New Game+ for a relatively small section of the community so they could realistically do the same with this type of roulette.

An EX Roulette wouldn't be relatively small though. It would border on non-existent. Look at how many Mentors bail the moment they get a synced Primal. There just isn't a reward large enough that would completely imbalance the system. When you can cap current tomes in two hours through hunts or send a little longer in easy dungeons, why would anyone touch an EX variant? Maybe you put a mount there but then people would just form premades; defeating the entire purpose.

The Mentor roulette was pretty much introduced to fill out EX queues with players who knew how to do the fights with filling any in progress or stalled duties being a secondary benefit.

To fill out queues in general. I don't think they ever intended to fill out just EX queues.

[Vahlnir]

An EX Roulette wouldn't be relatively small though. It would border on non-existent. Look at how many Mentors bail the moment they get a synced Primal. There just isn't a reward large enough that would completely imbalance the system. When you can cap current tomes in two hours through hunts or send a little longer in easy dungeons, why would anyone touch an EX variant? Maybe you put a mount there but then people would just form premades; defeating the entire purpose.

Chances are I wouldn't touch it either, to be honest. But I do feel that the option should be there. I don't see how premades would defeat the purpose of a roulette though. They would still have to deal with a random trial. That's how it is supposed to work. A random trial doesn't necessarily mean it has to be random people. By that logic that means they should rework just about every roulette available to us, aside from what works solely as a solo queue anyway. And that would be unnecessary, in my opinion, because the system is already working as intended, premades or not.

[Driavna]

Chances are I wouldn't touch it either, to be honest. But I do feel that the option should be there. I don't see how premades would defeat the purpose of a roulette though. They would still have to deal with a random trial. That's how it is supposed to work. A random trial doesn't necessarily mean it has to be random people. By that logic that means they should rework just about every roulette available to us, aside from what works solely as a solo queue anyway. And that would be unnecessary, in my opinion, because the system is already working as intended, premades or not.

Way too many bosses and mechanics in order to expect people to remember everything. Also, unless you are a quick learner, an average player will need a few lock-out timers before clearing an extreme fight.

I really have a hard time imagining this kind of roulette working, particularly with all the 24m ILvL cheesing happening already.

[Ultimatecalibur]

To fill out queues in general. I don't think they ever intended to fill out just EX queues.

When Mentor Roulette was introduced the ARR EX trials were pretty much the only non-raids df not popping regularly or being successfully completed. The EX trials were the only thing that "required" a Mentor who had already completed the content everything else was queuable normally. They were also the big road block that limited (as still limits) access to the roulette.

[Kuroka]

Id be all in for that roulett, you dont have to run it if you dont like... But i definitly set it so you must have cleared once , or at least have the highest needed Ilvl. Id love more stuff like the mentor roulett, idk why they wont give us 50/60/70 seperate...

[Gemina]

What incentive would this roulette offer to get players to actually use it? Tomes and gil isn't going to do it. Path of least resistance, remember? You can't toss anything in here players already have easier access to. Even increasing these rewards, e.g. offering 500 of the current tomes and 25k gil isn't going to matter if the players can't even clear the fight. From my own experience, syncing down to the primal's level, or running the current raid tier in PF has a clear rate of well under 50%, and not many players are going to want to prog outdated EX content.

EX trials already offer substantial rewards to players willing to run and clear these fights. Because these rewards are random, and have an abysmal drop rate, players are going to want to run these things unsynced if they are to group with total randoms.

.....

Now, I should also mention that hate having to say everything I just stated. Every last word. Oft I echo the status quo, but it doesn't mean I agree with it. For players like me, the challenge of clearing these fights IS the incentive. If I could group up with seven other players willing to learn, play nice, and care about performing well I couldn't care less about the rewards.

The way it would work in my own funland is the reward for clearing the roulette is simply x10 of the totem the fight drops. There would be a bonus to all players of x1 totems and a slightly increased drop rate on the mount if any player has yet to clear the fight. This would be a weekly reward system that resets along with the other weeklies. For those unfortunate to get a fight they already have the mount for, a consolation bonus of a voucher that they can exchange for a reward of their choosing will be given upon completion of the roulette. Possible items up for exchange would be MGP and Aetheryte tickets, rare dyes, and even some exclusive rewards.

The idea of the roulette is to get players in those damn fights. I envision a world where the devs are having to think about how to make content more challenging, not less; because the playerbase in general are having increased clear rates of the harder content. One can dream.

[LineageRazor]

Folks have talked about Extreme and Savage Roulettes for a long time now - and they simply would not be viable. Some of the early fights can be won in a session (my experience with Mentor Roulette shows this is true), but the difficulty of the fights advances with each expansion to the point where it's virtually hopeless to secure a win in the 60 minute limit. And when you sign up again, its with a whole new batch of newbies that have to be trained up from scratch!

I can see reasons both to leave these fights in Duty Finder, and also to move them to Raid Finder, but either way, someone signing up in Duty Finder should be given the warning that the content is advanced difficulty, and that Party Finder is a better tool for finding menbers for the fight. This applies both if you just want a quick, unsynced clear, or wish to find folks willing to do it synced for the challenge.

Putting Extreme fights in Mentor Roulette was a mistake, at least for the current requirements it takes to become a Mentor. While clearing the fights are necessary, clearing them SYNCED is not. Probably the majority of folks that qualify as Mentors do not know how to do the fights synced, so it makes little sense to plunk them in with a bunch of newbies and expect them to show them how to do it.

A lot of newbies wind up in Mentor Roulette staffed Extreme fights not because they WANT to do it the hard way, but simply because they do not know about Party Finder, as Canadane mentioned above. They don't mesh well with folks that are actually looking to do the fight the hard way, or with Mentors that don't know the fight at all.

Now, I should also mention that hate having to say everything I just stated. Every last word. Oft I echo the status quo, but it doesn't mean I agree with it. For players like me, the challenge of clearing these fights IS the incentive. If I could group up with seven other players willing to learn, play nice, and care about performing well I couldn't care less about the rewards.

I hear you, and I sympethize. Way back, I was late to get on the Binding Coil train, and I formed a group in Party Finder for Coil 2 with the intent of NOT using the cheap Enrage strat - to actually learn the fight with passing of Allegan Rot and all that. It eventually filled - and half the party hadn't bothered to read the party finder text and refused to get on board with the plan. We eventually did Enrage anyway.

People choose the quickest and easiest path, in general There are outliers - but for most, there's too many things out there to do, to spend unnecessary time on any of them.

That said, you are not alone. There ARE challenge-seekers out there. Use Party Finder to find them. Friend them. Make a linkshell. You won't get a full party of eight quickly, but it will happen in due time. Maybe if you're really lucky, they'll even go for the masochist's paradise that is the Minimum Item Level setting! :3

[TheMightyMollusk]

I'd like to see it, but I'm also a sadist, so take my input with a grain of salt and rub it in your eyes.

Also a Binding Coils roulette, but see above.

[linayar]

Any reason why put EX trials in the regular trial DF (and, correspondingly, roulette)?

Aren't they only available in mentor roulette? And if I recall correctly, last time I had to clear EX trials to unlock mentor roulette in the first place.