Shared Classes Are Not Failures (ie SCH/SMN)

[AceofRains]

We don't need specialized jobs branching from the same base class when we already have the ability to level every job and class on one character. Specializations exist in other games because leveling all jobs on the same character is not an option.

It would be awkward at this point to try to shoehorn in explanations of why job X and job Y have class Z in common when each already has its own lore established. Your personal ideas appear to exist solely for leveling convenience without regard to lore, which is important to the game design even if it's not important to you.

As others have pointed out, the developers said on multiple occasions that SMN and SCH have been a balancing nightmare for them that they don't want to repeat. As it is, SCH doesn't even feel like ACN once you unlock it at 30 because what abilities are retained have so changed quite a bit from what they did as ACN. SMN has the same problem but to a much smaller degree. They may as well never have shared the same base class outside of the lore connection (both use arcane geometries for casting spells and summon entities to assist in battle).

You aren't required to level all 18 combat jobs currently in the game, nor will you be required to level whatever new jobs get added in future expansions. If you don't want to go to the effort of leveling a job, don't do it.

They think Scholar and Summoner is a nightmare because they shared a lot of abilities, which didn’t make sense.

I’m so sorry I don’t want zombie out on this game for 18 hours a day so I can try out each flavor of icecream after a decade of playing. Excuse me for wanting simplicity and convenience out of a game I’ve been invested in for far longer than you. What’s the point of having all these awesome and unique jobs if I never get to experiance them because of how stupid long it takes to level? XI had the same problem back then. All these jobs, and I’m told I have to pick one and like it because I play casually.

[ItMe]

I’m so sorry I don’t want zombie out on this game for 18 hours a day so I can try out each flavor of icecream after a decade of playing.

I just watched someone in my FC take BRD from 1 to 80 in just over 2 weeks of casual playing.
Your hyperbole isn't constructive or appreciated.

[AceofRains]

I just watched someone in my FC take BRD from 1 to 80 in just over 2 weeks of casual playing.
Your hyperbole isn't constructive or appreciated.

You “watched” them over 2 weeks of “casual” playing. I’m playing casual Red mage 70-80 right now. Like literally 1 level a day. It’s week 2 and I’m 77. Your friend isn’t casually leveling. Casual is like logging in, doing dailies, run maybe a roulette or two and pop a level in upper levels. Semi casual is queuing for dungeons to maybe catch a few levels, which requires more investment of time. Hardcore means you’re running all day to hit the cap and sinking a lot of time into it. I’m not interested in sinking an obsessive amount of time for 20 jobs because it gets boring. What is actually wrong with cutting the amount that needs to be done to enjoy every job, literally in half? Nobody can seem to rationally point that out. I just do not get how that doesn’t make sense to you guys. It’s not hyperbole, it’s the reality of it. It’s funny because I blew off being social this weekend just to get a few levels and run daily’s.

[Jojoya]

I’m so sorry I don’t want zombie out on this game for 18 hours a day so I can try out each flavor of icecream after a decade of playing. Excuse me for wanting simplicity and convenience out of a game I’ve been invested in for far longer than you. What’s the point of having all these awesome and unique jobs if I never get to experiance them because of how stupid long it takes to level? XI had the same problem back then. All these jobs, and I’m told I have to pick one and like it because I play casually.

They don't take stupid long to level, though. Are you even trying? I work at leveling jobs casually at best (generally MSQ roulette + hunt bills +beast tribes) and yet I've got 16 of 18 jobs to 80 already and I'm working on the last two.

For someone who's been playing 2 years longer than I have, you've had plenty of opportunity to experience them all, with the possible exception of Dancer and Gunbreaker since those are new as of this expansion.

Also, when you started playing a game doesn't make your opinion more valid than any other player's opinion. It's a silly tactic to use in constructive discussion.

[AceofRains]

They don't take stupid long to level, though. Are you even trying? I work at leveling jobs casually at best (generally MSQ roulette + hunt bills +beast tribes) and yet I've got 16 of 18 jobs to 80 already and I'm working on the last two.

For someone who's been playing 2 years longer than I have, you've had plenty of opportunity to experience them all, with the possible exception of Dancer and Gunbreaker since those are new as of this expansion.

Also, when you started playing a game doesn't make your opinion more valid than any other player's opinion. It's a silly tactic to use in constructive discussion.

I’ve invested more time into the lifespan of this game, I 100% assure you of that. BECAUSE of that, I know what I’m talking about here. I do everything you said. I’m not doing MSQ because that’s cancer to sit through every day- I don’t have time to fall asleep in my chair as Praetorium runs its cutscenes. I sure have had plenty of time, but my time investments went elsewhere than grinding a job on an mmorpg. Like building healthy real life relationships and getting a career and education. My life doesn’t revolve around this game but I’d definitely like to enjoy each job to their best potential. There literally no good reason to not consolidate jobs to classes. None. I’m not asking for faster leveling, I’d buy the stupid level potion if that were the case. I’m asking to cut the amount needed to enjoy every job.

