The Devs apparently learned very little from the bad aspects of Eureka.

[EaMett]

Who are you to say the devs did or did not learn when you literally have not touched the content?

This is why job changes stopped coming in Live Letters.

It's like you're telling someone chocolate/vanilla tastes awful without having a single taste.

This isn't really a valid argument. If you have a trained palate you don't need to taste a dish to know it'll taste awful from the ingredients alone. It's the same with class changes, a veteran player will instantly know how changes will affect their class just from reading tooltips. That's why the wide majority of pre-release complaints turn out to be spot on. I suspect that they stopped giving out info not because of this but because their SDLC doesn't allow for changes that late in the release process so they can't listen to us even if they wanted to.
There's enough information on this to have a decent idea of what it'll entail. You still need to grind mobs to pop stuff, same logos action type mechanics and grinds, etc. etc.

[reivaxe]

I think that person meant that 24 and 48 man bosses are limited in practice when there are only 1-5 people in the instance later on like in Eureka.

... This makes no sense. Why do people here keep trying to push the narrative that Eureka is a ghost town?

1- Eureka is still very active. Just recently I popped into the 3rd zone to hop in an NM party, did 2 and popped out ... then went to a fresh 4th zone and helped spawn 2 nms with people so that I could get the rest of the Crystals I needed to complete a glam item. People still do BA runs. Much like anything old it's prob not on the top of most people's list when there's NEW content but in down time it get's busy.

2- This is ALSO taking the place of this expac's "deep dungeon" in that you can go there, use an under leveled job, play it with full skills and gain levels from that (but this time with the benefit of not speed running one shotting everything so you can actually properly play with a job at max and see how it is). If it's anything like PotD or HoH it's likely to be the most effective way to level up to a point.

There's enough information on this to have a decent idea of what it'll entail. You still need to grind mobs to pop stuff, same logos action type mechanics and grinds, etc. etc.

Ever bit of battle content for PvE in this game can be considered the same at it's core. Not sure why anyone would think a battle zone in this game could be that different from a foundational level ...
PoTD/ HoH/ Dungeons/ The Hunt/ 24 men Raids are basically "kill mobs to pop a NM" cause you have to kill small monsters who don't pose much threat alone to get to kill a bigger monster. Trails/ Ex/ Savages are just harder Bosses. The end product is different but the core idea is the same.

The difference comes in how they feel and what you're doing it for.

[Deceptus]

This isn't really a valid argument. If you have a trained palate you don't need to taste a dish to know it'll taste awful from the ingredients alone. It's the same with class changes, a veteran player will instantly know how changes will affect their class just from reading tooltips. .

Pretty much this. Whenever SE puts RNG in this game they always go extremely low first and then up the rates to really low as time goes by.

So when they say there are items that prioritize you getting into the critical engagements you can bet your Gil they are going to be really rare to obtain.

Eureka gear had huge benefit in Eureka it was the only gear in the game with Elemental Bonus +, this made you do more damage and take less damage. The difference between using the elemental eureka gear and not having it was huge.

To obtain most of the stuff with the Elemental Bonus you had to go into Baldesion Arsenal. According to:

https://ffxivcollect.com/mounts/186

Only 13% of the player base has the Ozma Mount, meaning cleared BA.

Hate to be that guy, but this content isn't for this games lowest common denominator unless they’re willing to adapt.

I disagree. Relic content isn't supposed to be "hard" by any means, provided you were willing to put forth the time on the grind. It has almost always catered to the low denominators.

[ElazulHP]

I groaned when I saw it was going to be another Eureka like instance thing. Hated Eureka. Probably going to hate this. However, then I remembered there was supposed to be an alternate route so all is good as long as it isn't brain dead grindy like Eureka was. I got physically sick from Pagos because I was playing it too much. Not good for your overall health playing like that.

[BadLala]

To obtain most of the stuff with the Elemental Bonus you had to go into Baldesion Arsenal. According to:

https://ffxivcollect.com/mounts/186

Only 13% of the player base has the Ozma Mount, meaning cleared BA..

Clearing BA is not required to get the elemental gear. There are chests throughout BA that gives you the Eureka fragments to upgrade the gear. And some of them can drop Cryptic Seal or Damascene Cloth to get the vermilion cloak and Kirin's Osode, if you're lucky. You can check how many Eureka fragments you can get from each boss and the location of chests inside BA here https://ffxiv-eureka.com/BA-visual-guide.pdf

Farm runs don't bother fighting AV as the chances of wiping are higher. They only get the fragments for the gear.

[linayar]

I disagree. Relic content isn't supposed to be "hard" by any means, provided you were willing to put forth the time on the grind. It has almost always catered to the low denominators.

As far as I know, critical engagements (and potentially skirmishes) are not part of the relic quest. The relic quest only requires story completion and gathering necessary items (which can be earned outside of Bozja).

[Vahlnir]

The relic quest only requires story completion and gathering necessary items (which can be earned outside of Bozja).

For those who do not wish to participate in the Bozja content, yes. However, relics will be doable inside this instance through currently unknown means, but I think it's safe to say that things such as critical engagements, among other things, will reward relic progress or something related to it in the Bozja zone.

[linayar]

For those who do not wish to participate in the Bozja content, yes. However, relics will be doable inside this instance through currently unknown means, but I think it's safe to say that things such as critical engagements, among other things, will reward relic progress or something related to it in the Bozja zone.

I doubt that as I believe Yoshida said you don't need to worry about Lost Actions if you're not interested and those are needed for Critical Engagements (or at least, the 1v1 portion).

[MintnHoney]

I doubt that as I believe Yoshida said you don't need to worry about Lost Actions if you're not interested and those are needed for Critical Engagements (or at least, the 1v1 portion).

IIRC, it wasn't so much that they're necessary for Critical Engagements, just that they provide a much higher chance of success. At the time, they were also discussing the chances of non-DPS players being chosen for the 1v1 fight, saying that they would likely need the Lost Actions to even have a chance to be chosen, on top of there being (currently) unknown factors to being scored a "top performer."

[linayar]

IIRC, it wasn't so much that they're necessary for Critical Engagements, just that they provide a much higher chance of success. At the time, they were also discussing the chances of non-DPS players being chosen for the 1v1 fight, saying that they would likely need the Lost Actions to even have a chance to be chosen, on top of there being (currently) unknown factors to being scored a "top performer."

Regardless of their exact use, one of the slides say you can "focus only on story quests or take on extra challenges." I would assume that refers to doing the relic grind only as compared to taking on critical engagements, which are the main challenge for this content. And even if it is required to do critical engagement for the weapons, the fact that there is alternative method means you're not at the mercy of waiting to be selected (assuming you didn't do the work of trying to get priority).