Does Square intend to address Market botting?

[ItMe]

I think for the average person who is crafting, it is bad because of a couple of factors.
1. to craft the top gear pentamelding is almost a must have. depending on rng this is usually quite a few million if you need to buy the materia
2. if you plan on selling anything, to beat the bots you need to stand on the market all day

Sure, but the examples they gave (the Alexander mini and stuffed alpha) were items flooding the market because retainers now bring them back. Not crafted stuff.
(Also materia is so easy to come by these days I don't see why anyone would need to spend millions with proper prep unless the RNG seriously hoses them, but that's a separate issue)
But that aside...

so, selling things for higher means you recoup the money spent on materia or crafting materials faster. some are just after mounds of gil as Joy thinks, but I think most think first about making back what they spent initially. for them, the lower the prices, the longer it takes obviously. if you get tons of materia or crafting materials free, its no big what the market price is as its all pure profit. most actual non bot crafters though, arent at that stage.

so, with the time investment needed to sell before the bots (if they are that serious about selling), the cost to craft end level gear materia wise, a crashed market can be.. daunting. the "I spent 11 million stuffing in matera and I can only get 53k per thing I am selling???" would be a bit crushing

thats my thoughts on why it could be bad anyway for average crafters

So a crashed market is bad because you struggle to break even in a saturated market.
Fair... but the flip side is that an oversaturated market seems to overall be a boon in this game.

If the most extreme thing happens (like it did for me) and you go all in, overextend your gil, go broke, and can't make it back in that market... do you suffer?
This happened to me when I tried to go big in the Orchestrion Scroll market, and it sucked to be broke, but your character doesn't have bills to pay.
They don't have to pay any kind of upkeep like paying for groceries or gasoline or rent.
So not having millions of gil doesn't seriously inhibit you like being broke IRL. You can't starve or lose your home. You just... can't buy glamour items and pots for a bit (slightly reductionist, I know).
And gil is so easy to come by that if you do spend all your gil pentamelding it's easy to bounce back, especially since having pentamelded gear opens so many markets and opportunities for you.

Not having money in 14 was simply a mild inconvenience while I bounced back, and in the meantime if a market is oversaturated that just means it's better at moving product... which is what markets are there to do.
And there's where the boon comes in.
I'm happy when I see a crashed market because it means for myself and the rest of the community that the item(s) in that market are more readily and easily available.



So correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like in FF14 a crashed market is:

-- Inconvenient to some (if they've over extended)

-- Annoying to others (people who already at least broke even and the lower prices are challenging further profits)

-- But it's beneficial to literally everyone else and helps keep the game healthy and keeps items/products freely circulating.

[Xoto]

-- But it's beneficial to literally everyone else and helps keep the game healthy and keeps items/products freely circulating.

So this is what actually happens. Every legit crafter tries to compete against a robot who undercuts continuously. Eventually the crafter gives up as their products don't sell. The robot then has a monopoly on the product as all competition as been deterred. The robot then increases the price of the product by 3-5x the previous market value. Who does that benefit exactly? Gaganaskin belt of gathering for 110k?

[ItMe]

So this is what actually happens. Every legit crafter tries to compete against a robot who undercuts continuously. Eventually the crafter gives up as their products don't sell. The robot then has a monopoly on the product as all competition as been deterred. The robot then increases the price of the product by 3-5x the previous market value. Who does that benefit exactly? Gaganaskin belt of gathering for 110k?

That's what actually happens? I dunno... sounds pretty far fetched.
That would require
1.) Nearly every single player putting items on the market to abandon it.
2.) The bot not having other bots to compete with.
3.) This happening on literally every server in your cluster so you can't just use the world visit system to buy the item elsewhere.

Those are some pretty steep conditions.

And regardless... if the prices go high and selling them becomes that profitable... competition would return and the market would continue to change.

[Xoto]

If you haven't been paying attention to the market board then that's on you. It is happening on every server and SE still hasn't done anything about it.
The market doesn't change because the bots are still around.
TBH you sound like a representative for the companies that make the bot programs ItMe.
If you are using botting mechanics... just delete your account.... nobody wants you around.
If you wanna try and defend accounts that violate the terms of service agreement find a different forum.

[ItMe]

If you haven't been paying attention to the market board then that's on you. It is happening on every server and SE still hasn't done anything about it.
The market doesn't change because the bots are still around.

None of us can see 100% of the picture.
All I know is I was finally able to finish my room in my FC's house because almost everything was under 80k, even that new dragon statue item.
What items are you finding that are being aggressively monopolized?

[Kes13a]

None of us can see 100% of the picture.
All I know is I was finally able to finish my room in my FC's house because almost everything was under 80k, even that new dragon statue item.
What items are you finding that are being aggressively monopolized?

in every instance where the bot puts an item up if there are no other items up there, the typical pricing for exarchic gear is about 500k. so bot A goes up at 500,000 gil. Bot B will place at 499,999 gil. I will let you determine how long that takes to drop to a reasonable price range without actual players another scenario is someone has something up with 5 materia, lets say for 700k. does a bot list for 500? nope, 699,999 gil. so not seeing any player benefit there.

as for competition returning... this is just for me anyway, if I leave the market... I dont check the market. chances are good that any "competition" returning, is going to use a bot so, bottom line is, you lose the real crafters who actually play.

the ONLY people the botters wish to benefit are themselves. plain and simple. they dont give a lala's behind about whats best for any player, just them. as long as they can get the gil, and sell for real money, they dont care about the game, people who play.. anything. they are there only for real dollars, not to help anyone but themselves.

as for monopolization.. I am not sure how much you actually do on the market, or if you check a lot, but having the same crafter with items up down to the upper 50's in some cases, one in each category, sounds like pretty aggressive monopolization of any and all gear purchases.

[Prrringles]

None of us can see 100% of the picture....What items are you finding that are being aggressively monopolized?

It's cool and all if you want to chip in here but please do some research before you comment. If you don't know what items are being monopolized you are not a serious crafter/seller and/or have never done any research into botting on your world/data center.

Most bots probably belong to the same group of people divided over the different worlds on a certain data center. They sell almost EVERY item lvl 50 and up. The same goes for the groups farming treasure maps and selling all the cloths/leathers. It's all super obvious if you look into it.

[ItMe]

as for competition returning... this is just for me anyway, if I leave the market... I dont check the market.

Perhaps you should reconsider.
I've made a fair amount of gil supplying product to relatively "abandoned" markets.

[snip]

That's cool and all but I asked for an example.
If you don't have one...
Either way, I noticed they're on a different cluster of servers than I, so I was more inquiring as to what the landscape looks like for them.

I don't think he's saying that cheating is good for the game. He's saying low marketboard prices are good for the game.

This is 100% what I'm trying to get at.
Thank you for saying it so clearly when I couldn't but fumble around the idea.