So RDM and SpellSpeed...

[Alu79]

SMN and, to a somewhat lesser extent, RDM are both jobs that are reliant on being able to weave skills between casts. SMN especially can require a lot of double-weaving, and so having an excess of SpSpd can be heavily detrimental as it can cause clipping in these cases. Both these jobs are relatively mobile and have relatively short cast times for spells, unless you make the mistake of hardcasting Veraero/Verthunder anytime aside from pre-pull. BLM, by contrast, relies far less on this kind of weaving and depends on SpSpd to compensate for the longer hardcasting times for its spells. Granted, I have no real play experience with BLM so I can't vouch too much on the specifics, but that's the gist of things as far as I'm aware.

Do people really believe that RDM is a mobile class? Pretty sure RDM is one of the least mobile classes, the proc only works if you hard cast a spell and then you have to use it immediately, not like you store the procs to use whenever. At best you can stutter step after every hard cast but you can't call stutter stepping mobility. BLM has actual mobility assisting CDs all on short timers as well as insta procs that they can hold for when forced to move and SMN has insta casts as well as DoTs rolling and pet skills and an insta cast CD, compared to RDMs 1 insta cast CD. Not gonna list their two instas as they are cast on CD and not held for the possibility of forced movement. I would prolly rank the casts something like SMN>BLM>RDM? SMN might lag behind BLM sometimes I think just based on where they are in the rotation? Any who just wanted to contest RDM mobility as a thing since it is so easy to believe misinformation.

[Mhaeric]

Do people really believe that RDM is a mobile class? Pretty sure RDM is one of the least mobile classes, the proc only works if you hard cast a spell and then you have to use it immediately, not like you store the procs to use whenever. At best you can stutter step after every hard cast but you can't call stutter stepping mobility. BLM has actual mobility assisting CDs all on short timers as well as insta procs that they can hold for when forced to move and SMN has insta casts as well as DoTs rolling and pet skills and an insta cast CD, compared to RDMs 1 insta cast CD. Not gonna list their two instas as they are cast on CD and not held for the possibility of forced movement. I would prolly rank the casts something like SMN>BLM>RDM? SMN might lag behind BLM sometimes I think just based on where they are in the rotation? Any who just wanted to contest RDM mobility as a thing since it is so easy to believe misinformation.

What? Your definition of stutter stepping is strange. RDM get 3.5 full seconds of movement every 5s. Or put another way, RDM only have to spend 1.5s hard casting spells every 2 GCD. RDM don't do stutter stepping at all since they have 3.5 full seconds between every time they cast a spell. More if they use Swiftcast. As an example, their usual 3.5 mobility window is enough time to leap back with Disengagement with it's animation lock and still run back into melee range before the next GCD without losing any uptime. And if a RDM really needs to drop a GCD for whatever reason they have Enchanted Reprise which now is not that much of a dps loss as it was at the start of 5.0. This mobility is extremely consistent and doesn't suffer based on player skill since it's baked into the core RDM mechanic.

To compare, SMN has bursts of extreme mobility but also bursts of poor mobility where they do only have stutter stepping as an option. Their either the most mobile or the least mobile depending on where they are in their rotatuon.

Black Mage generally has very poor mobility but with several tools to give them situational on demand mobility. Their mobility is highly dependent on the skill of the user.

[Karshan]

1.5 seconds is exagerated. 2.5, maybe 2 with slide casting, remember RDM pack no spellspeed.

But yeh half of the time you can move, during your combo you can move (granted around the boss) and worst case you have 1 to 2 reprise per cycle if I remember correctly.

You can anticipate some mechanics and move little by little to the spot before.

Of course it's not as good / safe as aetherial manipulation on BLM or the insta casts on SMN, but it is not a turret either.

[Mhaeric]

1.5s is not an exaggeration. RDM only has a cast time of 2s which with a lowly 1000 spell speed is roughly 1.94s and if you need to move you can do it as early as 1.5s or so and not lose the cast. Most of the you don't need to so it doesn't matter, but when you need to move then you only need to cast for 1.5s.

[Rilifane]

It's not exaggerated.
Jolt I/II, Verstone/ Verfire and Verthunder II/ Veraero II are 2sec basic cast time. So with slidecasting you get around 1,5sec of hardcasting. With your GCD usually still being 2,5sec you can definitely more than half your time and over 3sec of free movement even if played average at best (because slidecasting is something you should be able to handle as a caster) is a lot.
And it's always there. There are no tools, not even player skill needed to get this mobilty.
You don't need to plan ahead, switch around your casts in your rotation or think about it in general. It's something you have all the time.

