Moogle Tomestones problem with Rival Wings

[OskarXCI]

Because we've always been randomised in RW, but we could always play on the same GC in FLs. It's a drastic change.

GC matchmaking made matches one-sided. It gave newcomers a bad first impression of PvP in general.

People complain that the PvP playerbase is so small all the time. It’s not really inviting for new players when the most active mode doesn’t have a fair matchmaking system.

[Covfefe]

GC matchmaking made matches one-sided. It gave newcomers a bad first impression of PvP in general.

People complain that the PvP playerbase is so small all the time. It’s not really inviting for new players when the most active mode doesn’t have a fair matchmaking system.

Three teams, two will lose.

The fundamental principal of that mode is that even with even match making you will lose twice as much as you win.

And even match making is not something that is possible because stronger players do not get stronger abilities that make up for the players they end up que-ed with.
This attempt results in the most average team winning and the strongest players being paired with a larger pool of weaker players that are guaranteed to lose.
Notice after the adjustments the complaints about matching making? This is because a match making that tries to make complainers of unfair matchmaking happy must put the worst players together on a team in an attempt to balance a few best players.
The end result, bam, splat.

It was a lot more fun before the que-changes.
Before the changes, if you were a low rated player there was still a chance of ending up on a mostly stacked team.
Under the current system, if you are a low rated player, you'll end up with lots of other low rated players on a team formed to balance a higher rated player that can't solo a 72 player mode.

Moonlite, I suppose you don't Role Play?

[OskarXCI]

It was a lot more fun before the que-changes.
Before the changes, if you were a low rated player there was still a chance of ending up on a mostly stacked team.
Under the current system, if you are a low rated player, you'll end up with lots of other low rated players on a team formed to balance a higher rated player that can't solo a 72 player mode.

All I hear is people here complaining that they can no longer GC stack and bulldoze over the other teams. Very unsportsmanlike behavior. The winrate will now be closer to 33% for everyone and not some having 80% while others have 15% or lower.

Forced Freelancer results in shorter queue times. That alone makes the current system better.

Like there hasn't been a dominant faction in PvP in every game lol.

So trying to improve matchmaking is a waste of time?

[Covfefe]

All I hear is people here complaining that they can no longer GC stack and bulldoze over the other teams. Very unsportsmanlike behavior. The winrate will now be closer to 33% for everyone and not some having 80% while others have 15% or lower.

Forced Freelancer results in shorter queue times. That alone makes the current system better.



So trying to improve matchmaking is a waste of time?

I have a 22.2% win rate as an Immortal Flame. 117 Matches.

You know what? About half those wins were awesome when they happened.
As in, take a screenshot for the folder awesome.
Under the current system, the elation of winning from the underdog country will never again be known.
This is an exaggeration, but imagine being a team Jamaica beating team Canada in Olympic Ice Hockey.
Well, if you "re balanced" all the players to all the countries; would people care to enter the olympics as much?
Would people care to watch as much?
Surely it would become hollow without the foundation of countries.

Under the new system it still will not balance out; because the people at the bottom will be grouped together to balance the ratings at the top.
They will go on a long losing cycle because of this, and quit. The bottom will keep getting replaced while those that bubble up in winning streaks will persevere through that losing streak.

The end result will be people still complaining of losing too much.

The only solution for this kind of person is one team, and fighting against scripted opponents so that everyone wins.

My love is to build things, not to destroy them.
So what if some people work together to win more - they built that.
Why destroy it? Why not enjoy the building and creating process.

[Divinemights]

Forced Freelancer results in shorter queue times. That alone makes the current system better.
So trying to improve matchmaking is a waste of time?

Better?
You are referring to the situation where I have to suffer because of people trying to play for PvE Objective in a PvP mode?
Such as calling for a S rank node when this GC only need 50 more points to win?
Better?
I would rather to have the original pvp community size

[BloodRubyXII]

All I hear is people here complaining that they can no longer GC stack and bulldoze over the other teams. Very unsportsmanlike behavior. The winrate will now be closer to 33% for everyone and not some having 80% while others have 15% or lower.

Forced Freelancer results in shorter queue times. That alone makes the current system better.



So trying to improve matchmaking is a waste of time?

