This game is in desperate need of persistent progression content for main jobs...

[SieyaM]

This is kinda what relic gear is for. At least in HW you had to play the job you were gearing. It should be the best weapon you can get outside of savage.
But it will depend on what the new relic system is like.

The new relic weapon, while we don't know much, sounds eerily like Eureka to me. So get ready for more grind in a dislocated zone before you can even begin progress on the actual weapon.

[Auryan]

The new relic weapon, while we don't know much, sounds eerily like Eureka to me. So get ready for more grind in a dislocated zone before you can even begin progress on the actual weapon.

Ugh, I wish. Sadly a number people complained about that and now the relics can be done without needing Bozja's exploratory content. It'll likely be a mix of the better parts of the ARR/HW and SB style of relic grind. At least that's my impression.

As long as they keep the Bozja zone-exclusive upgrades (like Eureka's elemental bonuses) for the weapons and gear, I don't really care.

[Granyala]

Anyone else feel this way?

Not me. The last thing I want in this game is some absurdity like Artifact power.
It's okay to be done with a class after a certain amount of time.

[linay]

I am well aware of that.

FFXIV, however, does not having long lasting content. Take 5.2 for example. If you aren't raiding Savage, everything can be completed over a weekend. And that's without spending the whole day on it. That's why this argument falls a little flat. Even if you aren't playing frequently, content lacks longevity. It isn't simply hardcore players running out of content. Back with 5.1 my casual friends were bored because there was nothing to do for over a month.

So while yes, people will run out of things to do faster than it can be developed. That shouldn't happen within the first week or two.

Hardcore players who run out of content and stop paying their subscription when they do must be in the minority. Otherwise, SE wouldn't make enough money.

Though, they probably should have a problem with that.

Why? There are obviously enough players who keep a subscription throughout the expansion. Just because some people run out of things to do, doesn't mean everyone does. (There are even people who run out of things to do yet still keep their subscription, but that's another story and their prerogative.)

[Deusteele]

Yoshida has explicitly said that if you're unhappy, then you should unsubscribe rather then put stress on yourself to just play only FF XIV.

If you're looking for a game that requires you to poop-sock to get anything done, there are legions of P2W games you can grind.

[Renato]

Maybe like a "Prestige system"? That allows you to constantly gain "Prestige levels" for the purpose of... Having a larger level?

I would be entirely cool with some kind of prestge system that allows you to get unobtainable items like the Lonewolf set from the Feast rankings or past event items. Everytime you reach max EXP at level 80, you get a point that can be exchanged for various items. It would at least give people a reason to do dungeons once they hit lv80.

If anything, SE really needs to work on the achievement system as well. There's literally no reason to care about them anymore since all of the items you could obtain are practically given to you nowadays.

I did like the idea of deep dungeons as well. But I hope the next one allows you to use your own gear. I hated the whole light weapon/armor thing. Make the dungeons actually interesting...instead of boring backgrounds, make some kind of labrynth type area akin to the Northen Crater from FFVII with alternate paths. Instead of just annoying traps, have puzzles that require you to work together to solve. Hell, put some jumping puzzles and hidden paths in. Something that requires players to actually explore opposed to just running through looking for chests and skipping enemies.

[Kalise]

Why?

Because SE is a business.

And businesses like to maximize profits.

Why else do you think games try and cater to wider audiences? To get more people paying money.

If even a portion of your playerbase is only giving you 1/3 of the money they could be, why not simply address that and give them a reason to give you 3/3 of the money they could be?

Simply saying "Oh, enough people pay the full amount to keep us going" is not an effective business model.

If anything, SE really needs to work on the achievement system as well. There's literally no reason to care about them anymore since all of the items you could obtain are practically given to you nowadays.

Ugh... Yeah, I mean, the Achievement token things are so pointless these days. Even as a non-Achievement hunter I have over 100 of the damn things after having purchased literally everything from the vendor...

I did like the idea of deep dungeons as well.

I like the general concept of Deep Dungeons. That is, "Roguelite Content". Given I'm an avid player of Roguelite games (Having 1000+ hours in The Binding of Isaac, The Binding of Isaac Rebirth and Enter the Gungeon, as well as some 200+ hours in Paranautical Activity, Crypt of the Necrodancer, Slay the Spire and Nuclear Throne) due to the insane level of replayability they offer.

However, I hate literally every single thing about Deep Dungeons.

