I love beautiful animations.. but I think they're too slow for this game

[AndrewN]

First of all, a light year is a measure of distance, not time. Getting this wrong doesn't invalidate your opinion (unfortunately) but does give a very poor impression of you.

I have to say, I disagree with your post as strongly as possible. Not every game has to be sped up as much as possible, there are lots of games like this out there already, and some of us like a slower pace in their games. Especially for Marauders (Warriors) the slow but heavy attacks feel appropriate but I like the pace of the game.

As for animation locks, use some skill to play the game. All of the enemies attacks are in some way predictable, attack when it is safe and don't just spam attacks.

[illriginalized]

First of all, a light year is a measure of distance, not time. Getting this wrong doesn't invalidate your opinion (unfortunately) but does give a very poor impression of you.

I have to say, I disagree with your post as strongly as possible. Not every game has to be sped up as much as possible, there are lots of games like this out there already, and some of us like a slower pace in their games. Especially for Marauders (Warriors) the slow but heavy attacks feel appropriate but I like the pace of the game.

As for animation locks, use some skill to play the game. All of the enemies attacks are in some way predictable, attack when it is safe and don't just spam attacks.

This x1000000

I loled at the light year bit too... there's nothing wrong with the animations.. if anything they just need to figure out how to make two different animations flow like liquid.. if that makes any sense.

SE please don't limit the artistic animations.. the colors are vibrant and beautifully detailed.

People... seriously stop comparing WoW to FF. If you wanna brag about what you like in WoW vs FF.. then.. go back to WoW. Seriously stop trying to turn this game into a child's game.. there's FF fans and there's posers who just want a game to entertain themselves with.


Ya I went there.

P.S. during tough battles... most of the time I'm not looking at my own animations but I do enjoy watching the animations of others in my PT.. and during those tough battles most of the time I'm recording it in 1080p resolution. I can watch all the animations afterward.

[Neptune]

Thanks bustacucumbers for chiming in.

I really am not a harsh person in real life, but when I see the kind of illiteracy on display in the last few posts I sort of have to respond just so it doesn't derail the discussion.

First of all, a light year is a measure of distance, not time. Getting this wrong doesn't invalidate your opinion (unfortunately) but does give a very poor impression of you.

I have to say, I disagree with your post as strongly as possible. Not every game has to be sped up as much as possible, there are lots of games like this out there already, and some of us like a slower pace in their games. Especially for Marauders (Warriors) the slow but heavy attacks feel appropriate but I like the pace of the game.

As for animation locks, use some skill to play the game. All of the enemies attacks are in some way predictable, attack when it is safe and don't just spam attacks.

Soo... a poor impression of me? Have you heard of a cosmic speed limit? A light year is a measure of time, the time it takes light to travel in one year. It's also really long distance-wise. That's the great thing about a light year. It's a measure of both distance and time at once. I'd say your reading comprehension could stand to improve about one light-year's worth, this time referring to the distance you'd have to go to do so, and probably also the amount of time it'd take. By the way, it would take you millions of years to walk that far, which coincidentally is probably enough time to improve your reading comprehension and re-think some of your basic skills, like the one you failed to employ that incorrectly related skill to animation lock.

So let me get this straight. To the people that have said this game is a waste of time because "predicting" animation lock is a shitty measure of gameplay, you would say to them, "Learn 2 Play?". I really couldn't have a poorer impression of you, but I hope you post something else to impress me.

To continue the discussion, I agree that the auto-attack of a Marauder should be looked at closely to make sure if it is changed it still looks natural.

I love Final Fantasy XIVs animations. They are fantastic and look the part.

Having played both WoW and SWTOR. I thoroughly dislike their combat system, there isn't nearly enough emphasis on animations and player's barely give a shit to how their character acts in battle, their eyes are just fixed to the User Interface cool-downs. World of Warcraft's animation style is cartoon, and thus character's can get away with moving their body at ridiculous speeds (reference of your first link), both XI and XIV still have a set of human weight to the animations that make them play out their part. Much like Demon and Dark Souls, weighted animations make the combat stand apart. Having a player-wide particle effect (referencing your second link), while it is "cool-looking" such particle effects on all characters, especially if it can be done in town; will drastically affect the performance of some machines, and once again, it suits WoW due to it's artistic style.