Pretty much, Adders dominated for the first few weeks of Onsal, and then like what happened to Maelstrom, started tanking hard because loads of leeches went to Adders to get carried to easier wins, which in turn meant Flames and Mael were able to get a lot of games back from them. To cap it off, Adders obviously had longer queues times (which some adders players circumvented by queueing freelance just so they could play, even if it meant a loss) and because people had swapped to them, they were stuck there, which freed up a lot of good players to swap OUT of Adders, and the cycle would have continued if forced freelancer wasn't a thing. In like the last 2 weeks of GCs meaning anything before forced freelancer, Flames were absolutely murdering Adders on Light. Like before forced freelancer, my winrate was actually better on Flames in FLs than it has been since the change, even though statistically we've always been one of the worst GCs with the few players that are half good at PvP turning freelancer on.

[OskarXCI]

TL;DR

You sure go a long way of trying to justify uneven teams.

Better?
You are referring to the situation where I have to suffer because of people trying to play for PvE Objective in a PvP mode?
Such as calling for a S rank node when this GC only need 50 more points to win?
Better?
I would rather to have the original pvp community size

Situations like that can very much happen for an opposing team.

It's now random. It can happen to you, it can happen to others.

Pretty much, Adders dominated for the first few weeks of Onsal, and then like what happened to Maelstrom, started tanking hard because loads of leeches went to Adders to get carried to easier wins, which in turn meant Flames and Mael were able to get a lot of games back from them. To cap it off, Adders obviously had longer queues times (which some adders players circumvented by queueing freelance just so they could play, even if it meant a loss) and because people had swapped to them, they were stuck there, which freed up a lot of good players to swap OUT of Adders, and the cycle would have continued if forced freelancer wasn't a thing. In like the last 2 weeks of GCs meaning anything before forced freelancer, Flames were absolutely murdering Adders on Light. Like before forced freelancer, my winrate was actually better on Flames in FLs than it has been since the change, even though statistically we've always been one of the worst GCs with the few players that are half good at PvP turning freelancer on.

So keep track of which GC is dominating on what data center? Feels like too much of a hassle and a lot of uneven matches. Force Freelancer and be done with it. (what they did).

[Covfefe]

PVP is Player vs Player.
Players are uneven.
Teams are made out of players.
Team PVP will be uneven.

Players can improve themselves.
It is good to allow players to stack.
This encourages improvement.

I like to fight against the dominant que.
It makes me better.
I also understand why people want to arrange a dominant que.
For them, it is a different form of improvement than what I seek.
Let them, I embrace a different challenge.

If however, you determine fairness not availability of choosing correct control inputs, but by result that disregards the choices of control inputs then that is a path to innervation and death.

If the goal is for all to win the same amount, then what point is there in doing any more than showing up, not caring, letting the time run out, and collect the reward.
What those wanting all players to have the same win ratio should seek is a game mode where score is assigned randomly on equal chances each tick no matter what the players do.

I'd only show up to a mode like that while doing some other work and mostly afk.
If I want to sit at a screen and controls and play I want what I do to matter.
Prior, it did. I did see my win rate go up from the underdog team.
I did get to see the overall quality of my grand company improve by investing time and effort typing encouragement and looking to a better next moment.

No point now. Growth of those beside me is no longer is structured to improve the world around me.
If equality of outcome is valued over incentive to grow the way to the former will be through tearing down.

[BloodRubyXII]

So keep track of which GC is dominating on what data center? Feels like too much of a hassle and a lot of uneven matches. Force Freelancer and be done with it. (what they did).

Not sure if you've misinterpreted what I said or what, but please elaborate. I was better off being on the same GC every game even though it wasn't particularly stacked than I am now under the random system where I can win a ton of games in one day and then win like 2 over the spam of 2 weeks.

[BloodRubyXII]

GC matchmaking made matches one-sided. It gave newcomers a bad first impression of PvP in general.

People complain that the PvP playerbase is so small all the time. It’s not really inviting for new players when the most active mode doesn’t have a fair matchmaking system.

Like there hasn't been a dominant faction in PvP in every game lol. From someone that's brought new players to PvP, the GC balancing isn't their problem, they didn't take issue with losing, they just thought the 1v1v1 concept was atrocious and much preferred Rival Wings.