Why people still USE ACT knowing their breaking TOS ??

[Goji1639]

ACT can only ruin one's experience if they let it. What gets me is people claim to not care about their numbers or style of play but then complain when someone calls out said numbers and style of play.

If people do not care then ACT should not be a problem just shrug it off and move on.

Not caring about your numbers and not caring about being harassed are entirely different things. If new players are getting lectured and insulted through every story dungeon by tryhards who pretend MSQ content requires optimal everything, they'll just quit the game.

I don't like using unsupported 3rd party software because it can cause all kinds of problems, and it is technically against the rules. Some unofficial stance that they'll probably not do anything about it isn't enough for me to risk an account I've got a lot of money invested in.

Still, I do wish their were parsers in this game. They help you optimize and DPS races make boring content less boring. We just can't have nice things because people can't keep their opinions about other peoples performance to themselves.

[Melichoir]

Not caring about your numbers and not caring about being harassed are entirely different things. If new players are getting lectured and insulted through every story dungeon by tryhards who pretend MSQ content requires optimal everything, they'll just quit the game.

The 'tryhards' I see do this usually are players who think theyre hot 's' cause they got ACT or read a guide once. This section of the player base tends to end up being casual or midcore at most from what Ive observed - People who dont know things talking down to other players. And even then, this is a rarity. In my time playing, in all the dungeons Ive been in, Ive only seen a handful of instances of a tryhard talking mad crap to a new player. And usually that results in the party telling said tryhard to stfu or get kicked. I honestly dont see the toxic smackdown on new players being widely tolerated in the player base, particularly in casual content.

I don't like using unsupported 3rd party software because it can cause all kinds of problems, and it is technically against the rules. Some unofficial stance that they'll probably not do anything about it isn't enough for me to risk an account I've got a lot of money invested in.

Still, I do wish their were parsers in this game. They help you optimize and DPS races make boring content less boring. We just can't have nice things because people can't keep their opinions about other peoples performance to themselves.

I think YoshiP has stated exactly his feelings on ACT, which was more or less as official as it can get. It literally is a "Yeah its against ToS, but...We dont do anything unless we see people abusing it." Devs know people use it, and savage encounters seem to be designed with some of that in mind. As long as harassment isnt a thing, it's fine. Keeping it third party actually makes it easier for SE too. Build it into teh game, and yes people who dont know how to use it or misbehave with it will become more prevalent, and dealing with said people either means a dramatic rise in dealing with harassment, or even being able to suspend people.

Can you imagine the junk GMs and Devs would have to deal with? "Why am I getting suspended! He clearly wasnt doing enough DPS! So we kicked him for not knowing how to play! If you dont want us to use this tool, why include it!?"

[GeminiReed]

It literally is a "Yeah its against ToS, but...We dont do anything unless we see people abusing it."

Wasn't it more along the lines of detection would require them to do something questionably legal so not really worth the effort of attempting to prosecute usage?

[Awha]

I get what you guys are saying, but if a person calls out your performance in a postive or negative way the end result is someone felt your performance did not meet their standards. On a individual level it is up to you if their criticism is worth looking into or not. Personally I think people get too caught up with the how something is said and not the why. Sure words have the ability to hurt, but if someone runs into an asshole ACT or not they will be assholes.

I think people sweat the small things for too much. When I started out I ran into a rdm while leveling a dog that complained about my damage in cutters cry because my single aoe did could not keep with theirs. Even quoted the numbers. You run into number try hards in normal content from time to time. It is up to you as a person if you let their words impact your experience. When you place too much of the burden on SE or the ToS you end up with this situation where people do not use a tool that could greatly improve their play because they are afraid of getting in trouble, which possibly creates more excuses for assholes to be assholes.

Long and short people need to focus on the why something is said and not focus so much on the how. Information given in a negative matter can still be helpful.

[Goji1639]

Sure words have the ability to hurt, but if someone runs into an asshole ACT or not they will be assholes.