Final Fantasy XI and XIV on the other hand are much more slower combat systems that rely on the building of TP, long cast times, and some truly beautiful effects to follow once a player can disperse that TP or cast that spell. I think what you're asking to happen will change the game quite thoroughly, the animation lock is the only issue present, there is no need to change the current animations.

More illiteracy: So let me get this straight, because I suggested that animations be sped up that automatically means "ridiculous speeds" right? Because it's hard for you to think in between two extremes? Because you can't imagine anything in between animation lock and "ridiculous speeds"? Did I get you right?

And also, because I posted a video of a "particle effect" that automatically meant you had to say you don't think particle effects suit FFXIV right? Because it was impossible for you to look at that video and read what I was saying and NOT come away with the impression that we were discussing particle effects? The fact that we were discussing the separation of spell effects from animations didn't even enter into the equation when you decided to post, am I wrong?

I'd really appreciate it if you could equip some reading comprehension gear the next time you join the discussion. Wouldn't it be nice if we were discussing the same thing in this thread? Imagine that.

On another note, while Dark Souls does have weighted animations it also doesn't animation lock you like FFXIV does. Dark Souls is also much better thought out as a combat system than FFXIV. FFXIV tries to draw from both the fast-action pool and the animation-lock pool, and the two don't mix well. In my opinion the slow, weighted animations only really work when you have a hitbox and an action battle system, not an auto attack, target-based system like FFXIV's. If you want to discuss something, why don't we discuss that?

This x1000000

I loled at the light year bit too... there's nothing wrong with the animations.. if anything they just need to figure out how to make two different animations flow like liquid.. if that makes any sense.

SE please don't limit the artistic animations.. the colors are vibrant and beautifully detailed.

People... seriously stop comparing WoW to FF. If you wanna brag about what you like in WoW vs FF.. then.. go back to WoW. Seriously stop trying to turn this game into a child's game.. there's FF fans and there's posers who just want a game to entertain themselves with.


Ya I went there.

P.S. during tough battles... most of the time I'm not looking at my own animations but I do enjoy watching the animations of others in my PT.. and during those tough battles most of the time I'm recording it in 1080p resolution. I can watch all the animations afterward.

So now we are talking about limiting the animations.. and the colors??? Huh!?!?!?! I think the animation should just be faster. If anything, more fluid. Less like you're watching a documentary on animations in a museum and more like real life. Also, I think the beautiful colors should stay! And be separable from the animation when appropriate. It might even be way cooler looking that way.

And also, I feel compelled to address the illiteracy in your post. You felt... compelled.. I'm sure, to call out the "people" who are "comparing" WoW to FF. /airquotes. Has one person in this thread compared the two games? I remember bringing up some features of WoW's animations, but I don't remember comparing the games to each other. In fact, the only references to WoW are on a technical level in this thread. So it must be a child's game if a player expects responsive character movement during battle? I don't think you mean to say that, but then again I'm pretty sure your brain turned off as you started your last paragraph and automatically typed some bullshit about WoW vs FF.

Despite that, I'd really like to hear your more focused opinions on the OP.

[Drazzan]

More illiteracy: So let me get this straight, because I suggested that animations be sped up that automatically means "ridiculous speeds" right? Because it's hard for you to think in between two extremes? Because you can't imagine anything in between animation lock and "ridiculous speeds"? Did I get you right?

For one, please don't make this a personal assault on me. I did not insult you so please don't attack me. I don't post often on these forums for this exact reason. But I feel that I need to post in order for you to realise that you also didn't read my post.
You posted a video showcasing the animation buff-speed in your original post, this buff-speed was entirely fast, and currently buffs in Final Fantasy XIV are also fast, disregarding the cast-timer. The reason a cast-timer exists is purely because it adds a sense of depth to the combat, like it or not, while you're casting a buff, you cannot cure without interrupting yourself first. It adds a layer of strategy to the basic act of using abilities.

