5.3 is a long way from now so...

**Joven** · 06-08-2020 10:29 AM

I'm I the only one who can spend an entire day doing things in the game and still get nothing done? I've been playing off and on since ARR, have picked up every expansion at release and I'm still nowhere near running out of things to do.

**basketofseals** · 06-08-2020 11:17 AM

Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

While to some extent, yes. That excuse really gets overused. Lets look at 5.1. Only the Firmament and Ultimate take longer than a few hours to complete. The former does have a secondary grind after Ishgard Restoration is complete but that isn't exactly quality content.

That's really entirely subjective. Just because you don't consider it quality doesn't make it so.

You can find people in the Firmament and the Diadem all hours of the day. I'd say that makes it quality regardless of my opinion on gatherer/crafters. People are engaging in the content in large volumes with little complaint.

Fact is, FFXIV playerbase is made of niches. We have two majority groups which is "people who complete the MSQ" people who use glamours. Everything else is a minority. Raiding, roleplaying, gold saucer minigames, housing, side quests, gathering, crafting, BLU, PVP, etc. are all minorities that SE caters to, and sometimes you just have to accept that the content being made isn't for you.

Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

If FFXIV's content can only last if you barely play the game, then yes, it is a design flaw. Most other media doesn't have a monthly sub attached to it. So the expectation isn't there for longer enjoyment. Put simply, when people criticism the lack of longevity. Most aren't expecting to be entertained indefinitely over a three month period. They want something that lasts beyond a week that isn't Savage. And it shouldn't take you playing two hours or less a day to have that.

You're attaching a value to "monthly sub" when it has none. It's 13/15 dollars. If you subbed in and played for literally two hours and put the game down, you got the same or more value than: a middle class restaurant meal, a movie with out concessions, 1-2 drinks at a bar, an ice skating trip, a pool game for 2 for 1 hour, and I'm sure there's more examples but tbh I'm a shut in and don't really know what other people do for fun.

As for savage, around 90% of the NA playerbase doesn't clear the final fight in a given tier. We're not all starving with nothing to do because we don't raid savage. There's content in the game, and just because you don't like it doesn't make it a design flaw.

**ForteNightshade** · 06-08-2020 11:37 AM

Originally Posted by basketofseals

That's really entirely subjective. Just because you don't consider it quality doesn't make it so.

You can find people in the Firmament and the Diadem all hours of the day. I'd say that makes it quality regardless of my opinion on gatherer/crafters. People are engaging in the content in large volumes with little complaint.

Fact is, FFXIV playerbase is made of niches. We have two majority groups which is "people who complete the MSQ" people who use glamours. Everything else is a minority. Raiding, roleplaying, gold saucer minigames, housing, side quests, gathering, crafting, BLU, PVP, etc. are all minorities that SE caters to, and sometimes you just have to accept that the content being made isn't for you.

I have been in the Diadem. While yes, people are there. It's no more than a handful. Likewise, the same goes for the Firmament. The population pretty much crashed the moment the crafting ranks halted. Regardless, I'm referring to the 500,000 Skybuilder points on every DoL/H job. That isn't quality content no more than grinding 10,000 FATEs is. The Firmament itself is fine, and actually pretty decent.

And I do a lot of that content. It still doesn't last unless you do every little thing. That may be their model but that doesn't absolve it from criticism. Hence why practically every other Q&A people bring up Mythic+ and a slew of other things.

Originally Posted by basketofseals

As for savage, around 90% of the NA playerbase doesn't clear the final fight in a given tier. We're not all starving with nothing to do because we don't raid savage. There's content in the game, and just because you don't like it doesn't make it a design flaw.

You're implying all I do is Savage. Which is quite not only an assumption but an incorrect one. I've done everything from FATE grinds, crafting all the way to Ultimate. So please spare me the "you're just a raider" nonsense. I simply disagree. The game doesn't have a bevy of content if you're actively playing for any significant length of time. Sure, if you're only playing a handful of hours a week, you'll be tons waiting. But if not, you're burn through everything even at a slow pace. I brought up 5.1 for a reason. The Firmament and Ultimate are the only two things with any sort of longevity to them. The relic typically fills this gap but it's over in a heartbeat now.

**basketofseals** · 06-08-2020 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

You're implying all I do is Savage. Which is quite not only an assumption but an incorrect one. I've done everything from FATE grinds, crafting all the way to Ultimate. So please spare me the "you're just a raider" nonsense.

That wasn't my intention, and I apologize if I came off that way. Even if someone were to log in to do nothing but savage and unsub, I don't think there's anything wrong with that either.

Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

I simply disagree. The game doesn't have a bevy of content if you're actively playing for any significant length of time. Sure, if you're only playing a handful of hours a week, you'll be tons waiting. But if not, you're burn through everything even at a slow pace. I brought up 5.1 for a reason. The Firmament and Ultimate are the only two things with any sort of longevity to them. The relic typically fills this gap but it's over in a heartbeat now.

