how does one use blue mage?

[HeulGDarian]

Yeah again youre generalising so im not gonna reply any further, but there are a lot of complaints from people who have got it to 60 and have done max blue content, myself included, and your appeal to authority fallacy is not a show of something being objectively flawed https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/...l-to-Authority . Saying you need to have to have played blu to its fullest to make complaints about it is also mild no true scottsman fallacy, as someone can demonstrate understandings of systems and have fundamental valid complaints about a thing without meeting your arbitrary threshold for valid criticism.

ok. if you say so.

I should propably defend my self a bit more, it never goes good when i leave stuff for interpretation. You say that what im saying is generalized , and an appeal to authority fallacy , what im saying is that i take more seriously arguments bred from knowledge , as in arguments that were made from more than 10 mins of gameplay or thought , you call it authority fallacy, well i can call your stand point anti-intellectualism.
Obviously nothing appeals to everyone , which is why we are having this conversation , the problem is that since blue already has a fan base be it small or large ,again going by stuff that i watched back then in those threads , why would you try to cater to the people who ,according to you are having just balance discussions, keep calling the job garbage. Wouldn't you want to appeal to the fanbase you created?
You will tell me they should listen to the majority but look how other jobs turned out. the whole healer and tank role turned like this to accommodate the skill of the player base as a whole , to become more ACCESSIBLE , and what happened is it lost the most dedicated of their playerbase some which have left.
In the end unless you give me an actual argument as to why it should change or if it is worth changing then we will go nowhere, instead you have opted to just taking the piss.

[HeulGDarian]

im gonna go ahead and search the old forums to give as much of a full picture as possible

Thread number 1:
22 freaking pages , people saying that they are not broken and that they are weak , and thus shouldnt be limited.
people also complaining about limited status in the first place, the job is called garbage and a mistake and people are mad that they cant take it in newer content.
there is also complains that they cant do dungeons when they have no spells to level , and since they made some stuff immune they cant solo those either so the status of blue mage is a solo job is false. Date 20/1/2019 https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...change-my-mind.

Thread number 2 :
15 pages people arguing how to make the job unlimited , turned into a back and forth of you cant do that without ruining current blu mage iteration , and that effectively youre creating another job , some people would like more limited jobs. Date 26/02/2020 https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...ted-Job-Status

Thread number 3 :
10 posts someone asked how to make blu duty finder able , people didnt as much argue as just saying it wasnt made for this and then someone asked someone else why do they think blu is op when they think is underpowered. Date 05/05/2020 https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...-normal-groups


thread number 4
182 pages , fck it heres the link . Date 11/18/2018 https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...our-support%21

thats it the searcher doesnt go any more back , go see for yourselves

[ReiMakoto]

ok. if you say so.

I should propably defend my self a bit more, it never goes good when i leave stuff for interpretation. You say that what im saying is generalized , and an appeal to authority fallacy , what im saying is that i take more seriously arguments bred from knowledge , as in arguments that were made from more than 10 mins of gameplay or thought , you call it authority fallacy, well i can call your stand point anti-intellectualism.
Obviously nothing appeals to everyone , which is why we are having this conversation , the problem is that since blue already has a fan base be it small or large ,again going by stuff that i watched back then in those threads , why would you try to cater to the people who ,according to you are having just balance discussions, keep calling the job garbage. Wouldn't you want to appeal to the fanbase you created?
You will tell me they should listen to the majority but look how other jobs turned out. the whole healer and tank role turned like this to accommodate the skill of the player base as a whole , to become more ACCESSIBLE , and what happened is it lost the most dedicated of their playerbase some which have left.
In the end unless you give me an actual argument as to why it should change or if it is worth changing then we will go nowhere, instead you have opted to just taking the piss.

Straw manning my pointing out of appeal to authority. If someones argument after 10 mins is demonstrably wrong it should be argued against as such, but just saying the devs know more is not an arguement. However someone who has a thought after 10 mins can still have valid and appropriate feedback.

Im not actually someone who advocates it be "changed" per say, but this was not the point of this thread. My stance is that there is no arguement other than "rescources" why a limited and unlimited blu cannot exist alongside each other. Current iteration of BLU already has the framework of a fully functioning level 60 dps, and if you subtract mimicry and final sting it has a balanced dps output as well. I think they should listen the majority in the sense that a form of blu for endgame should exist, i dont want to take away what some people find fun despite my own feelings on the content. I dunno whete youve found this echo chamber of people just calling it garbage but in the threads ive participated in theres plenty of healthy discussion as to how it could work. Your arguments about tanks and healers is imteresting, however as a regular on these forums I dont think I remember people asking for how they exist today other than in the ast crowd, the majority that square seems to accommodate to seems to be rather the silent kind rather than whats said here. And once again you seem to be implying a backwards agumentum ad popularum (appeal to masses), where you are saying the masses are wrong inherently based on past events, which is very wrong just from an argumentation standpoint.

You should also chill my dude, the reason i wasnt giving you my arguments was because this was not the thread for it, and if pointing out the problems with your arguments is "taking the piss" then so be it.

I realise I just broke what i said earlier about not replying to, which is a shame but i guess im bored.

