5.X Relic Feedback Thread

[Barraind]

(and this is a big assumption)

The short answer is that 40 of your best secondary stat and 120 of your second best isnt better than 340 of your worst secondary stat

Without situations where only 2 substats add meaningful impact (Say ninja's had a stance with high uptime that makes everything DHit, but they cant crit), 3 extra materia slots will almost always beat better stat allocation.

[Ivellior]

Eureka was shit content. If the relic wasn't tied to it it would have just been another diadem. Dead in a couple of weeks.
You can tell it's bad from the way people play it. Instead of forming parties and grinding mobs like the designers intended, everyone just runned around in a big train trying not to die.
If you joined with a group of people who where lower level you didn't get xp, so grouping up was even further discouraged, so you couldn't get help or play with friends if the difference was too high.
Solo was impossible for most classes. You were forced to play with others. If there was a train and you could join it was good, otherwise tough luck. If you didn't do it on time when there were a lot of people tough luck.
They added a TON of rewards and people still didn't want to do it. People still hate it to this day. You might like it, but it that doesn't mean it was good.

Besides relic was originally designed with 2 purposes.
1. Give a catch up weapon to players that isn't difficult, but requires time.
2. Repopulate the old content and help players already doing said content.

And it totally failed on 2nd purpose.

[Dreamsoap]

Eureka was shit content. If the relic wasn't tied to it it would have just been another diadem. Dead in a couple of weeks.

There's servers dedicated to running BA on a weekly basis. Popping your head into any of the maps currently shows trains running hourly, people are constantly progressing through every zone.
I've even seen a recent uptick in new players in Anemos, I'm assuming it's because everyone is using it as an easy poets grind (two birds on stone for SHB and SB relic grind.)

You can tell it's bad from the way people play it. Instead of forming parties and grinding mobs like the designers intended, everyone just runned around in a big train trying not to die.

You have to do NM trains to progress to the next map. I can't imagine anyone find grinding mobs to be the exhilarating part of Eureka, if you're mid range in a given map you used NM trains as a means to knock out your clogs.

If you joined with a group of people who where lower level you didn't get xp, so grouping up was even further discouraged, so you couldn't get help or play with friends if the difference was too high.

This is the one valid criticism and something I wish they'd fix. I want to be able to power my friends through the early parts of Anemos which was a true barrier to entry. I hated it at that level.

You might like it, but it that doesn't mean it was good.

Eureka has been significantly nerfed down to a much more enjoyable level. People still like it to this day. You might hate it, but that doesn't mean it was bad.

[Ivellior]

There's servers dedicated to running BA on a weekly basis. Popping your head into any of the maps currently shows trains running hourly, people are constantly progressing through every zone.
I've even seen a recent uptick in new players in Anemos, I'm assuming it's because everyone is using it as an easy poets grind and two birds on stone for SHB and SB relic grind.

So you need to find an out of game application (discord?), find the said discord server/channel and then be able to run the content. I'm sorry but that just means it's dead content.
I can do all previous relics by doing stuff already in game, populated with players without even having to look for information outside the game on how to complete the said content.

You have to do NM trains to progress to the next map. That's by design.

So you are telling me that being a a low level character (say level 2), having to join a train in order to progress, having to dodge mobs, die all the time just in order to be able to level up (because there are no normal parties) is by design?
And that happened just in a short week or two after the content came out. People do trains because it's the most efficient way, and because doing it normally is shit.

I'm inclined to believe that the designed method is that you need to spawn the fate and kill the boss fate. Since people are killing monster all the time in the instance the boss will spawn naturally.
When it was relevant (ie when it came out) those boss fates would spawn since a lot of people were doing the content. When people moved on the only way possible to do it was trains.

You can claim that trains were a thing because of efficiency. That's true. People used to farm brayflox HM for efficiency during previous relic steps. That didn't impede normal people from doing thins normally.
You can do previous relic quests and steps just fine with not hassle. It's plainly badly designed content. Just like diadem.

People still like it to this day. You might hate it, but that doesn't mean it was bad.

I like B-rate horror movies, that doesn't mean they are good.

[Eldevern]

Eureka was shit content.