The main issue is giving assholes information to act on. A piece of software that tells these people exactly who in the group they should unload their dysfunctional personality disorder on only emboldens them.

I do kind of want to try out ACT, but I'm not even really sure how talking about it on the forums is received. I used to play WoW and used DPS meters a lot, but WoW actually supported mods. Are mods basically broken for weeks every time there's a patch in this game?

[Mhaeric]

I do kind of want to try out ACT, but I'm not even really sure how talking about it on the forums is received. I used to play WoW and used DPS meters a lot, but WoW actually supported mods. Are mods basically broken for weeks every time there's a patch in this game?

It takes about a day usually. Last patch it was a bit longer, but the guy doing it was on vacation or something so it took about 3 or 4 days iirc.

[SomeRandomHuman]

This page in a nutshell: There are several different groups that use it. Some use it for a positive effect and others use it for a negative one instead. Because the negative ones are misusing it we can't have the shiny because it'll create more problems than it solves.

As several posters have said throughout this thread: Once you're familiar with the jobs and their skills you can easily tell when someone isn't doing something quite right. You don't need a 3rd party app to notice someone being super lazy.

[Melichoir]

Wasn't it more along the lines of detection would require them to do something questionably legal so not really worth the effort of attempting to prosecute usage?

Not really sure. I wouldnt imagine so cause other games have anti cheat software which would work plenty well at finding and banning ACT usage. The only grey thing is the nature of ACT itself. Boiled down to its most simplistic concept, ACT essentially is just your Combat log translated into an excel file. You could techincally achieve what ACT does by simply reading through your combat log and recording things. Itd take forever, but it is possible.

Im more of the thought process that not having a parser makes it extremely difficult to min/max damage necessary to clear Savage and high end content, so it's more of a necessary evil short of redesigning fights to be purely a mechanics issue with little focus on damage output.

[Jojoya]

The main issue is giving assholes information to act on. A piece of software that tells these people exactly who in the group they should unload their dysfunctional personality disorder on only emboldens them.

Sometimes I'm all in favor of giving them tools to dig their own graves. A lot of times that's what it takes to teach them not to be assholes.

I'd much rather have a parser built into the game so everyone has access to the information than having only the PC segment of the player base getting access to it via the third party tools. It's going to get used regardless. Better to level the playing field and give everyone equal access. Those who use the information to abuse other players will quickly work themselves into a ban. Is it a little rough on GMs at first while they get an influx of tickets to handle? Sure, but that extra load disappears fast once bulk of the bad apples get weeded out.

There are plenty of other players who would use the information to help others improve if those others desire. I used do that in WoW via Recount/Skada/Details/World of Logs/WarcraftLogs. Someone would want to improve, I could sit with them at a training dummy or run with them through dungeons and LFR then check the parse to figure what they were doing wrong or poorly, then let them know what to change to improve. I'd get thanks weeks, and even years later on a couple of occasions, because taking the time to make some simple suggestions got them on the road to playing better and playing better improved their overall game experience.

I can't do that here because the ToS doesn't allow us to have that information, and I'm not interested in breaking ToS to get it. Watching buffs/debuffs on target and party frames might give some clues about where some of the problems might lie but it's not a full picture.

[Awha]

The main issue is giving assholes information to act on. A piece of software that tells these people exactly who in the group they should unload their dysfunctional personality disorder on only emboldens them.

I do kind of want to try out ACT, but I'm not even really sure how talking about it on the forums is received. I used to play WoW and used DPS meters a lot, but WoW actually supported mods. Are mods basically broken for weeks every time there's a patch in this game?

Sure but assholes will be assholes. People need to learn that people do things like that cause they get a kick out of it and enjoy the reacation. As another poster mentioned we focus so much on the negative, and allow it to overshadow the positive. People will be jerks, we cannot protect everyone from them, and to try only impacts those who would legitimately get postive use out of it.