Feedback on Expert Recipes:

[Liam_Harper]

After more experimentation I'm up to 75% rate of Max Quality. Fairly sure I'm hitting a few too many Hasties, need to avoid the temptation of WNII when Manip is up and could tweak further but getting there.

I admit there's more depth to the toolkit than I initially guessed (though still room for tweaks and development) and it's great to see theorycrafting, different methods and discussion among the crafting community again. These forums have been almost dead patch after patch with the regular Master Recipes now they've been handed over on a plate, so it's a definite positive to see crafting that encourages interaction and investment.

As for the crafts, I've found too that I'll just pay full price for Manip if needed rather than burn CP or Durability for a Pliant I might not get. I avoid risking dropping to 10 Dura and missing Centered procs. Curious if Focused Synth is something anyone uses, if you Observe and want to dig again for a condition, 5cp with some bonus progress seems ok on paper, and how are you all burning Good procs? I've been taking Tricks mostly as a safe option and an extra step to dig, unless I'm good on CP and pushing quality, but there's points for Precise to push to IQ11 faster for more quality gains.
Double Brygots tested poorly for me, it's safe but I can run low on CP, fail a second IQ11 and miss out on Max.

[MN_14]

I am doing exactly the same

It takes me 5 min per craft, so 3 craft per syrup

Same, this method is slow as it can take over 100 steps if there are a lot of misses.

You can cheese these in as little as 40 steps sometimes though. I'd say on average, it's around 70 steps for a double byregot's (55-80 for most synths).

There could definitely be faster (possibly riskier) ways of doing these.

[testname]

snip

I tuned myself back to 2544 today, and I don't see difference, just in touch strength

[hqdm]

Did my post get lost? nobody seem to react lol ;_;
Securing with innovation + touch is quite reliable once you meet cp threshold, rather than rely on hasty whole way.

I've tried focus synth, the idea of using "white after obs" procs is enticing, but result is 2cp + 10 dura (so, 14 cp) for 200% prog.
with rapid, can consider this as 500%/50% of the time, or 250% progress. we all know rapid isn't anything resembling reliable, but because you can plan around having veneration up for bursts of it, it can at least be spiked to some extent. But we can't do that for focused bc we're using it more randomly, based on lack of procs. I don't feel focused is worthwhile because without ven, it does ~865 prog, which is really a "death by 1000 cuts" kinda approach to completion, where despite being more reliable, it's unreliable given the conditional use of it with fishing for procs, and that you might end up at the end of a craft without a clear idea of resources required to complete it.

Focused touch otoh feels okay sometimes, as you can consider it a debt of 11 cp (7 going to obs anyways) for 150% qual. Gauging usability is a bit weird again, as I am sometimes raw casting manip for 96 (24cp/10d), the avg cost is a bit higher than the pliant cost of 12cp/10d. So, 23cp or 35cp for 150%, normalizes to 15.3 to 23.3cp for 100%. Given hasty's 60% 10d for 0cp, it has effective cost of 16.7 cp for 100% qual if pliant, and 40cp if raw for 100% qual <on white/blue>, 11.8 cp if yellow (assuming +25%) + pliant and 28.2 cp if yellow + raw. So focused on white after obs is both more efficient than baiting with hasty on white, but less efficient than hasty on yellow if pliant dura. In general, it seems worthwhile given 1-2 raw cast manip/craft, as long as you don't waste it on a yellow.

[Caimie_Tsukino]

Did my post get lost? nobody seem to react lol ;_;
Securing with innovation + touch is quite reliable once you meet cp threshold, rather than rely on hasty whole way.

I've tried focus synth, the idea of using "white after obs" procs is enticing, but result is 2cp + 10 dura (so, 14 cp) for 200% prog.
with rapid, can consider this as 500%/50% of the time, or 250% progress. we all know rapid isn't anything resembling reliable, but because you can plan around having veneration up for bursts of it, it can at least be spiked to some extent. But we can't do that for focused bc we're using it more randomly, based on lack of procs. I don't feel focused is worthwhile because without ven, it does ~865 prog, which is really a "death by 1000 cuts" kinda approach to completion, where despite being more reliable, it's unreliable given the conditional use of it with fishing for procs, and that you might end up at the end of a craft without a clear idea of resources required to complete it.

Focused touch otoh feels okay sometimes, as you can consider it a debt of 11 cp (7 going to obs anyways) for 150% qual. Gauging usability is a bit weird again, as I am sometimes raw casting manip for 96 (24cp/10d), the avg cost is a bit higher than the pliant cost of 12cp/10d. So, 23cp or 35cp for 150%, normalizes to 15.3 to 23.3cp for 100%. Given hasty's 60% 10d for 0cp, it has effective cost of 16.7 cp for 100% qual if pliant, and 40cp if raw for 100% qual <on white/blue>, 11.8 cp if yellow (assuming +25%) + pliant and 28.2 cp if yellow + raw. So focused on white after obs is both more efficient than baiting with hasty on white, but less efficient than hasty on yellow if pliant dura. In general, it seems worthwhile given 1-2 raw cast manip/craft, as long as you don't waste it on a yellow.

Sorry! I think I missed your post T_T
Anyway, yes, I've been switching to this approach as well -- once I hit IQ11, I just GS, Innov, bait, bait, bait, Prep Touch/Precise Touch.... GS, bait, bait, Prep Touch/Precise Touch again. And then easily finish off the remaining quality bar.