I'd really appreciate it if you could equip some reading comprehension gear the next time you join the discussion. Wouldn't it be nice if we were discussing the same thing in this thread? Imagine that.

You seem to love talking big, and claim that I need some reading comprehension the next time I "join your discussion" but you seemed to miss out this piece in my post.

The animation lock is the only issue present

Yet you claim I'm the one that needs to read posts? Animation Lock needs to be removed, it's a pain, but this isn't relative to the "speed" of animations, and the combat system doesn't need to become a case of fast used abilities and succession hot-key chaining.

And also, because I posted a video of a "particle effect" that automatically meant you had to say you don't think particle effects suit FFXIV right? Because it was impossible for you to look at that video and read what I was saying and NOT come away with the impression that we were discussing particle effects? The fact that we were discussing the separation of spell effects from animations didn't even enter into the equation when you decided to post, am I wrong?

As I claimed above, Animation Lock is an issue, but it only becomes an issue when coupled with server lag and instances where it’s integral that you move i.e. Ifrit. In basic combat situations or walking around on my own, I really am NOT bothered by animation lock as it’s not cumbersome in that situation.

To claim that I said I don’t think particle effects suit FFXIV, would be saying that I don’t like the game in its current state. Particle Effects are already present in Final Fantasy XIV, if you would just look up what a particle effect is you would realise this. Final Fantasy XIV is fantasy based, that can’t be denied, but it maintains a sense of realism. Is it so wrong that I felt I would highlight the point that I don’t want character’s covered in pretty effects like that? No. I know it’s not relative to the discussion, but I thought I would “inb4” so to speak. When people think of WoW animations they think over pretty colours and over-the-top particle effects.

On another note, while Dark Souls does have weighted animations it also doesn't animation lock you like FFXIV does. Dark Souls is also much better thought out as a combat system than FFXIV. FFXIV tries to draw from both the fast-action pool and the animation-lock pool, and the two don't mix well. In my opinion the slow, weighted animations only really work when you have a hitbox and an action battle system, not an auto attack, target-based system like FFXIV's. If you want to discuss something, why don't we discuss that?

Finally, I would like to point out that many spells in Dark Souls, as well as pyromancy abilities and arrows do give the character animation lock. This is relative to the combat system, obviously, it adds another sense of strategy to using abilities. With Final Fantasy XIV having a combat system that is based on positioning and moving, perhaps it’s only right that they have animation lock. However the present server lag is what gets us hit, not the animation lock itself. Once the server lag is fixed, this would no longer be an issue, it would be a case of being skilled enough to move out of the way.

Next time you post, please think more before you write. Do not launch a personal attack on me just because you disagree or feel the need to argue my points, go ahead and do that, but tone down on your attitude.

Much Thanks.

[Onidemon]

Thanks bustacucumbers for chiming in.

I really am not a harsh person in real life, but when I see the kind of illiteracy on display in the last few posts I sort of have to respond just so it doesn't derail the discussion.



Soo... a poor impression of me? Have you heard of a cosmic speed limit? A light year is a measure of time, the time it takes light to travel in one year. It's also really long distance-wise. That's the great thing about a light year. It's a measure of both distance and time at once. I'd say your reading comprehension could stand to improve about one light-year's worth, this time referring to the distance you'd have to go to do so, and probably also the amount of time it'd take. By the way, it would take you millions of years to walk that far, which coincidentally is probably enough time to improve your reading comprehension and re-think some of your basic skills, like the one you failed to employ that incorrectly related skill to animation lock.

So let me get this straight. To the people that have said this game is a waste of time because "predicting" animation lock is a shitty measure of gameplay, you would say to them, "Learn 2 Play?". I really couldn't have a poorer impression of you, but I hope you post something else to impress me.

To continue the discussion, I agree that the auto-attack of a Marauder should be looked at closely to make sure if it is changed it still looks natural.



More illiteracy: So let me get this straight, because I suggested that animations be sped up that automatically means "ridiculous speeds" right? Because it's hard for you to think in between two extremes? Because you can't imagine anything in between animation lock and "ridiculous speeds"? Did I get you right?

