Holy now a bannable spell.

[Anzaman]

Time to mass report those pesky crafters! They all spam chat with their abilities. XD

I mean, yeah. If spamming one ability can result in ban, then should all other abilities count towards it too.

Any sort of visual or audial -effects from it, reports going out. :P

[Nethereal]

Oof.

I knew when I saw this post in discord there was going to be a thread like this. I'm only going to say my two cents based off of like 6 pages of this forum since it seems to be just back and forth.

First, what's with the shaming and assumptions that power is always just? "He already has one strike, he must be guilty/troublesome." Honestly what kind of npc do you have to be to think like that.

And the point of spamming a single ability? There is none, it's just to waste time. It's exactly the same as what we're doing right here right now, wasting time on something irrelevant.

Lastly, offense can only be taken not given. Your rights end where mine begin. You don't have a right to request that I do or stop anything when it doesn't effect you. You're not being forced to stay here or to endure anything that I may or may not do, be mature and move along.

[Vidu]

Oof.

I knew when I saw this post in discord there was going to be a thread like this. I'm only going to say my two cents based off of like 6 pages of this forum since it seems to be just back and forth.

First, what's with the shaming and assumptions that power is always just? "He already has one strike, he must be guilty/troublesome." Honestly what kind of npc do you have to be to think like that.

And the point of spamming a single ability? There is none, it's just to waste time. It's exactly the same as what we're doing right here right now, wasting time on something irrelevant.

Lastly, offense can only be taken not given. Your rights end where mine begin. You don't have a right to request that I do or stop anything when it doesn't effect you. You're not being forced to stay here or to endure anything that I may or may not do, be mature and move along.

In regards to the first point: The kind who believes that after being given a warning, consequences have to follow at some point - in this case he was given a warning to behave at somepoint, was potentially asked by other people to stop his holy spam and decided to stick to it anyways.

In regards to your other two points: Why does someone has to spam that ability in a crowded city, where people can have legit buisness - from dealings on the market to following quests to crafting close to a marketboard? If you just want to waste time, why cant you do that in a more remote location, where you can enjoy your holy-spam without inflicting it on others? Just teleport out of the city, walk a few steps and you'll find plenty of space where you can holy your heart out without annoying anyone.
I'm sorry, but spamming holy in a crowded city servers excatly one purpose: To annoy other people - otherwise any other place would serve just aswell, including a private chamber or apartment. But no one would see you there, right? That would be less fun, wouldnt it! This intent isnt very mature, assuming that you want people to leave by trying to drive them off with your holy-spam sounds outright malicious.

For the record: I have all effects but mine turned off or set to limited - mainly because of holy. That spell makes me physically sick by triggering terrible headaches. For a while I was just turning effects off whenever a WHM ended up in my party, but switching those on and off again became pretty annoying, so now they're off for good. My point here is: Turning off effects whil absolulty possible is also annoying. Just like the person who thinks they need to spam holy in a crowded place like Limsa when they could do it just a easly in the corner of a map where no one else is effected by it.
After all... all they want to do is pass the time, right? So it shouldnt matter where they spam.

[Nethereal]

If you just want to waste time, why cant you do that in a more remote location, where you can enjoy your holy-spam without inflicting it on others? Just teleport out of the city, walk a few steps and you'll find plenty of space where you can holy your heart out without annoying anyone.
I'm sorry, but spamming holy in a crowded city servers excatly one purpose: To annoy other people - otherwise any other place would serve just aswell, including a private chamber or apartment. But no one would see you there, right? That would be less fun, wouldnt it! This intent isnt very mature, assuming that you want people to leave by trying to drive them off with your holy-spam sounds outright malicious.

I also dislike holy as it blinds me, I have all my effects turned on, I main WHM. However your thinking isn't logically sound.

First off he was given a strike not a warning. If a cop pulls you over to give you a ticket and calls it a warning but still gives you the ticket, you got a ticket, not a warning. The consequences were immediately and spontaneous, no warning.

Second I don't believe you've heard of Occam's razor.

You seem to be hyper sensitive to the people around you, you care a lot what they're doing and how they feel, but not everyone's like you. It doesn't matter who what or where it is when I do something because I'm bored or want to have fun. I want to alleviate my boredom and I want to do it now. I'm not going to go to my apartment to go fulfill a spontaneous urge I suddenly have, I'm not going to give up my right to be myself because someone might get annoyed.
You ever move around and jump around in game with no rhyme or reason? Regardless of when or where you are? I do. This is the exact same thing.

If it helps you understand where I'm coming from your argument is paramount to : "She only puts on make up to attract guys and uses perfume to give people headaches." Given the evidence you don't know why they're doing it but they've been asked to stop once in the past in who knows what type of situation but because you can see it your immediate response is "She only puts on make up to attract guys and uses perfume to give people headaches." You see what I mean when I say you're attributing malicious intent to something that is most likely than not just pure laziness?

It's not that they put it on for themselves and their self esteem(alleviating boredom). It's not because they just like doing it. It's because they want to attract men(harass people, malicious intent), and that perfume? Why is she using it in public? Obviously because she wants to give people headaches(malicious intent). How dare she use perfume and makeup in public she should be doing that at home(giving up personal rights to appease strangers).

In this case it's actually worse since makeup is premeditated where as spamming holy is spontaneous. You also cannot turn off your nose to stop smelling perfume, but you can turn off your effects. It's also a lot less convenient to go home in real life than it is to teleport somewhere in ffxiv.

Just a slight edit, lack of evidence is not proof of evidence. We do not know they were asked to stop anything, we do not know any form of communication outside an immediate report was taken.

