I love beautiful animations.. but I think they're too slow for this game

[Elcura]

Anyone who disagrees with getting rid of animation locks needs to be silenced and put down. It's the one thing this game needs to really free itself battle wise and make future encounters much more fun. I remember how much fun I had running around to beat Ifrit for the first time, but that soon turned to frustration as I kept getting killed because of animation locks.

In all honesty, animation locks really need to be removed from abilities. You could technically keep WS animation locks, or even make weaker WS with no locks to give a bit of diversity.

Right now most battles you have to tank and move it becomes a matter of staggering all your abilities and WS so you can avoid enemy WS. It doesn't feel good and makes tanking a lot more frustrating than it needs to be. Chances are you'll die more because of animation lock and server response than due to reaction time.

I think WS need to be sped up, though I do disagree with the amount. Certain WS (Aura Pulse, Wide Volley, Whirlwind etc) have stupid long startup/recoveries because we're forced to sit and watch while our character lands on the ground and gets up again (slowly) or swings an axe around a couple of times before actually doing something.

There's a lot of wasted time between the animation and the actual damage, and most times waiting for those 1-2 extra seconds isn't worth the damage or effect you get and often during a movement based fight is what causes death.

[Nikita]

Hmm, fix annoying animation locks? No thanks, having my character become completely frozen in combat whenever I use an ability, rendering me vulnerable to any AOE attack a monster might use is one of the few things that separates this game from other MMOs. Oh, and there is no way they could possibly make animations look good without stripping the ability to move my character from me for about 6 seconds every time I use an ability.

*sarcasm off*

Honestly, I think think the only way you could be against this suggestion is if you were a masochist or someone bashing games like WoW for the sake of trying to look cool in a community where there can apparently be only one MMO that you can extract even the smallest amount of enjoyment out of.

I love all of the animations, but the whole animation lock just has to go. It isn't an unreasonable request, they can still give us amazing spell/ability animations without restricting all movements/actions.

Oh well, here is to hoping this is among their list of things fix'd in 2.0!

[Onidemon]

Thanks bustacucumbers for chiming in.

I really am not a harsh person in real life, but when I see the kind of illiteracy on display in the last few posts I sort of have to respond just so it doesn't derail the discussion.



Soo... a poor impression of me? Have you heard of a cosmic speed limit? A light year is a measure of time, the time it takes light to travel in one year. It's also really long distance-wise. That's the great thing about a light year. It's a measure of both distance and time at once. I'd say your reading comprehension could stand to improve about one light-year's worth, this time referring to the distance you'd have to go to do so, and probably also the amount of time it'd take. By the way, it would take you millions of years to walk that far, which coincidentally is probably enough time to improve your reading comprehension and re-think some of your basic skills, like the one you failed to employ that incorrectly related skill to animation lock.

So let me get this straight. To the people that have said this game is a waste of time because "predicting" animation lock is a shitty measure of gameplay, you would say to them, "Learn 2 Play?". I really couldn't have a poorer impression of you, but I hope you post something else to impress me.

To continue the discussion, I agree that the auto-attack of a Marauder should be looked at closely to make sure if it is changed it still looks natural.



More illiteracy: So let me get this straight, because I suggested that animations be sped up that automatically means "ridiculous speeds" right? Because it's hard for you to think in between two extremes? Because you can't imagine anything in between animation lock and "ridiculous speeds"? Did I get you right?

And also, because I posted a video of a "particle effect" that automatically meant you had to say you don't think particle effects suit FFXIV right? Because it was impossible for you to look at that video and read what I was saying and NOT come away with the impression that we were discussing particle effects? The fact that we were discussing the separation of spell effects from animations didn't even enter into the equation when you decided to post, am I wrong?

I'd really appreciate it if you could equip some reading comprehension gear the next time you join the discussion. Wouldn't it be nice if we were discussing the same thing in this thread? Imagine that.

On another note, while Dark Souls does have weighted animations it also doesn't animation lock you like FFXIV does. Dark Souls is also much better thought out as a combat system than FFXIV. FFXIV tries to draw from both the fast-action pool and the animation-lock pool, and the two don't mix well. In my opinion the slow, weighted animations only really work when you have a hitbox and an action battle system, not an auto attack, target-based system like FFXIV's. If you want to discuss something, why don't we discuss that?