And also, because I posted a video of a "particle effect" that automatically meant you had to say you don't think particle effects suit FFXIV right? Because it was impossible for you to look at that video and read what I was saying and NOT come away with the impression that we were discussing particle effects? The fact that we were discussing the separation of spell effects from animations didn't even enter into the equation when you decided to post, am I wrong?

I'd really appreciate it if you could equip some reading comprehension gear the next time you join the discussion. Wouldn't it be nice if we were discussing the same thing in this thread? Imagine that.

On another note, while Dark Souls does have weighted animations it also doesn't animation lock you like FFXIV does. Dark Souls is also much better thought out as a combat system than FFXIV. FFXIV tries to draw from both the fast-action pool and the animation-lock pool, and the two don't mix well. In my opinion the slow, weighted animations only really work when you have a hitbox and an action battle system, not an auto attack, target-based system like FFXIV's. If you want to discuss something, why don't we discuss that?



So now we are talking about limiting the animations.. and the colors??? Huh!?!?!?! I think the animation should just be faster. If anything, more fluid. Less like you're watching a documentary on animations in a museum and more like real life. Also, I think the beautiful colors should stay! And be separable from the animation when appropriate. It might even be way cooler looking that way.

And also, I feel compelled to address the illiteracy in your post. You felt... compelled.. I'm sure, to call out the "people" who are "comparing" WoW to FF. /airquotes. Has one person in this thread compared the two games? I remember bringing up some features of WoW's animations, but I don't remember comparing the games to each other. In fact, the only references to WoW are on a technical level in this thread. So it must be a child's game if a player expects responsive character movement during battle? I don't think you mean to say that, but then again I'm pretty sure your brain turned off as you started your last paragraph and automatically typed some bullshit about WoW vs FF.

Despite that, I'd really like to hear your more focused opinions on the OP.

Dude let them say wtv they want. Truth is, if the game doesn't get a bit faster and more dynamic, come 2.0 this is something the critics will frown upon and this will cost points to the game again and lower it's chances of drawing more customers.

Battle in most new MMOs these days are going for more dynamic battles, everything is at a much higher pace then in FFXIV. And that's because people enjoy that. This is where you show you skills, in the middle of the actions where you need to react quick. Not when you got all the time in the world and that the game is so slow that you can actually queue actions using a controller....there's no skill or even much fun in that.

I say to Yoshi-p, make 2.0 more dynamic. I want to be able to move in battles and to do it for a good reason, not just stand there for 10min hitting the same button over and over. Make us feel the rush of battle.

[illriginalized]

So now we are talking about limiting the animations.. and the colors??? Huh!?!?!?! I think the animation should just be faster. If anything, more fluid. Less like you're watching a documentary on animations in a museum and more like real life. Also, I think the beautiful colors should stay! And be separable from the animation when appropriate. It might even be way cooler looking that way.

And also, I feel compelled to address the illiteracy in your post. You felt... compelled.. I'm sure, to call out the "people" who are "comparing" WoW to FF. /airquotes. Has one person in this thread compared the two games? I remember bringing up some features of WoW's animations, but I don't remember comparing the games to each other. In fact, the only references to WoW are on a technical level in this thread. So it must be a child's game if a player expects responsive character movement during battle? I don't think you mean to say that, but then again I'm pretty sure your brain turned off as you started your last paragraph and automatically typed some bullshit about WoW vs FF.

Despite that, I'd really like to hear your more focused opinions on the OP.

OP compared WoW animations to FF animations... favoring WoW animations over FF... That is that WoW's cartooney animations are more streamline than that of FF animations, because FF animations lock up. I guess comprehension skills fails you hard or you're just grasping at straws cuz of my attack on posers and WoW fans.

lol mother of God you talk about illiteracy... yet you over examined my post. WoW is in fact a child's game.. everything about it resembles a child's game and should never be used as a form of comparison to FF. That is just... embarrassing.

Stop being butt hurt or just go back to WoW, poser or.. emo. Take your pick, whatever.


P.S. I'll call out anyone who mentions WoW in this forum and I'll troll them just for the lulz. You mad? Pepper your angus, son.

