Samurai Sword Pressure/Shoha Stacks

[xxvaynxx]

Samurai should be able to hold I wanna say about 5 Stacks.
My reasoning is because on a certain point in your double midare, you have press shoha then tsubame midare really fast so you don't hold the GCD for too long and clip, also makeing sure you don't forget and don't overfill on the shoha stack.
Its kinda clunky the way it is now and extra stacks will fix it.

[Ramura_Sono]

Hard no. SAM needs something to actually keep track of. Jinpu and Shifu are literally nothing. Sens are nothing. Even Kenki itself is nothing since every single sen combo generates enough kenki for Kaiten. It's no more clunky than having to weave any other oGCD after midare, or tsubame.

If SAM just absolutely must receive such a change it should be no more than 1 extra stack. If the core of your complaint is simply, truely, honestly, "using shoha betwixt midares is clunky" and not "I want to be able to get double shoha into raid buffs always" than a single extra stack is more than enough.

[xxvaynxx]

Hard no. SAM needs something to actually keep track of. Jinpu and Shifu are literally nothing. Sens are nothing. Even Kenki itself is nothing since every single sen combo generates enough kenki for Kaiten. It's no more clunky than having to weave any other oGCD after midare, or tsubame.

If SAM just absolutely must receive such a change it should be no more than 1 extra stack. If the core of your complaint is simply, truely, honestly, "using shoha betwixt midares is clunky" and not "I want to be able to get double shoha into raid buffs always" than a single extra stack is more than enough.

Hard no because you feel samurai needs something to keep track of? That's a pretty bad argument seeing as other melees have nothing to keep track of no more than samurai if you think that.

Tell me. Which melee has to really focus on keeping try of? Blood of the dragon? Huton? Grease lightning? Twin snakes?
See where I'm going? Why does sam have to be an expectation according to you.

Don't get me wrong, it's not hard to press both quickly but there has been times I have forgotten.
It is the same as pressing a Ogcd between midare and tsubame but why would you? Could just wait after tsubame.
What's different is Shoha isn't a timed Ogcd you can only use it with 3 stacks.
So if mess up you get a pretty hefty dps lost since you'll be behind.
1 stack at most of sword pressure wouldn't buff sam, just a QoL.

[Duskane]

Hard no because you feel samurai needs something to keep track of? That's a pretty bad argument seeing as other melees have nothing to keep track of no more than samurai if you think that.

Tell me. Which melee has to really focus on keeping try of? Blood of the dragon? Huton? Grease lightning? Twin snakes?
See where I'm going? Why does sam have to be an expectation according to you.

You are comparing Shoha stacks to general buffs which not what it is
More like Chakra or Mirage dive its no different
Other Melee have multiple Buffs and OGCD they have to keep track of while Samurai has hardly anything

[Eliadil]

You are comparing Shoha stacks to general buffs which not what it is
More like Chakra or Mirage dive its no different
Other Melee have multiple Buffs and OGCD they have to keep track of while Samurai has hardly anything

I mean, it's not like a Sam has strictly nothing to worry about. We focus on Tsubame cooldown mainly, as well as keeping 100% uptime in order not to drift our rotation.

But I agree, this isn't the change we need on sam. Shoha feels clunky sometimes but that's not the skill itself, more like Tsubame that has to get used instantly or else it goes to waste. Since the 5.0 class changes preview were released peoples said that having Tsubame only usable on the next GCD following a Midare was a terrible idea due to how it forces you into a clunky rotation (erasing a yukikaze sen just to line up every time) since we can't have enough or too few SkS to align correctly.

Everything else on sam is fine and can be adjusted. Tsubame however forces player to adapt to a really bad design choice and causes issues by doing so (weaving shoha between the two). Just give a two or three gcd window to use tsubame and you've fixed sam in every way possible

[Ryaz]

I mean, it's not like a Sam has strictly nothing to worry about. We focus on Tsubame cooldown mainly, as well as keeping 100% uptime in order not to drift our rotation.

But I agree, this isn't the change we need on sam. Shoha feels clunky sometimes but that's not the skill itself, more like Tsubame that has to get used instantly or else it goes to waste. Since the 5.0 class changes preview were released peoples said that having Tsubame only usable on the next GCD following a Midare was a terrible idea due to how it forces you into a clunky rotation (erasing a yukikaze sen just to line up every time) since we can't have enough or too few SkS to align correctly.