So now we are talking about limiting the animations.. and the colors??? Huh!?!?!?! I think the animation should just be faster. If anything, more fluid. Less like you're watching a documentary on animations in a museum and more like real life. Also, I think the beautiful colors should stay! And be separable from the animation when appropriate. It might even be way cooler looking that way.

And also, I feel compelled to address the illiteracy in your post. You felt... compelled.. I'm sure, to call out the "people" who are "comparing" WoW to FF. /airquotes. Has one person in this thread compared the two games? I remember bringing up some features of WoW's animations, but I don't remember comparing the games to each other. In fact, the only references to WoW are on a technical level in this thread. So it must be a child's game if a player expects responsive character movement during battle? I don't think you mean to say that, but then again I'm pretty sure your brain turned off as you started your last paragraph and automatically typed some bullshit about WoW vs FF.

Despite that, I'd really like to hear your more focused opinions on the OP.

Dude let them say wtv they want. Truth is, if the game doesn't get a bit faster and more dynamic, come 2.0 this is something the critics will frown upon and this will cost points to the game again and lower it's chances of drawing more customers.

Battle in most new MMOs these days are going for more dynamic battles, everything is at a much higher pace then in FFXIV. And that's because people enjoy that. This is where you show you skills, in the middle of the actions where you need to react quick. Not when you got all the time in the world and that the game is so slow that you can actually queue actions using a controller....there's no skill or even much fun in that.

I say to Yoshi-p, make 2.0 more dynamic. I want to be able to move in battles and to do it for a good reason, not just stand there for 10min hitting the same button over and over. Make us feel the rush of battle.

[Adamas]

Agreed. Please at the very least remove the character "buffing" animations. So annoying. I don't even use them most of the time because they interfere with my dps.

[Eldaena]

I once said that it would be neat if they slowed down the combat during certain moments... think Alice: Madness Returns and Prince of Persia. Even Vindictus. Maybe as we do a battle regimen in the future or during the final blows of the defeat of a boss the entire fighting slows down and we see us smashing the the target for some choice screen shots at the same time. =p I'd actually like to see the animations, but the focus on speed in every aspect in combat is kind of not allowing them to showcase their visuals. Kind of sad because people just want them removed because of this fast-paced combat.

I think it would be nice if there was absolutely no animation lock, but I don't think it would be fair for it to not exist as well. Since the spell casting revisions it would unbalance things even further for PvP if that is their primary focus on key combat movement mechanics and their balance...

[Rjain]

I WAS IN BED.

I was tired, I had just woke up, I decided to reach for my phone and check the forums because I was bored but was too lazy to get out of bed. First post I see was this one. It pissed me off so much I jumped out of bed, ran downstairs, skipped breakfast, only to make a post filled with dire rage.

What kind of nincompoop are you? So basically the only thing this game received good ratings on, you want scaled back? In case you didn't know, something a lot of other MMOs are being bashed on lately are their poor animations, even Guild Wars 2. The animations in this game are amazing. No, they shouldn't be sped up. I think the developers made a post recently saying they might decrease the time on some of the animations such as crafting. Maybe instead of sawing three or four times you saw two times. You don't speed the god damn animation up so it accomplishes 4 strokes in one second.

Animation is something I have a hobby in and have worked in a bit. Speeding up animation looks absolutely terrible. Some of the suggestions made here are so mindblowingly outrageous that just envisioning it already spells disaster for this game. You are literally suggesting what makes the game good should go back to being shitty.

Animation lock? Okay it's annoying sometimes, but if you don't suck at the game it shouldn't be a problem. Things take practice, whether you're animating at light speed or going slow as a turtle. Personally, I would rather the battle look good than have it feel like I'm playing something like WoW. My friend just started on some private server for WoW a few weeks ago and I decided to help him out because I used to play the game ages ago, but I couldn't stand more than an hour of it. The animations, primarily. The game felt HORRIBLE compared to this one. In fact, every MMO does.

GRRRRRRRRRRRRR.

[Tonkra]

Yeah.... gotta love a game that actually makes you want to play WoW. I gave up on WoW years back, but after I played long enough during the free to play period of ffxiv, I actually wanted to go back to WoW. I told myself I wouldn't play it anymore, but just the thought of pressing a button and my character actually responding in real time was just too enticing.