Feel free to go through the threads, there was a good one a month or so ago, but trying to go through the main BLU for duty finder thread could take you a while

[ReiMakoto]

im gonna go ahead and search the old forums to give as much of a full picture as possible

Thread number 1:
22 freaking pages , people saying that they are not broken and that they are weak , and thus shouldnt be limited.
people also complaining about limited status in the first place, the job is called garbage and a mistake and people are mad that they cant take it in newer content.
there is also complains that they cant do dungeons when they have no spells to level , and since they made some stuff immune they cant solo those either so the status of blue mage is a solo job is false. Date 20/1/2019

There will be more threads brb

If youre going to do this link the threads you are looking at for intellectual honesty, i think youre referring to the ffxi thread here but im not sure. If you are referring to that thread I can already tell youre looking through that thread in a particular lens cos I remember good discussion and points being made in it.
Edit: Okay so its that thread, now I know youre not worth talking with lmao, I was engaged in this thread in the last couple of pages and there was some quality discussion there and at various other points in the thread and you summarised it like that lol
Edit: As you seem intent on intellectual dishonesty throughout your search I think I will leave it here, dunno what personal investment you have in this but have fun

[HeulGDarian]

Straw manning my pointing out of appeal to authority. If someones argument after 10 mins is demonstrably wrong it should be argued against as such, but just saying the devs know more is not an arguement. However someone who has a thought after 10 mins can still have valid and appropriate feedback.

Im not actually someone who advocates it be "changed" per say, but this was not the point of this thread. My stance is that there is no arguement other than "rescources" why a limited and unlimited blu cannot exist alongside each other. Current iteration of BLU already has the framework of a fully functioning level 60 dps, and if you subtract mimicry and final sting it has a balanced dps output as well. I think they should listen the majority in the sense that a form of blu for endgame should exist, i dont want to take away what some people find fun despite my own feelings on the content. I dunno whete youve found this echo chamber of people just calling it garbage but in the threads ive participated in theres plenty of healthy discussion as to how it could work. Your arguments about tanks and healers is imteresting, however as a regular on these forums I dont think I remember people asking for how they exist today other than in the ast crowd, the majority that square seems to accommodate to seems to be rather the silent kind rather than whats said here. And once again you seem to be implying a backwards agumentum ad popularum (appeal to masses), where you are saying the masses are wrong inherently based on past events, which is very wrong just from an argumentation standpoint.

You should also chill my dude, the reason i wasnt giving you my arguments was because this was not the thread for it, and if pointing out the problems with your arguments is "taking the piss" then so be it.

I realise I just broke what i said earlier about not replying to, which is a shame but i guess im bored.

Feel free to go through the threads, there was a good one a month or so ago, but trying to go through the main BLU for duty finder thread could take you a while

my problem is that i dont go in all gun ahoy ready to start fights at bars. im honestly trying to see both arguements .
then the arguement comes that says blue isnt overpowered , when he has a full heal on a gcd , death for all bosses except the final ones , that exception includes 8mans , an ignore any mech button , a 5% dps on a 30 seconds cooldown as well as a 5 % dps depending on the element which is irrelevant to anyone but blu if he was unlimited .... til you realise blm still has aspected elemental magic and you know it aint bogus cause his passive increases fire dmg, as well as final sting that you mentioned and the best buffing spell moonflute , a reprisal that works on everything and low enough cds to get their opener up again every downtime.
cracks on that opinion start appearing , this most certaintly isnt a patch and fixed situation , and its why 10 mins of gameplay doesnt give you a full picture

[ReiMakoto]

my problem is that i dont go in all gun ahoy ready to start fights at bars. im honestly trying to see both arguements .
then the arguement comes that says blue isnt overpowered , when he has a full heal on a gcd , death for all bosses except the final ones , that exception includes 8mans , an ignore any mech button , a 5% dps on a 30 seconds cooldown as well as a 5 % dps depending on the element which is irrelevant to anyone but blu if he was unlimited .... til you realise blm still has aspected elemental magic and you know it aint bogus cause his passive increases fire dmg, as well as final sting that you mentioned and the best buffing spell moonflute , a reprisal that works on everything and low enough cds to get their opener up again every downtime.
cracks on that opinion start appearing , this most certaintly isnt a patch and fixed situation , and its why 10 mins of gameplay doesnt give you a full picture

Last reply, look through my post history, ive discussed that all in the past from a high optimisation perspective, a lot of those skills are not as desirable as you would first assume, but what im talking about is the common duty set arguement, where if you take blus already existing optimal dps loadout and sand some of the edges off you have a fully functions dps job. Also death doesnt work on all but final bosses, theres loads of first and second bosses it doesnt work on

[L-Lihzeh]

just FYI, you do have to be in a premade party but the party, does NOT have to be all Blue mages, as long as everyone in the party is level synced, it's 100% learning rate

i just helped a party learn level 5 death, our party was

WHM
BLU (Tank mimic)
BLU ( DPS mimic)
BLU (DPS mimic)

oh nice
so is it reduced odds other wise or no odds for learning spells?

[L-Lihzeh]

Also death doesnt work on all but final bosses, theres loads of first and second bosses it doesnt work on

I would assume so lol, in most games I assume death and doom will fail against most things

(lot of back and forth there)

[Auryan]

What I think people don't bring up is how good BLU is for temporary events like the Moogle treasure hunt and rare collaborations like Yokai.

If you want faster results than casually bumping into dungeons that give law tomes, BLU is your best bet. Get some spells, PF AV and get yourself some easy tomes. Bonus that it's also fun blowing things (and yourself) up.

And with how frequently they add the Moogle events and with Yokai coming back after 5.3, BLU has a little niche for itself. And the content and job being enjoyable is a huge perk.

[Canadane]

:C im bad at formatting cut me some slack

I mean no shade, my dude.
Your effort to help was immaculate!