Together with the observe-spamming approach, there was obvious improvement with the results:


I'm currently still using my no-control-chest, Matcha HQ and Cunning Tea HQ (final stats 2476 control 611 CP). With the above results, I'm pretty satisfied.

My maxed quality % improved from ~33% to around ~71% now... I think I have conquered the recipe at this point. Thank you all for pointing me to the right directions!

[Cleanse]

Did my post get lost? nobody seem to react lol ;_;
Securing with innovation + touch is quite reliable once you meet cp threshold, rather than rely on hasty whole way.

I've tried focus synth, the idea of using "white after obs" procs is enticing, but result is 2cp + 10 dura (so, 14 cp) for 200% prog.
with rapid, can consider this as 500%/50% of the time, or 250% progress. we all know rapid isn't anything resembling reliable, but because you can plan around having veneration up for bursts of it, it can at least be spiked to some extent. But we can't do that for focused bc we're using it more randomly, based on lack of procs. I don't feel focused is worthwhile because without ven, it does ~865 prog, which is really a "death by 1000 cuts" kinda approach to completion, where despite being more reliable, it's unreliable given the conditional use of it with fishing for procs, and that you might end up at the end of a craft without a clear idea of resources required to complete it.

Focused touch otoh feels okay sometimes, as you can consider it a debt of 11 cp (7 going to obs anyways) for 150% qual. Gauging usability is a bit weird again, as I am sometimes raw casting manip for 96 (24cp/10d), the avg cost is a bit higher than the pliant cost of 12cp/10d. So, 23cp or 35cp for 150%, normalizes to 15.3 to 23.3cp for 100%. Given hasty's 60% 10d for 0cp, it has effective cost of 16.7 cp for 100% qual if pliant, and 40cp if raw for 100% qual <on white/blue>, 11.8 cp if yellow (assuming +25%) + pliant and 28.2 cp if yellow + raw. So focused on white after obs is both more efficient than baiting with hasty on white, but less efficient than hasty on yellow if pliant dura. In general, it seems worthwhile given 1-2 raw cast manip/craft, as long as you don't waste it on a yellow.

Your strategies posted here have been very beneficial.

Honestly, I've yet to find a "do this every time" strategy. Because of the random statuses, having tried my own theories, and reading some of this thread's ideas; I think having knowledge of different tactics has helped save most of my crafts from becoming 35gil vendor sales. Experience is a big part of these crafts.

Also, knowing when to cancel a craft and start over can save a lot of time and headaches.

[Ryaz]

Sorry! I think I missed your post T_T
Anyway, yes, I've been switching to this approach as well -- once I hit IQ11, I just GS, Innov, bait, bait, bait, Prep Touch/Precise Touch.... GS, bait, bait, Prep Touch/Precise Touch again. And then easily finish off the remaining quality bar.

Together with the observe-spamming approach, there was obvious improvement with the results:


I'm currently still using my no-control-chest, Matcha HQ and Cunning Tea HQ (final stats 2476 control 611 CP). With the above results, I'm pretty satisfied.

My maxed quality % improved from ~33% to around ~71% now... I think I have conquered the recipe at this point. Thank you all for pointing me to the right directions!

You only had 1 time where 15 actions failed? That seems to happen to me 1/2 the time now. -_-

[Caimie_Tsukino]

You only had 1 time where 15 actions failed? That seems to happen to me 1/2 the time now. -_-

Yeah, I modified the approach now. So instead of Hasty spam and fail, I go Observe instead. Most of the time, I have Manip up, and just spam observe and let durab float up until the condition's Sturdy or Centered before I go Hasty.

The only time when I hasty spam is when I have 2 early Pliants side by side, which prompts me to use Manip + WN2. Since every Observe would waste WN2 steps, so, naturally, it's an obvious time for Hasty spam even at normal condition. Thus, it was rare to have too many hasty fails.

[Ryaz]

Started using this guide here and I've been doing a lot better. Once I hit 11 stacks, if I get a Sturdy condition, I'll use a Prudent instead of a Hasty to ensure I get something (as long as I have the spare CP) or if I have both Manipulation and WN2 going. If I get a Pliant while both are up, I'll use Prep touch. I can push it until I have 11-15 durability left and I can still do a finisher and complete the craft, which gives me a lot more chances to get max quality. Can even use Precise Touch if CP allows, which it does it you use ToT in the beginning to give you enough extra.

I like the opener with MM + Venerate + Rapid Synth (popping IQ if a normal proc) allowing you to only need 1 RS later on to get one step from completion.

https://attackofthefanboy.com/guides...n-restoration/

[Liam_Harper]

Something I've found useful is mapping out your thresholds to finish the craft rng-free.

As a rough example, at my stats if I'm one Focused Synth from completing the craft and have at least 25300 quality, 45 Dura and 236 CP (224 if you can finish with Basic Synth), the craft is finished and I should stop digging or messing around with any rng. Similarly if I have 60 Dura available, 15104 quality and 308 CP (296 if you can finish with Basic Synth) the craft is done.

Those are just numbers in work as I figure the most efficient finishers, but you get the idea. You can even macro your "finish off craft" button since Poor doesn't exist.

19/20 of the last batch came out Max Quality, so definite improvement.