Also

Your "rights" will end when they start to deny other people's rights. That does not need ad hoc rules to deny the one thing you were doing. Legit things can be, and sometime are, abused. Legit use is a thing, abusing is another.

It is called "living in a community", you have basic rules that give you some freedom, and when you extend your freedom so far to reach the point you are limiting freedom of others, you're doing something wrong.

If you want your freedom in a game to be unlimited, solo games are your best place.

You don't have a right to not be offended. When you live in a community you can choose to abide by the rules they set out or be excommunicated. But this was the equivalent of calling the gestapo on someone because one day you decided to go outside and sit in the park and someone was dancing with music there ruining your peace and tranquility. It's a public space for a reason.

[Saefinn]

As often with these cases, I expect there is a missing part to the story.

Let's say there were a group of RPers RPing and he went in to spam off loads of abilities and emotes to harass them for RPing, this would probably count and its something people do and I have reported people for doing it because it can interfere and people like trolling RPers because some people find the hobby to be weird, but it is a community this game supports.

Heck it could have been to harass somebody specifically.

That chat log does very little for context beyond telling us they were spamming an ability.

It is quite common with things like this that people post you only see a part of the picture and not the whole thing and often get reactionary responses. When you don't have the full picture /always/ take it with a pinch of salt.

[Bsrking5]

In regards to the first point: The kind who believes that after being given a warning, consequences have to follow at some point ...

After all... all they want to do is pass the time, right? So it shouldnt matter where they spam.

So just because someone gives a "warning" means it has to be followed?
I'm warning you to stop posting, it hurts my sensitive feelings...
GM interference should be the last option, not the first. There are clear and easy ways to deal with holy spell usage, for everywhere! Should you ban someone in a fate because they were using holy and you couldn't see, no but that's exactly what you are advocating for.

Why stop there thou, ban healers if they have to chain heal tanks to keep them alive, because that's spamming, they can go run squadrons or trust to heal them instead, why play with other people, it's just an MMO where it's one of the core fundamentals.

[Vidu]

So just because someone gives a "warning" means it has to be followed?
I'm warning you to stop posting, it hurts my sensitive feelings...
GM interference should be the last option, not the first. There are clear and easy ways to deal with holy spell usage, for everywhere! Should you ban someone in a fate because they were using holy and you couldn't see, no but that's exactly what you are advocating for.

Why stop there thou, ban healers if they have to chain heal tanks to keep them alive, because that's spamming, they can go run squadrons or trust to heal them instead, why play with other people, it's just an MMO where it's one of the core fundamentals.

If its a legit warning or request that has a foundation in ones actions - yes?
If my posts would include vulgar language, it would seem very reasonable to me if that got pointed out and I was asked to stop swearing so much.

There are such things as reasonable requests and reasonable behaviour - holy spam when there are mobs around is reasonable, thats what the skill is for. Holy spam in Limsa is not reasonable.
Requesting that someone stops swearing is reasonable - requesting that someone stops talking alltogether is not reasonable in most situations.

...and in this case: who knows how many people asked the person in question to please stop spamming holy and only got the GM involved after they got ignored?

[LalaRu]

Your "rights" will end when they start to deny other people's rights. That does not need ad hoc rules to deny the one thing you were doing. Legit things can be, and sometime are, abused. Legit use is a thing, abusing is another.

It is called "living in a community", you have basic rules that give you some freedom, and when you extend your freedom so far to reach the point you are limiting freedom of others, you're doing something wrong.

If you want your freedom in a game to be unlimited, solo games are your best place.

[Saefinn]

So just because someone gives a "warning" means it has to be followed?
I'm warning you to stop posting, it hurts my sensitive feelings...
GM interference should be the last option, not the first. There are clear and easy ways to deal with holy spell usage, for everywhere! Should you ban someone in a fate because they were using holy and you couldn't see, no but that's exactly what you are advocating for.

Why stop there thou, ban healers if they have to chain heal tanks to keep them alive, because that's spamming, they can go run squadrons or trust to heal them instead, why play with other people, it's just an MMO where it's one of the core fundamentals.

Depends on the warning and the situation...but that is the whole point of a warning, it has little weight or meaning if you don't follow through.

The problem is, you and a lot of other people are making assumptions on very little information.

Reason given to player: spamming
Action corroborated: spamming holy
Player has previous offense
GM to send more details via email
Context: player has not been forthcoming as far as I can see (even then, we are taking their word for it) and GM not present to give it

Additional points: spamming of abilities is common, this is this first since release in 2013 I've ever seen such an issue be a thing...so much so this doesn't seem to be a common thing.

So maybe...just maybe there's missing information here, because we only have a snippet of what happened and the only bit that paints the action in a bad light.

This is basically tabloid journalism. A snippet of a situation, not the whole picture and only the bit to elicit a reactive response.

What if, as myself and others have said, this was a part of the user harassing other players, like in my example, people RPing, which it can be very disruptive of? This was common when I used to RP on Gilgamesh and we'd be met with trolls every so often because some people seem to have problem with people who like RP.

Perhaps the GM could have been clearer if this is the case, but the GM's audience here is somebody who knows the context by which they were spamming, not the outside world scrutinising their log.

But it is a testament to how easily people can be manipulated and without even needing to lie, just by omitting parts of a story. The title says it all "holy is now a bannable spell", which is in itself misinformative, because even if we assume the events to paint the right picture in the log, even the title omits information (it should be for "spamming Holy" if we make that assumption). So I am very suspect that the claim is disingenuous.

[Nedkel]

Can i report players who has a glamour that i dont like to look at?
Can i report and get banned someone for socializing with other people? I am lonely bugger and seeing people playing together makes me mad.
Can i report people playing songs the wrong way? Its also annoying and even disrespectful.
Can i ask where is the line ending this madness??