To reiterate, it’s not about how long it takes me to get 1 to 80. Every player can do that at their own pace. It’s about how much time it takes to do that 20 times.

[Mhaeric]

I'm impressed at the mental hoop jumping needed to claim that asking to level two jobs at the same time isn't asking for faster leveling. Sure, one of the jobs won't be leveled any faster than it is currently, but the other job would absolutely be leveled faster than it is now. Another way to put it is that it would take half the time to level two jobs as it takes right now or that it would double your character's overall leveling speed.

As for bringing up jump potions, those are a less effective alternative in the long run than the suggestion of leveling two jobs simultaneously is since they only partially level the job meaning that you still have to invest some additional time to finish leveling them up not to mention them having an actual cost. A jump potion is only better in the sense that it provides instant gratification. Leveling two jobs simultaneously is a delayed gratification but results in a larger benefit in the end: a completely free max level job for no extra effort or cost. And then there's the whole beast of the interaction of these two systems where jump potions would suddenly be twice as effective as they are now, so it's not like jump potions are something completely independent of this suggestion.

Edit: I see that the part of the previous post that I was responding to was clarified with an additional paragraph at the end. This was done while I was writing my post and I didn't see it until after I posted myself, so they probably realized the mental hoop jumping that they were doing on their own so added it. Leaving my post here since it's still a valid point.

[ItMe]

To reiterate, it’s not about how long it takes me to get 1 to 80. Every player can do that at their own pace. It’s about how much time it takes to do that 20 times.

If you wanna focus on that, my question is: how do you sell that to the devs?
The rate of levelling is fine for the average player.
Should we really speed it up for the people who wanna have every job at cap when that would effect everyone?
People making characters on preferred worlds right now are hitting cap by the end of heavensward. If anything it seems like this game needs to add some speed bumps to levelling.

Also, if you wanna level fast you gotta lean into squadrons and trusts.
They start out quite slow but after you build them up a bit they're EASILY the fastest way to level (though that slow start shouldn't be a problem if your aim is to level everything).
Also, do you have all the preorder exp accessories?
Do you eat?
I don't know how levelling more than once a day around 77 is so unbelievable to you, even playing casually.

[AceofRains]

If you wanna focus on that, my question is: how do you sell that to the devs?
The rate of levelling is fine for the average player.
Should we really speed it up for the people who wanna have every job at cap when that would effect everyone?
People making characters on preferred worlds right now are hitting cap by the end of heavensward. If anything it seems like this game needs to add some speed bumps to levelling.

Also, if you wanna level fast you gotta lean into squadrons and trusts.
They start out quite slow but after you build them up a bit they're EASILY the fastest way to level (though that slow start shouldn't be a problem if your aim is to level everything).
Also, do you have all the preorder exp accessories?
Do you eat?
I don't know how levelling more than once a day around 77 is so unbelievable to you, even playing casually.

I don’t mind taking my time with leveling, ya know like I said doing it 20 times to enjoy the pinnacle of each job is what’s awful.

How do I sell that to the devs? I don’t know. I tried to edit the main post to clearly explain my thoughts on the matter, because admittedly my original sentiments were too sloppy. I’ve been nothing but trampled on for discussing this topic, as if saving us all time is some terrible idea that shouldn’t even be suggested. I’ve had like one guy come in here and say what I’ve deduced is actually brilliant and useful. I’ve been so clear that it’s not about sharing abilities or anything that made it complicated to balance Summoner/Scholar. I’ve also been clear that it’s not about speedy leveling. And I’ve been clear that it can clean up a lot of outdated features in the game, especially for a better new player experience.

For now, I’m still enjoying the game as is. Not having this isn’t going to stop me from leveling the jobs that I usually enjoy and make time for, which is usually Healers, Casters, and Ranged. Whether I’d spend 1 hour or all day doing that is just a personal choice.

It is what it is. I probably will not see class consolidation come to fruition despite it being the literal point for the existence of job stones. Originally there weren’t enough jobs to warrant it, but by next expansion, there will be something for every class.

I can’t really be any more clear that it is the best venue of approach for all the content that is jam packed into this game. I can only hope someone more important heeds what I say.

[ItMe]

You're too convinced in the greatness of your idea.
It def has its upsides, but I don't think you understand why

I’ve been nothing but trampled on for discussing this topic,

[AceofRains]

You're too convinced in the greatness of your idea.
It def has its upsides, but I don't think you understand why

Can you sell an idea you don’t believe in?

It’s not my idea. It’s the original intention behind the job system. I’m like, way tired of repeating my self and trying to defend the idea. It’s time to let the thread die, the troll is come back for a snack anyhow.