You really take simple things like that for granted. FFXIV really opened my eyes on how stressful a game can be without adding anything to really stress over. The control scheme is just that poor. The Ifrit fight is the perfect eye opener. People view the primals as a tough fight, but it's for all the wrong reasons. The ifrit fight in theory is probably one of the easiest fights ever. Only thing that makes it unnecessarily difficult is the fact that the game never responds to your actions when you actually need it to. You actually have to predict when ifrit is going to use a move so you don't risk getting your character stuck in a lockout spell animation. REALLY?!?!?!? This game doesn't reward good reactions, but good mind-reading ability?

My only hope in 2.0 is that they "actually" fix the issues, and not just touch them up. Like the OP said, the dev team needs to play WoW. It's 2012 now. Simple actions taking place when you command them should not be a difficult thing to accommodate to anymore.

well i can understand some critics from you... on the other side, it makes FF something unique..

i mean its some kind of more "turn based" although its not turn based..
i mean Final Fantasy 12 for example is also a mixture between turn based and real time..

i like that, thats unique in MMorpg genre! its like you compare Diablo to Heroes of Might and magic. all mmorpgs are the same in gameplay, FFXIV is different.


WoW is like any fucking MMO out of there.. rift, SWTOR, Warhammer online... ALL the same.
so why not leaving FFXIV just a bit special?



dont get me wront.. it needs improvements . MUCH better responding to your actions (aborting spells still doesnt really work by just moving), a little faster.


and i think just traits could be 100% instant, and while moving.. i dont understand why a simple trait (sentinel etc.) lets you stop at a place.
animation lock should be removed for traits and spells. an effectfull WS like for lancers need animation lock for the animation itself.

[Vadavim]

Crafting
Sorry but if you don't like waiting then crafting probably isn't for you. No doubt it feels a bit boring, and they do intend to streamline some things. Personally, I'm hoping the upcoming effects to "speed" things up won't make it look even more unnatural. Before they touched it up originally it looked wrong. For example with Culinarian. Your start chopping normally with a knife, and halfway through you go all psycho and start chopping really quickly then slow down. It's a little more fluid now but if they get rid of this may as well just have an instant craft like FFXI. Kneel, create a crystal using some kind of element and bam, insta-craft.

Look at it this way: how much immersion does the current system create, and how much are we standing to lose if we implement a faster version? Patience is important for crafting, yes, but there should also be an element of strategy and involvement present within crafting as well. As it stands, I do not think that the willingness to sit through countless crafting animations should be the metric for our "worthiness" to be a crafter.

I like how crafting is more involved in FF 14, and how I have to worry about variables like durability and progress. It makes me feel like more work is going into making an item than simply clicking a button, and that I have more control over the process. My problem is the amount of time that the animations can take, and that during this time I can only sit and watch and not respond or plan ahead. I'm not asking for crafting to be twitch-based, but I think it wouldn't hurt to make it a bit more active. I don't think anyone wants it to be insta-craft or mindless.

[Akumu]

My opinion on on this:

Animation lock is the only problem I have with the current system, other the that the speed doesn't need to be much faster than it already is. WoW/SWTOR speed of gameplay doesn't make anything dynamic.
The encounter itself is what makes the battle dynamic and not how fast you press a button in rapid succession.

The Devs need to worry less about the speed and more about the actual encounter. That's how they will build a solid playerbase, which SE should be looking to do.

There is a good chunk of RPG lovers that enjoy a slower more tactical feel to their game. Not everyone enjoys pressing buttons as fast as they can to win something. The problem with this genre, as it is today, is the fact that every one seems to be offering the same or similar things as the next guy.

game1: Hey! We have turbo charged gameplay with crappy animations and graphics but you have a IWIN button!

game2: Come one, come all! We have turbo charged gameplay with lightsabers and currently working on a IWIN button!

game3: We have turbo charged gameplay and it's b2p! Which means we will make everyone equal so you will feel special enough to buy the next expansion pack!

The genre is starting to make me feel like a kid at the arcade with a pocket full of quarters. The problem with that is I'm no longer a kid. The feeling just isn't the same anymore. Speed is becoming far too overrated in the RPG genre as a whole. What made a RPG an amazing genre is slowing vanishing as people only focus on the "speed". MMOs are starting to become just that in the process.

Massive Multiplayers Online

[Zelkelion]

There is a good chunk of RPG lovers that enjoy a slower more tactical feel to their game. Not everyone enjoys pressing buttons as fast as they can to win something. The problem with this genre, as it is today, is the fact that every one seems to be offering the same or similar things as the next guy.

I absolutely agree. The loss of so many spells from DoM has really negatively impacted their unique tactical abilities... the reason I like to specialize as a mage.