Everything else on sam is fine and can be adjusted. Tsubame however forces player to adapt to a really bad design choice and causes issues by doing so (weaving shoha between the two). Just give a two or three gcd window to use tsubame and you've fixed sam in every way possible

It's a combination of instant use Tsubame and change to Hagakure that have caused most of Samurai issues, honestly. I'm not sure why Yoshi thought that Sam was too complicated to play before when removing Hagakure is what lead to the really strict rotations we have now with fillers and the like. Sam was actually easier when you could adapt. Lol.

[Eliadil]

It's a combination of instant use Tsubame and change to Hagakure that have caused most of Samurai issues, honestly. I'm not sure why Yoshi thought that Sam was too complicated to play before when removing Hagakure is what lead to the really strict rotations we have now with fillers and the like. Sam was actually easier when you could adapt. Lol.

at least we got back Hagakure since 5.0 lol. Well... Kinda.

[Shurrikhan]

It's a combination of instant use Tsubame and change to Hagakure that have caused most of Samurai issues, honestly. I'm not sure why Yoshi thought that Sam was too complicated to play before when removing Hagakure is what lead to the really strict rotations we have now with fillers and the like. Sam was actually easier when you could adapt. Lol.

I used to hate the change to Hagakure, but since it's buff it's actually made for an incredibly smooth and consistent curve to effort-to-percentile performance increase across the various manipulations it makes possible in the context of Tsubame-Gaeshi, thus still reaching its upper-level benefits, while also being more casual- and dungeon-friendly than ever. Removing it was devastating. 5 Kenki per Sen was a slap to the face. But 10 Kenki each? It's just punishing enough to be interesting without being overly restrictive.

On topic:
Since we're not merging, and will never have sufficient reason to merge, Meditate and Shoha's hotkeys, just...

1. Let Shoha be used whenever we want so we can enter Meditate with 0 stacks, albeit at reduced efficiency per stack prior to max stacks, e.g. 100/240/400 potency across 1/2/3 stacks so we're not spamming it constantly (lose 22 to 33 potency for using it early).

   Issue: The aforementioned spam and worrying about syncing future Shoha uses to raid buffs, though that's really just skill-ceiling that those who can handle will want and those who cannot, wont.

2. [Simpler and smoother] Increase Shoha damage to 500 potency and have Tsubame-Gaeshi give no Shoha stacks. TG gives about 20% of our total Shoha stack generation. Removing it (5-->4) would therefore have to be compensated for by a 25% increase (4-->5) to Shoha potency.

   Issue: A greater percentage of Shoha uses may fall outside of raid buffs, and we're already outperformed by Summoner, largely due to how much better their burst damage can be realigned to damage windows.

3. [Most gimmicky, but causing the fewest changes] If Shoha stacks are already capped, have TG have the next Shoha refund a Shoha stack instead of granting a Shoha stack instantly.

   Issue: Reduced low-ping hegemony?

[Liam_Harper]

It's a combination of instant use Tsubame and change to Hagakure that have caused most of Samurai issues, honestly. I'm not sure why Yoshi thought that Sam was too complicated to play before when removing Hagakure is what lead to the really strict rotations we have now with fillers and the like. Sam was actually easier when you could adapt. Lol.

Hagakure in SB was in a perfect spot where you could actually ignore it existed outright, giving you a super easy rotation and still pull orange in most content. With that and Seigan giving you an edge, the class was the perfect definition of easy to play but hard to master. It had the little tricks to push a few extra % if you wanted to go further. It was rewarding to play Sam well, but not punishing if you weren't great at it.

Current Sam is indeed more strict and actually more beginner-complex. It's in a great spot dps-wise, but it was more fun in SB and I moved to other classes myself.

I'd say Shoha has been a mess from the start though. Tying it to Meditate was a poor idea and getting "Meditate" stacks from whacking things makes little sense now, it was obvious they just didn't know what to do for the 80 ability. It is strange they reworked Shoha (which could be ignored previously, so wasn't the biggest issue ever), but are stubborn on Tsubame though.

[xxvaynxx]

You are comparing Shoha stacks to general buffs which not what it is
More like Chakra or Mirage dive its no different
Other Melee have multiple Buffs and OGCD they have to keep track of while Samurai has hardly anything

Not gonna try and prove you wrong as its a waste.
Don't join in on a discussion on a job you have no knowledge about. Because if you did, you would know samurai has just as much to keep track of as the other melee's.