The gameplay devolves into a "Just race to the exit and kill the minimum required enemies to unlock it"

The traps are just plain unfun. It sucks when you just insta-die to a bomb trap/chest. Or hit a Toad/Pacification trap and can't do anything for like 30s.

Pomanders range from great to near useless. Any solo run has you wishing for Steel and Strength every 5 minutes while getting a Sight/Safety every floor (So you can avoid the BS traps) but you'll often just get crappy Fortune or the one that puts "More" chests on the next floor/reduces the number of enemies (Which often means it takes LONGER to open the exit...)

Oh and lets not forget about the fact that solo clearing into the later floors requires you to play exactly one job. RDM. Due to needing the sustain from Vercure, whilst having DPS to be able to beat the enrages.

All in all, it manages to miss the key points that make the above mentioned games so fun. In all of the above games, you don't need items if you're good enough. I've cleared BoI through Cathedral with base damage Eve (Lower than average base damage character), I've beaten Lich with Robot's base gun (With a handful of junk from destroying chests instead of opening them for items), I've looped in Nuclear Throne with a Laser Pistol. This means that you don't feel so bad when RNG doesn't favour you, because you know that if you play well, you can still get through the game. Good item RNG merely makes it easier and allows you to become super OP (I.e. In BoI getting tears the size of the screen that will one shot the end boss)

In Deep Dungeons, bad RNG can simply outright kill you and end the run. There is no "Playing well" because you can simply get screwed over by a trap that you literally cannot see unless you have a lucky Pomander drop to be able to. Add in unavoidable damage from bosses (Since, this is still FFXIV) and you can't even "Outplay" bosses like you can in games like BoI, Nuclear Throne, EtG, CotND where all attacks are avoidable and thus you can beat bosses while taking 0 damage.

[MistakeNot]

Though, they probably should have a problem with that.

Since, given that their schedule is releasing content in 3 month intervals, having the game set up so that the optimal way to play it is sub for 1 month, complete all the content added with a patch, then unsub for 2 months until the next content drop is not a particularly great business model.

Lots of players do not play in this "optimal" way. Plenty don't finish all the patch content during the first month. Plenty others use longer subscription times where you can't just drop subscription for a given month.
Personally I like that I can easily take a break of a few weeks and then quickly catch up when I come back. This is a GOOD thing. If the game really wanted me to login and play every single day it would just be stressful, and I would be less likely to play at all.

[Kleeya]

Because SE is a business.

And businesses like to maximize profits.

Why else do you think games try and cater to wider audiences? To get more people paying money.

If even a portion of your playerbase is only giving you 1/3 of the money they could be, why not simply address that and give them a reason to give you 3/3 of the money they could be?

Simply saying "Oh, enough people pay the full amount to keep us going" is not an effective business model.

What you said would be logical for a company having only their mmo out there, and no other game around. But it doesn't apply to SE. They are earning way much more money with people stopping their sub to go buy the FF7 remake (or any other SE games) at full price, than with players staying subscribed all the time to FF14 for only 10 euros per month and not playing anything else.

[Kalise]

LThis is a GOOD thing. If the game really wanted me to login and play every single day it would just be stressful, and I would be less likely to play at all.

Note that having something to do at max level doesn't necessarily mean being required to play every day. Heck, it doesn't even require playing consistently. Since, unless it's made a requirement it doesn't need to be completed.

It just means that if you DO play every day, there's something for you to do.

For example, during Stormblood, we had Eureka. Did you need to complete that? No, in fact, the vast majority of people didn't. Did it make you play every day? No. But if people did play every day, it gave them something to do once they did their dailies.

Oh, and the game already wants you to login and play every single day. With its Daily lockouts on Beast Tribe quests, Roulette bonuses, Hunts and even Mini Cactpot.

It just only wants you to play for like 1 hour to complete all them things and then go away until the following day.

What you said would be logical for a company having only their mmo out there, and no other game around. But it doesn't apply to SE. They are earning way much more money with people stopping their sub to go buy the FF7 remake (or any other SE games) at full price, than with players staying subscribed all the time to FF14 for only 10 euros per month and not playing anything else.

It's not like these things are mutually exclusive.

People can play more than one game. As mentioned in this thread, many people do stay subbed to FFXIV even if they do take breaks from the game too.

If there's actual things to do in the game, you can have people who will play a little bit of FFXIV continually through patches, but then will also buy the new SE games and play them too.

Heck, I do that all the time. I usually have a MMO game I default to, but will still play other releases as they come out without dropping my sub every 5 minutes to do so.