Delete Clemency and Vercure

[Lumivyory]

While as a healer main I hate seeing a PLD that start healing themselves when they aren't even below 50%, Clemency needs to stay. Some healers are just bad and self-healing is a way of saving yourself when you drop too low. As a very anxious tank I can completely understand how scary it can be to drop to 10-20% HP.

Other than that - PLD is literally the only tank with no self healing in the main rotation. Even on just level 50 WAR has Storm's Path and Thrill of Battle, GNB has Brutal Shell (which also gives a shield) and DRK has Soul Eater. And Clemency isn't even available at lvl 50.

[tdb]

Other than that - PLD is literally the only tank with no self healing in the main rotation.

Also the only tank with a GCD heal ability. The heals of all other tanks are oGCDs (not counting those which are an additional effect on an attack). In exchange Clemency is spammable, although it does drain a lot of MP.

[Packetdancer]

While as a healer main I hate seeing a PLD that start healing themselves when they aren't even below 50%, Clemency needs to stay.

Agreed: every tank should have a self-heal. I think that Clemency just annoys healers more because the majority of other tank self-heals are side-effects; they'll self-heal as a byproduct of their rotation, or else with something that both heals and damages, or heals as a side-effect of damage, or whatever. Clemency is a more versatile heal (since you can target others), but it's also a pure heal; a tank casting Clemency to heal themselves isn't "well the tank's doing damage and healing themselves along the way" but specifically "the tank is deliberately, consciously focusing on healing themselves", and moreover as it's a GCD with a cast time, it sits there in the party list staring the healer in the face.

And besides self-healing, I'd argue that Clemency is part of PLD's identity as a job; taking it away takes away some of what makes Paladin a paladin; there are solid reasons that in 1.x, PLD was the job that you earned by combining GLD and CNJ.

Similarly, Vercure. It's saved my life in Eureka, it's saved other people's lives in Eureka, it gives me a way to get Dualcast ready outside of combat... it has easily a dozen scenarios where it's useful, any smaller subset of which is enough to justify its existence. And I've also been the PLD or RDM who's around when a healer eats the bad, or gets disconnected (thanks, Comcast), and was certainly very grateful to have healing abilities until the healer could reconnect. And moreover, as a job that's canonically what happened when some surviving Amdapori white mages and Mhachi black mages looked at the Calamity of Water and went "Well that didn't end well. Maybe we should work together to survive this Umbral era?"; stripping out Vercure and Verraise would run against all the lore behind the job. (Heck, I'd argue that there's solid lore justification for RDM to have a Veresuna.)

And hey, there've been situations as a healer where I'm glad to see a PLD or RDM pitch in with healing. Some alliance raid where my co-healer's down, everyone's hurt, and I don't have Swift up. If the RDM can Dualcast Verraise the other healer while I focus on keeping everyone else upright, excellent! If the PLD can focus on keeping themselves up while I hard-rez the other healer, also excellent! Etc.

So as much as I will continue to be mildly annoyed when DPS or tanks think they can manage the healer's kit better than the healer can, I don't think non-healer healing/rez skills should go. I'll just quietly wish that folks who get nervous at seeing their health dip below 70% would learn to trust the healer, and accept that it's often better to let the health drop a little more rather than wasting healing resources keeping folks constantly topped up.

[Tlamila]

And hey, there've been situations as a healer where I'm glad to see a PLD or RDM pitch in with healing. Some alliance raid where my co-healer's down, everyone's hurt, and I don't have Swift up.

I agree with everything you said, but this in particular reminded me of something cool.
We had a Copied Factory run where for some reason our group ended up with no healers by the second boss, so our tank who was a PLD said: don't worry, I'll heal! And they actually did a better job at it than the previous healers, I was shocked. Surely enough they will have done very few to no damage, but in such a situation it was really cool.

[Avatre]

I agree with everything you said, but this in particular reminded me of something cool.
We had a Copied Factory run where for some reason our group ended up with no healers by the second boss, so our tank who was a PLD said: don't worry, I'll heal! And they actually did a better job at it than the previous healers, I was shocked. Surely enough they will have done very few to no damage, but in such a situation it was really cool.

DNC helps with that type of situation as well, as long as everyone is close enough together to all be hit by Curing Waltz. Double heals as long as your dance partner is close enough as well helps tremendously.