Random Elements in Fights

[DrWho2010]

So after lurking around on this site for a while as well as making note of the games design, it seems a lot of it (class design, meta strategies, optimization, general gameplay) revolves around how heavily scripted fights are. Which makes me wonder, how would these things change if more random elements were introduced, primarily in regards to enemy mechanics?

Stone Vigil hard mode's final boss is about the only one that has truly "random" mechanics and that is limited to a few moves, all which have signature tells. there would have to be a massive shift in dev philosophy for them to move away from current design parameters.

[Cyreil]

Stone Vigil hard mode's final boss is about the only one that has truly "random" mechanics and that is limited to a few moves, all which have signature tells. there would have to be a massive shift in dev philosophy for them to move away from current design parameters.

Rathalos embraced it.

I think more fights like Rathalos would be interesting in terms of fight randomness, just not in every single fight from here on out.

[Doozer]

Rathalos embraced it.

I think more fights like Rathalos would be interesting in terms of fight randomness, just not in every single fight from here on out.

I was just thinking of Rathalos when I read this thread. I loved that fight so much (probably because it was easier having played Monster Hunter) and having it be all about actually reacting to each attack instead of just "okay it's doing the tankbuster, then it's the room-wide AoE, then it'll jump to the center and drop AoEs..." it gets so boring when everything is so predictable. That alone is why I don't even bother with Savage and higher, it's just a memory game. I like to adapt to what happens instead of memorizing everything.

[SpeckledBurd]

Rathalos embraced it.

I think more fights like Rathalos would be interesting in terms of fight randomness, just not in every single fight from here on out.

Rathalos also doesn't have much in the way of actual mechanics beyond "Dodge the AOE based on the tell" and "stack up to soak fireball".

[Doozer]

Rathalos also doesn't have much in the way of actual mechanics beyond "Dodge the AOE based on the tell" and "stack up to soak fireball".

I mean, can't that describe like 90% of other fights anyway? Dodge AoEs and stack for stuff sometimes?

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

I mean, can't that describe like 90% of other fights anyway? Dodge AoEs and stack for stuff sometimes?

Yeah but rathalos is simple to the extreme. Sit on side the entire fight

[Doozer]

Yeah but rathalos is simple to the extreme. Sit on side the entire fight

That definitely doesn't work. And if it's so simple people wouldn't get wrecked so much and they wouldn't have complained like they did when it first got added because there's no attack markers except the single-target fireball so they never knew when to do anything.

If you just stand off to the side you're probably not doing anything or going to die fairly quickly when it turns around and charges you.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

That definitely doesn't work. And if it's so simple people wouldn't get wrecked so much and they wouldn't have complained like they did when it first got added because there's no attack markers except the single-target fireball so they never knew when to do anything.

If you just stand off to the side you're probably not doing anything or going to die fairly quickly when it turns around and charges you.

That's not what I meant. You just hug his left leg for the entirety of the last phase.


And people can't do simple mechanics in most dungeons, of course they can't do rathalos.

[MariaArvana]

That definitely doesn't work. And if it's so simple people wouldn't get wrecked so much and they wouldn't have complained like they did when it first got added because there's no attack markers except the single-target fireball so they never knew when to do anything.

If you just stand off to the side you're probably not doing anything or going to die fairly quickly when it turns around and charges you.

Actually, all of Rath's attacks in phase 1 & 2 sans fireballs can be dodged by just force hugging his left side.

Charge: Just move to his left side. Or any side, since it hits his front. Just don't be in front lol.
Tail whip: he whips from back to his front through right side x2. Just keep moving along with him to move to his left side, easy.
Jump back + fireball: only hits in front of him, stand on left side ez.
front bite + back tail whip: doesn't hit his sides. ez.

Phase 2 charge: same as phase 1. Just don't be in front of him.
Phase 2 fire bite: just don't be in front of him.
Phase 2 firebreath: cleaves in front of him. Y'know, just don't be in front of him. Amazing complexity.

But of course, it's only easy if people have some kind of reflexes, which a lot of players don't and hence complained. (Also because when the fight first released, I doubt many people realized Rath's blind spot making 90% of his attacks trivial to dodge). Hence why the meta for the fight became 3x Tanks (usually WAR due to insane IR burst windows on downed Rath) 1x Healer so that people could take extra beatings if they did screw up and the dps check was non-existant. When you understand all of his attacks, have even somewhat okay reflexes, Rath EX is easier than almost any other EX trial in the game due to fireball being the only damage you can't avoid.