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  1. #1
    Player Seraphor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    4,620
    Character
    Seraphor Vhinasch
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Except Aspected Benefit is closer to Adloquium than Regen. So it doesn't have a Regen.
    And you basically confirmed my point by saying Aspected Helios is a Medica II analogue. Why not call it a Succor analogue?
    The only thing AST takes from WHM that is not also shared by SCH, is the fact that it has 2 tiers of basic heal, Benefic and Benefic II. And using Benefic is mostly pointless once you get II. I wouldn't complain if the spell was upgraded, and then you couldn't call it a WHM clone.

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    (0)

  2. #2
    Player
    Kalise's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    1,784
    Character
    Kalise Relanah
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Seraphor View Post
    Except Aspected Benefit is closer to Adloquium than Regen. So it doesn't have a Regen.
    You mean, other than the fact that Aspected Benefic is instant cast? Provides a Regen much earlier than it provides a Shield? Is also alongside a Benefic II which is what Adloquium represents for SCH?

    If you're saying that the heal upon application makes Aspected Benefic more like Adlo than Regen, consider the fact that it is literally just applying the tick of Regen that is lost in the difference from AB's Regen being 15s duration (So 5 ticks) vs Regen's 18s duration (So 6 ticks)

    Quote Originally Posted by Seraphor View Post
    And you basically confirmed my point by saying Aspected Helios is a Medica II analogue. Why not call it a Succor analogue?
    Because Helios exists and is a Medica analogue.

    There is no extra Succor skill that doesn't provide an extra effect. Such a skill can only be created via using Emergency Tactics on Succor.

    Helios literally 1:1 equates to Medica.

    Thus Aspected Helios 1:1 equates to Medica II which is "Helios/Medica but with an additional effect"

    Quote Originally Posted by Seraphor View Post
    The only thing AST takes from WHM that is not also shared by SCH, is the fact that it has 2 tiers of basic heal, Benefic and Benefic II.
    As well as 2 tiers of AoE heal, Helios and Aspected Helios. As well as an instant cast heal with lasting benefit in Aspected Benefic.

    Literally, outside of oGCD's, AST and WHM's healing kits are identical. With the only difference being that AST can eventually use Nocturnal Sect to replace the HoTs with Shields.

    Meanwhile, SCH is still sitting there with a different kit entirely. With the only shared aspect with WHM being the tier 1 heal having no additional effects (Physick and Cure I)

    Adlo takes the place of Cure II and instead of being a big fat heal, rolls in an additional effect in the form of the shield.

    Succor is SCH's only GCD AoE heal, which is taking the place of both Medica and Medica II as a result.

    There is no single target instant cast heal for SCH. They instead have healing from their fairy to provide a similar effect or have to substitute for casting Adlo's for the shield.

    AST could have been unique too.

    It could have had Horoscope instead of Helios/Aspected Helios.
    It could have had Excogitation instead of Aspected Benefic.
    It could have had Benefic instantly proc (And consume) delayed effects on the target (Such as Excog) instead of having Benefic II.

    Causing it to have, not only a unique way of healing through delayed effects, but a base healing kit that is structured differently to that of WHM/SCH (Even if the above does come across very SCH-esk there could have been further alterations, such as drawing cards using a mechanism that provides healing output)
    (2)
    Last edited by Kalise; 04-03-2020 at 03:05 AM.

  3. #3
    Player
    AnotherPerson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Posts
    1,209
    Character
    Cain Andleft
    World
    Malboro
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    I just hope they bring back the card effects that isn't all pure DPS. Going through the AST storyline the first time in 5.1, I was so hyped because I was going to be able to get 6 cards each unique for their situation. Then I read the card effects and had a 'bruh really?' moment where basically all the card effects did the same thing. Royal road was a legend. ;-; I was very disappointed.

    Rather a flat DPS buff on all cards - keep some of the old card effects and adjust them so there's still utility.

    This is just an idea of what I think would probably help the job keep its uniqueness and card system. I hope I can at least see some ideas here being implemented because currently, AST's card system has no real flexibility at all for utility and is utterly boring to shuffle through.

    Assuming the old cards were kept - Balance, Bole, Ewer, Spear, Arrow[?], Spire[??] - they would have to be adjusted accordingly. Ex: If Spear is kept, increase the percentage potency. Even if it isn't a flat Balance increase, your odds of getting something that can contribute to DPS is higher. After all, Crit can also be used for healing too so everyone can benefit from it situationally speaking. If that can't happen, allow the cards to also be placed and used as a debuff on enemies. Ex: Arrow essentially induces a slow effect on the enemy. This would allow AST a lot more solo potential as well in instances if that need be the case even if they can't excel at fighting with pure statistics. Plus, being able to slow a mechanic down would enable less healing time required and more breathing room. Optimizing this playstyle as an AST would ultimately require you to keep track of a lot more factors, but there is a guarantee that all your card effects can definitely impact the battle accordingly and be rewarding in the process.

    As for spire, it could be either a Direct Hit Rate increase or a Limit Break gauge increase. Adjust percentages accordingly. That way people don't need to be compelled to constantly get Balance and every card can see effectiveness and be granted on any character.

    Perhaps make it so when you draw, on the card gauge, you get to see the next 2-3 different cards you can draw (or redraw to remove clunky-ness and keep effectiveness), minor arcana improves the effect of the card by 1.5x to 2x without granting a seal, royal road changes the effect to AoE with reduced percentages. This way you can 'see into the future' and adapt. Of course you may not always have the best cards, but you can't always be dealt with the best hand. The choice now is how to use the cards - improve them individually or turn them into an AoE effect. This can also let your team communicate when your mana is running low and whether there is/isn't an Ewer in sight.

    I would say to scrap the idea of getting 3 different seals for divination because this inherently makes people redraw for the max effect (card effects can only be the same in this situation to avoid losing max potential, which is equivalent to saying everything be dps), making each card have to lose its uniqueness and punishes the player for adapting by playing different cards for the situation.
    (1)
    Last edited by AnotherPerson; 04-04-2020 at 07:44 PM. Reason: for clarity in debuffing because I can't explain coherently without editing multiple times

  4. #4
    Player
    GrumbleBeard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    299
    Character
    Severa Nanase
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 90
    There are a lot of fun and interesting ideas that could be used, but as long as people demand that everything be perfectly balanced with one another things will never change. The reason why most classes of every role feel so similar to each other is because nothing can have a true strength that another does not. I like a lot of the new stuff AST got in shadowbringers, but I wish the cards would have just been removed completely at this point. I liked that the old cards had tangible effects outside of "number get bigger" even if it was only minor. They're just not fun to use as they are.
    (3)

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