Playing some bosses on RDM and BLM was like night and day. BLM has mobilty, but almost everything doubles as a dps tool: timing procs correctly to get the most value vs. using them for mobilty and losing value; timing Xeno to get them out under raidbuffs vs. using them for mobilty and losing potency; using Triple and Swift on CD for Fire IV + Despair vs. holding it back and losing a use or losing the dps gain on shorter casts.
The only mobilty we have that's always there and can't be optimized is our fastcasts and slidecasting. Everything else can be optimized and leads to a dps loss if used with focus on mobilty over dps.
AM and BtL needs to be weaved or it's a dps loss aswell.
BLM mobilty is heavily dependant on planning accordingly and player skill, often also on your party. There is next to no basic mobilty that's always there and can be utilized at will without dps loss.

[Karshan]

Holy crap base cast really is 2s. Feels sooo long though, don't know why :/

Even if it were not though, I totally agree on the fact semi mobility on rdm is always there and not skilled gapped.

I feel like, however, SMN & RDM still lack an aetherial type move (obviously with a way longer CD than BLM, more as a panick button to reach a safe spot after greeding that is lacking)

[Mhaeric]

Holy crap base cast really is 2s. Feels sooo long though, don't know why :/

Even if it were not though, I totally agree on the fact semi mobility on rdm is always there and not skilled gapped.

I feel like, however, SMN & RDM still lack an aetherial type move (obviously with a way longer CD than BLM, more as a panick button to reach a safe spot after greeding that is lacking)

You mean like Corps-a-corps and Disengagement which both have similar dps to mobility tradeoff that BLM mobility options have. Most people choose to use them on cooldown for the dps, or slightly less effectively attached to the melee combo, so granted they're not often available for mobility purposes. But they exist.

And SMN has Ruin 2 always available as their mobility tool if needed with a relatively low dps loss so they don't really need an actual movement ability imo. I don't think I would want to use it during Bahamut anyway which is when they don't have mobility because even small amounts of movement mess him up. I can't imagine the mess that teleporting across the battlefield would make of him.

[Katie_Kitty]

You mean like Corps-a-corps and Disengagement which both have similar dps to mobility tradeoff that BLM mobility options have. Most people choose to use them on cooldown for the dps, or slightly less effectively attached to the melee combo, so granted they're not often available for mobility purposes. But they exist.

What? You can't compare corps and displacement to aetherial, they aren't even remotely the same thing. AD is instant teleportation to any one party member you want and it's on a super short cooldown. Corps and displacement (especially displacement), if anything, are more of a hindrance than a boon for movement because you have to use them on cooldown for damage and that means you have to learn the fight around using them. It's not free movement, it's "use this right now or else you're losing damage." It's not, "This helps you," it is "You MUST do this and you MUST learn the fight based around using this." They are two very very different things.

[Mhaeric]

What? You can't compare corps and displacement to aetherial, they aren't even remotely the same thing. AD is instant teleportation to any one party member you want and it's on a super short cooldown. Corps and displacement (especially displacement), if anything, are more of a hindrance than a boon for movement because you have to use them on cooldown for damage and that means you have to learn the fight around using them. It's not free movement, it's "use this right now or else you're losing damage." It's not, "This helps you," it is "You MUST do this and you MUST learn the fight based around using this." They are two very very different things.

I wasn't. I was replying to the suggestion that RDM get some sort of movement ability. I was pointing out that they have one. I also pointed out the dps to mobility cost in my post that you quoted... so?

But while we're comparing them, Aetherial Displacement isn't free movement either. You either have to use it in one of your instant GCD windows which is either highly subjective to where you are in the rotation or if you have a proc available to use and you might as well just run normally, or you have to use it after a hard-casted spell which comes with a dps loss both from the delay that weaving between hardcasts naturally has and also the animation lock that Aetherial Displacement has since it's not actually an "instant" ability taking that into account. BLM on demand movement tools are definitely better than RDM tools, and no one here has said otherwise, but to say that RDM has none or that they don't have good mobility is a falsehood.

[Karshan]

You mean like Corps-a-corps and Disengagement which both have similar dps to mobility tradeoff that BLM mobility options have. Most people choose to use them on cooldown for the dps, or slightly less effectively attached to the melee combo, so granted they're not often available for mobility purposes. But they exist.

And SMN has Ruin 2 always available as their mobility tool if needed with a relatively low dps loss so they don't really need an actual movement ability imo. I don't think I would want to use it during Bahamut anyway which is when they don't have mobility because even small amounts of movement mess him up. I can't imagine the mess that teleporting across the battlefield would make of him.

Except rdm movement is on boss, which has a bad habit of not necessarily be a safe zone on every mechanic.

A mate (that is not a monkey) usually is. Aetherial on only a 10 second CD is quite strong, one of the strongest "personal" utility if you ask me.

As you said every mobility comes at a dps cost though.