To hopefully put this conversation on the right foot, I don't think you're wrong that you'll eventually burn through everything, but I do disagree in the way it should be handled and the expectations from SE.

"Just make more content" isn't an answer I'm sure we can both agree on that, so what's the alternative?

Is there something you feel that this expansion lacked that previous ones did?

Personally I'm down with the crowd of Mythic+ style dungeons.

Also I'm not really sure why you mention relics considering your disdain for the skybuilder's points. Most of the meat of relics was just grinding the same content ad nauseum, at least until pyros was released.

**DrWho2010** · 06-08-2020 05:08 PM

simply flipping a switch and uncapping tomes/unlocking savage is not feasible. if that happens before the catchup patch is implemented, there is no reason to run said content for gear. you've just completely invalidated the work put into it.

turning on old events again... if it's already gone to the mogstation then it's too late for that content.

if you want to try out new jobs then just try out new jobs.

as for relic steps. 1st step is ALWAYS easy. they also specifically said this time they didn't want it to be difficult so it was a more easy first step than others. they're just following their plan. if you don't like the plan... tough tamales.

**Theodric** · 06-08-2020 06:21 PM

The Elder Scrolls Online may not be everybody's cup of tea, though content within the game is built with staying power in mind. It's perfectly possible for a game to appeal to various niche tastes but not lose much of its relevance within a week or two. FFXIV's content simply lacks staying power lately - which is a real shame, since the development team were on the right track when it came to POTD/HOH and Eureka. Refining those two types of content to be further improved and more engaging makes more sense to me than scrapping the content altogether or releasing the equivalent very late in the current expansion cycle.

**AbelArchaniEA** · 06-08-2020 07:56 PM

Originally Posted by Shamsiel

We know now that the patch is a long way to come and the content is pretty much dry atm

The moogle Tomestones are good for mgp farming or the mounts that you missed but... lets face it. Its good and fun for 15 days before the patch, not 2 months.

So, why not letting players something to enjoy, mainly speaking:

- Remove the cap for Allegory tomestones, so people can gear up some more jobs while waiting for the new content, i have all job at 80 now and i could gear something more if only the cap wasnt so ridiculous after all this time.

- Release 1 completed content that is ready for 5.3 and its just waiting for the 5.3 release. (if you have any) (new Eureka / ultimate or whatever)

I know im pretty much pretencious and that some changes require the right timing, i know that the virus wasnt kind to anyone and made things worst for everyone.
Im just throwing out and idea, a request that may sound disrespectful, but im supporting this game and i want to enjoy it at best even now.
Little changes out of the usual schedule could give many benefits to those who are spending their time now on FF14

Im sorry for my English, im just a noob with a keyboard.

There is so much to accomplish in this game that I doubt you have nothing to do.

You probably need to play another game as a break

**Rufalus** · 06-08-2020 10:36 PM

The Singularity Reactor was epic the first time.
The Aetherochemical Research Facility was epic the first time.
The Praetorium was... pretty ok the first time.
This game is really good if you don't repeat it much.

Can I get a reason to revisit story locations?
Weekly expedition to Amdapor to recover artefacts.
Daily Halatali score attack challenge against Flames' finest and captive beasts.
Just to spitball some examples.

I'd trade away 80% of the instances if the ones that remained had replay value.
Note some RNG is needed for replay value, can't be exactly the same run every time.
ARF was epic the first time, but how happy are you on the 37th time roulette brings it up? Pull that mob, take a left, stop at the wall, etc. You know how it goes, you've learned it, you play it like working at a production line now. No variation. Ditto for trials, you know how the phases go, you pre-position for the thing you know is about to happen, excepting some minor rng for things like which player gets a target marker.

You've seen this movie, you don't need to still be here. It bribed you back with tomestones or exp. What are past raids worth when they are no longer part of the current tier item level progression? They had a nice story at least and were epic the first time. How many new players want to farm Weeping City or Deltascape V3.0 now, long past their windows of relevancy? There's a giant amount of content in this game but like 97% of it isn't made to last. I think that's what people mean when they complain. They don't have unrealistic expectations about content production, just want a game design philosophy that gets more mileage out of the assets we already have. For every highly repeatable randomised PotD, there's dozens of scripted linear duties that are only great once ever and made with a single player adventure sort of design mentality.

**thegreatonemal** · 06-08-2020 11:11 PM

I know you all keep looking for a reason to keep playing but stop. This isn't a time sink like old world mmos just stop playing do the things you want then stop till new stuff comes out. Or take the chance to to do things you didn't want to do if you must log into the game each and every day.

**Arcari** · 06-09-2020 12:05 AM

Just add an extra glamour plate slot but make it unlocked with 20k poetics. There, people have something to do, hire me SE.

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