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  1. #1
    Player
    Vendalwind's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    340
    Character
    Vendal Solairune
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Ninja Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Lastelli View Post
    And this is why I can't take you "make ranged great again" crowd seriously...
    this.

    SOOOO much this. I mena you start a thread where you specifically ask for WEAKNESSES and then your like 'Nah that weakness sucks'
    Until 5.1 NIN was stuck in TCJ for 6 seconds on average. ping dependent. And yeah. as Lastelli said no single move of BLM requires 7 seconds. But a chain of moves does. and BLM need to chain such moves without moving for max potential output. The suggested MCH change would work much the same.

    Also Yalms are actually pretty easy to gauge, and like any other skill its a practice and learning thing. Thats one you could easily test out with a striking dummy too. if you wanted to make it simpler you could make a rule about only getting the damage bonus outside of melee range, but i feel like that would be too easy

    That said as Kabooa noted we need to reward ranged for something special for their class more than anything else, and movement restrictions really probably aren't the best way.
    I really do think that range restrictions are, or at the very least like discussed bonuses, are the best choice.

    Melee are generally rewarded for positional s. Do you need to do positional s? no. So on occasion you give them up for mechanics. Melee also need to stay in range. Do we always get to? no, and every time we are forced out we have to adapt and change our rotations and alignments.
    Casters are supposed to not move. Do they always get to? Absolutely not haha. They have some utility type skills to mitigate the losses of doing so, but they are still losses regardless
    Ranged could be very easily be given restrictions within the boss hitbox as a downside (can't use certain moves while standing in the bosses circle) standard dmg outside of the circle, and for being 5 yalms+ away a bonus to damage on their basic moves. This would increase the skill gap, and could easily be designed to be a bigger buff than a nerf to the classes.

    I do gotta say tho, that going further for class specific boosts sounds nicer and more doable. MCH for example definately can validate non movement or other restrictions with the need to actually , ya know, build machines. but the general range restriction/bonus would be the most simple and well devised thing i can think of.
    (1)

  2. #2
    Player
    Akiudo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Posts
    514
    Character
    Narumi Akiudo
    World
    Alpha
    Main Class
    Bard Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Vendalwind View Post
    snip
    to be fair, while i've got no clue about mch from all i've seen in the forums and on reddit a lot of nins felt quite unhappy with TCJ and 6 seconds of being rooted, so its not like its some great beloved thing others dealt with with pleasure its just the silly physical ranged complaining. Also generalisations are bad, and at least his bard idea really is terrible, like yea its fine to bring forth ideas even if its just in a general "for example, xyz could be done" way but one has to be open to criticism on that aswell than.
    (3)
    Last edited by Akiudo; 03-08-2020 at 09:53 AM.

  3. #3
    Player
    CKNovel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Posts
    1,915
    Character
    Cassia Kaedhan
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Vendalwind View Post
    this.

    Snip
    I indeed asked for a weakness, not for a throwback.
    We have so much years of different gameplay; Flamethrower from SB and TCJ, despised job mechanics and the "Weakness" is to add more of that.
    It's like asking for more Anatman to nerf MNK and expecting a smile.

    As for positionnals, reminder that hitting the front of the boss is not as much of a loss and doesn't involve mechanics.
    And on top of that, the idea is build in the context of a Ranged alone, no in 8 man teams which will create conflicts between Melee uptime and "Ranged Uptime" strategies.

    As I said the idea is good but it cannot work in FF XIV.
    Also on the opposite I proposed oGCDs/GCDs to be melee ranged and that wasn't took in account, the answer was directly "And this is why I can't take you[...]".
    It's meant to be an exchange, it's criticisim. Every idea is bad until it is polished.
    (0)