Eureka it still pretty lively for shit content. Weird.

[LaylaTsarra]

Eureka it still pretty lively for shit content. Weird.

It sure is and many of us loved the content. Interesting to see how many people have marbles when A train hunting.

https://i.imgur.com/fGSFvCo.jpg

It sure wasn't a failure although according to the forum soothsayers Anemos was supposed to die when the first wave of people hit 20 and would give up on the content. No one would ever get to Hydatos but oddly enough this alt just earned a WHM relic there with fairly well populated zones and an active BA Discord group running that content almost daily.

If you haven't given it a try lately the nerfs have made the content very manageable even with small groups. I am glad to see they haven't nerfed BA though.

[EtherRose]

Eureka it still pretty lively for shit content. Weird.

It sure is and many of us loved the content. Interesting to see how many people have marbles when A train hunting.

https://i.imgur.com/fGSFvCo.jpg

It sure wasn't a failure although according to the forum soothsayers Anemos was supposed to die when the first wave of people hit 20 and would give up on the content. No one would ever get to Hydatos but oddly enough this alt just earned a WHM relic there with fairly well populated zones and an active BA Discord group running that content almost daily.

If you haven't given it a try lately the nerfs have made the content very manageable even with small groups. I am glad to see they haven't nerfed BA though.

This is exactly the community right now on EVERYTHING. You have part of the community who didn't like it and part who did. Then when SE does something different for a first-part relic it happens again. Some of the community likes it, some doesn't. SE just can't win no matter how they try to implement things to appease their players. You will always have people who are divided and will complain.

[Eldevern]

...

For my part, since ARR, what I'm waiting is a relic with two possible ways. I don't mind the feeling it takes forever to complete. I'm more bothered if there is some kind of wall that block the path. Grinding for an half from time to time is fine to me. But an Ex (or Coil or Savage/Ultimate), if I have to lock three hours, three evening a week, to train and farm Ex... I will just pass, because of the latency I often have especially in prime time.

The description of the fights in the patchnote really make me think we will end with some kind of Eureka where fates are replaced by the sons (and/or the daughters ;p) of BA with some Ex. To slow down other players because of some wipe related to my bad ping doesn't sound to me as a fair behavior for other players and I wouldn't feel satisfied either the clear the content such way.

The Factory or Eden normal are already so-so because of the latency.

[Ivellior]

This is exactly the community right now on EVERYTHING. You have part of the community who didn't like it and part who did. Then when SE does something different for a first-part relic it happens again. Some of the community likes it, some doesn't. SE just can't win no matter how they try to implement things to appease their players. You will always have people who are divided and will complain.

That is not true. There is a lot of content people don't like but will not complain about. Deep dungeon or the casino mini games are a good examples. Most people don't do Deep dungeon or the mini games, but neither get much hate. It's an extra feature for people that want to do it.
The problem with Eureka is that is was forced with the relic. Very few people would complain if we had relic like in ARR or HW and Eureka was it's own thing. People thought Diadem was crap content but it didn't get the same dissatisfaction as Eureka did. It got complains at the start, people just didn't bother doing it, and it only ended up being used for gatherers. And that is despite the fact that SE added a ton of incentives and rewards (mounts, gear, etc) for players in diadem. Last patch they gave up and just made it gatherers only.

Eureka would have just been another Diadem if relic wasn't forced in it. And people were not happy because of the previous expectations people had for relic. You had ARR and HW relic which gave you a pretty good indication of what is expected of the relic weapon and they got an entirely different thing. Combined with the fact that is was shit content with a myriad of problems, it aggravated the entire situation even more.

If people want another Eureka style content, that's fine, but it shouldn't come at the expense of relic. Let it be its own thing and survive on its own merits. Besides relic has always been (baring Stormblood) a way to repopulate old content (like fates, dungeons, etc) and forcing relic on it's own separate instance is a detriment for older content.

[Eldevern]

...

I'm not sure we can compare Eureka and Diadem. I agree they were somhow alike with fates, agressives mobs and grind overall but there were two different things : the conditions of access (special item to enter, sized party) and this bothering mount/wind matter.