[Rydin]

OP compared WoW animations to FF animations... favoring WoW animations over FF... That is that WoW's cartooney animations are more streamline than that of FF animations. I guess comprehension skills fails you hard or you're just grasping at straws cuz of my attack on posers and WoW fans.

lol mother of God you talk about illiteracy... yet you over examined my post. WoW is in fact a child's game.. everything about it resembles a child's game and should never be used as a form of comparison to FF. That is just... embarrassing.

Stop being butt hurt or just go back to WoW, poser or.. emo. Take your pick, whatever.

You can compare the responsiveness of other MMOs
Being that the lag/latency of FFXIV is not a graphic issue, there is no reason (Aside from physical server location) that this game can't be as responsive as other MMOs
From a server standpoint... a 40 man raid is more calculation intensive than an instanced 8 man boss

[Noir]

OP compared WoW animations to FF animations... favoring WoW animations over FF... That is that WoW's cartooney animations are more streamline than that of FF animations, because FF animations lock up. I guess comprehension skills fails you hard or you're just grasping at straws cuz of my attack on posers and WoW fans.

lol mother of God you talk about illiteracy... yet you over examined my post. WoW is in fact a child's game.. everything about it resembles a child's game and should never be used as a form of comparison to FF. That is just... embarrassing.

Stop being butt hurt or just go back to WoW, poser or.. emo. Take your pick, whatever.


P.S. I'll call out anyone who mentions WoW in this forum and I'll troll them just for the lulz. You mad? Pepper your angus, son.

Agreed. Wow is garbage. And SE better not down the graphics with this new engine! Keep the same graphic quality and improve on the likes of seeing more players onscreen animations, etc , etc

[Riaayo]

OP compared WoW animations to FF animations... favoring WoW animations over FF... That is that WoW's cartooney animations are more streamline than that of FF animations, because FF animations lock up. I guess comprehension skills fails you hard or you're just grasping at straws cuz of my attack on posers and WoW fans.

lol mother of God you talk about illiteracy... yet you over examined my post. WoW is in fact a child's game.. everything about it resembles a child's game and should never be used as a form of comparison to FF. That is just... embarrassing.

Stop being butt hurt or just go back to WoW, poser or.. emo. Take your pick, whatever.


P.S. I'll call out anyone who mentions WoW in this forum and I'll troll them just for the lulz. You mad? Pepper your angus, son.

I'm pretty sure 95% of the FF community played their first FF games, or even the "legendary" FF7 when they were kids... which makes all the old FF games "kids games." Compare to WoW which has always had a huge amount of adults playing it... what game is for Kids?

Are you of the same philosophy that Anime is for children because it's "cartoons"? I'm sure by getting any sort of response you think yourself a successful troll, and that's fine. Continue living under your bridge which productive people constructed to actually continue on with their lives rather than sit under stuck in the same place, constantly badgering others who pass you by.

I've never played a single game that had this animation lock BS or the ridiculous server lag that this game has. Not a single single-player game or mmo does it except XI and XIV, and you don't beat the competition by ignoring what they do and doing worse than they do.

Insulting WoW, which most of the FF community does, generally only stems from favoritism, fanboyism, and a general lack of understanding for games outside of the FF bubble. Most people I know in FF insult WoW constantly but have never even played it. How ill-informed is that? I'm all for personal opinion but it feels like most people in this community have not even done the research to form an educated opinion. They just sit around, assuming everything that competes with the 1 thing they have ever experienced sucks compared to it.

[Adam]

I've never played a single game that had this animation lock BS or the ridiculous server lag that this game has. Not a single single-player game or mmo does it except XI and XIV, and you don't beat the competition by ignoring what they do and doing worse than they do.

Insulting WoW, which most of the FF community does, generally only stems from favoritism, fanboyism, and a general lack of understanding for games outside of the FF bubble. Most people I know in FF insult WoW constantly but have never even played it. How ill-informed is that? I'm all for personal opinion but it feels like most people in this community have not even done the research to form an educated opinion. They just sit around, assuming everything that competes with the 1 thing they have ever experienced sucks compared to it.

Ria says it best, to rehash the main problem of this game. Not a SINGLE game has this problem other then 11 and 14.