Delete Clemency and Vercure

[SamRF]

[edit 06/2020] This thread is 4 months old at this point and my opinion has long changed on the matter. Still interesting to read your opinions and arguments on the topic, but I'm no longer part of this debate so don't direct your comments towards me personally. Everything under this sentence is from 4 months ago (edits as well).[/edit 06/2020]

Edit: for those who don't know, Clemency and Vercure are PLD's and RDM's GCD (fairly strong) single target healing abilities.
Edit+update: I'm convinced the abilities shouldn't be removed because they're part of the identity of both jobs, but I'll be in favor of giving them a cooldown and/or putting them on oGCD.

Original Post:
I'm exaggerating with the title and am not convinced those abilities should be deleted yet, but hear me out:

Very insulting as healer if you see RDM or PLD use Clemency/Vercure when you have everything under control. You're maximizing your dps as healer and thus put in some effort to efficiently heal to extend party will survive only to see the dps gain get completely wasted by that Vercure/Clemency.

At first I kind of liked those abilities when leveling both PLD and RDM, but now have come to hate them when leveling healers to the point I'm wondering if those abilities should even exist. Sure they're really nice abilities if you're doing solo content, but they may suggest the wrong idea to some players by making them believe they should freely use them in group content.

The thing is that healers currently usually rely on their oGCD's for healing while they keep GCD's for dps. In many cases they will let HP decrease so they can make optimal use of their oGCD's. Some RDM and PLD may start thinking they or someone else are going to die with their decreasing health while healer has everything under control and is 1 tap away of getting their HP back up.

There are some exceptional cases, like when healer is dead, or massive overpulling in some specific lower level dungoens, but vast majority of cases I see those 2 abilities used is a complete waste.

The dps loss doesn't bother me that much, it's just not nice for a healer when they're already stuck with their monotone dps rotation and on top of that they deny you of enjoying your job with well timed oGCD's.

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Edit: reply that adds argument:

They're the only potent targeted healing GCD skills outside of the healer role. They will be sacrificing dps when they use it (unless RDM prepares dualcast) and can be used repeatedly. All other self healing skills are oGCD and have a cooldown. Those won't be sacrificing dps and they can't use it very often. In my experience, those RDM and PLD that use Clemency/Vercure for no good reason will continue to use them often. They wouldn't be able to do that if there was a cooldown for example.

It's also the fact that your effort to play optimally goes to waste because of the dps loss of using those abilities. When I'm doing my best to maximize my dps as healer, I'd expect to get the instance progress faster due to my efforts, not stall it even more because the RDM or PLD decide to Vercure/Clemency.

[LolitaBansheeMeru]

don't Blame the skills for a few scardy cats freaking out (although one ability that needs to be removed is rescue I sware I would have lived through so many fights if the damn healer didn't rescue me right into the range because they were freaking out lol

[Bsrking5]

Actually I support the change of clemency and the out right removal of vercure. Non-healers shouldn't be stand ins for healers.

[Mesarthim]

don't Blame the skills for a few scardy cats freaking out (although one ability that needs to be removed is rescue I sware I would have lived through so many fights if the damn healer didn't rescue me right into the range because they were freaking out lol

And we need to stop asking for useful skills to be removed because people have used them poorly.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Actually I support the change of clemency and the out right removal of vercure. Non-healers shouldn't be stand ins for healers.

Only if we can completely remove any and all dps skills from healers. They should be forced to heal only.

[Sebazy]

Clemency is a strange one, it's pretty crippling for the PLD to use compared to the other tank sustains but it's also a pretty handy trick to buy me time for an extra holy or two on larger trash pulls.

I'm actually a pretty big fan of Vercure though, I've healed a few expert roulettes with it when the actual healer has been out of the picture for whatever reason and it actually almost makes dungeon healing a bit of a challenge, certainly way more so than usual.

Eitherway I don't really take offence to players using them, I just see it as an invitation to DPS harder.

[Tsukino]

Those spells are essential to helping keep the identity of the jobs, which traditionally have the ability to heal people.

I do agree that it's annoying to waste a heal, but that happens with the other healer in full-party content sometimes anyway, and it's not a big enough problem to remove the things that make those jobs Final Fantasy jobs. Go too far in on MMO balance and efficiency and you get the homogeneous jobs across roles and bow mage BS that defined the 3.x era.

[ReviaInfantry]

Clemency is PLD continuous self sustain with condition of mp, changing it to target self only is acceptable but not removing it.

Red mage generally ain't vercure until serious derp happens, which you might wish everyone can heal and res.

[Bsrking5]

And we need to stop asking for useful skills to be removed because people have used them poorly.

Rescue is a poorly thought out and implement skill, the easiest change would be to give the target a 2 second invulnerability and that would fix most problems with it. It's useful, but only barely so because of latency.

[SamRF]

Only if we can completely remove any and all dps skills from healers. They should be forced to heal only.

This makes no sense at all with how this game is designed. Both PLD and RDM have engaging dps rotation, not like their healing matters much when it comes to enjoyment of their jobs (although it is pretty fun to be able to solo some older content with the self heals). Healers have literally nothing to do when there's no healing needs, beside dps.

They could change those healing abilities into oGCD's perhaps so PLD and RDM won't lose their identity, but don't know how that would work out balance wise.