Mentors...please!

[RajNish]

and most people don't bother with it anymore

This. The commendation is not the parameter by which it is worth evaluating whether a player can be a mentor or not. But, unfortunately, we have neither a specific system nor parameters for this. Also, no one can say how many reports must be received so that the player ceases to be a mentor. All this is not clear and too confusing.

People who want to learn mechs for every dungeon, raid, trial, etc. there is at least a few on just about every server im sure, so maybe try that?

Yes, that’s a very good idea. At the moment, I play with several people I know. This greatly reduces the chance of meeting strange people in a group of 4 players at least. But to be honest, I am not very happy about voluntary isolation.

[Wiccan692015]

Yes, that’s a very good idea. At the moment, I play with several people I know. This greatly reduces the chance of meeting strange people in a group of 4 players at least. But to be honest, I am not very happy about voluntary isolation.[/QUOTE]

I know what you mean about voluntary Isolation, but sadly its the only way to guarantee that you are getting a group of smart people who listen and help each other to learn the content properly without interference from people who think they know everything but they really know not much at all about anything and slow others down......

[AmeliaVerves]

When the community as a whole is toxic, everyone suffers. All this is very symptomatic in fact. There is no healthy equality, a lot of elitism, passive and active aggression, greed and selfishness.

Even tho I am not the most social person and usually stay for myself, I think this community in general is very polite and helpful. Most people at least try to help or guide you somewhere you might find help/information.
And even tho I cringe a lot about NN, I guess ppl use it frequently bc they find it helpful or like the social aspect about it.

The negative things you just mentioned are generally frowned upon by every sub-comm this game has, but you always find a few bad apples. Doesn't mean it's fair to generalize that much.

[Banriikku]

When the community as a whole is toxic, everyone suffers. All this is very symptomatic in fact. There is no healthy equality, a lot of elitism, passive and active aggression, greed and selfishness.

I say your are selfish, i say you are elitist. You say this is "xxx" and must be true because "yyy" wich cant be checked. You behave as if you were the prosecutor and judge in one person. You make general statements and avoid my and others questions. Besides what you are refering to sounds more like social problem and is so generally held that you could apply this to everything in our society. So can we now talk about why you think that the majority of mentors are toxic or is this just "vent against the mentor" thread now and we just trash talk a spezific player group?

Next is the voluntary Isolation: Every single player has his knicks and knacks and even when no one is doing something wrong we dont like each other. Also every player does things at diffrent pace, with diffrent viewpoints and so on. Thats reality. I dont play Mentor roulette or in PF Groups because i dont like some player behavior. So this makes the comm toxic ? I expect player to look guides before going in the PF and know what they are doing, i expect players to be good at their job - does this apply as default? No.Why should this be so? What makes me or you so god damn special that we can demand this ? I dont see your reasons besides " i am right and you are wrong".

[SoranRigel]

Player X starts talking aloud about a problem that worries many people (watch the discussion first, with all links), and says he just wants to play quietly.
Player Y: "I say your are selfish, i say you are elitist".

A fine example of toxicity, really.

[RajNish]

I know what you mean about voluntary Isolation, but sadly its the only way to guarantee that you are getting a group of smart people who listen and help each other to learn the content properly without interference from people who think they know everything but they really know not much at all about anything and slow others down......

Right. You have very accurately said. I have nothing more to add.

Even tho I am not the most social person and usually stay for myself, I think this community in general is very polite and helpful. Most people at least try to help or guide you somewhere you might find help/information.

Up to 50 lvl, maybe. But on 70 the strange begins. Here is an example. Ala Mhigo. Tank mentor, in the group, there are two newcomers. And it is clear that they have no idea what to do. He takes a large pool, but the DPS is very low. Wipe. Here it would be nice to stop, explain tactics and go more carefully. But he again makes a large pool without saying a word.

Is it toxic? I think yes. He does not care about the group. All he wants is to quickly finish the dungeon and get out of there. Although, as a mentor, he could just slow down a bit, put marks at least. It seems to be nothing offensive, right? But his actions are completely selfish and he does not care what happens to the group. There is absolutely nothing to write a report on. It's his choice. But this does not combine with the concepts of "helpful" and "etiquette".

Help can be completely different. Not so long ago, I met a player who, it seemed to me, was trying to help and gave advice on how to increase DPS. But before the last boss pool, he said that none of the group deserved his recommendation. What for? This is not something that can encourage people to learn their job better.

The negative things you just mentioned are generally frowned upon by every sub-comm this game has, but you always find a few bad apples. Doesn't mean it's fair to generalize that much.

In fact, I judge the repeatability of such actions. This does not mean that I have not met good mentors and players. And, as I said above, I am very grateful to these people. But, unfortunately, there was more sad experience. Pulls ahead of the tank, ignoring the mechanics, trolling. Why then wear a crown? After all, they spoil not only their reputation.

[RajNish]

I say your are selfish, i say you are elitist. You say this is "xxx" and must be true because "yyy" wich cant be checked. You behave as if you were the prosecutor and judge in one person. You make general statements and avoid my and others questions. Besides what you are refering to sounds more like social problem and is so generally held that you could apply this to everything in our society. So can we now talk about why you think that the majority of mentors are toxic or is this just "vent against the mentor" thread now and we just trash talk a spezific player group?

Next is the voluntary Isolation: Every single player has his knicks and knacks and even when no one is doing something wrong we dont like each other. Also every player does things at diffrent pace, with diffrent viewpoints and so on. Thats reality. I dont play Mentor roulette or in PF Groups because i dont like some player behavior. So this makes the comm toxic ? I expect player to look guides before going in the PF and know what they are doing, i expect players to be good at their job - does this apply as default? No.Why should this be so? What makes me or you so god damn special that we can demand this ? I dont see your reasons besides " i am right and you are wrong".

I already answered your comments when they were constructive. And honestly, I do not want to swear with you. As the Buddha said: “Take yours to yourself” and do whatever you want with it.

[AmeliaVerves]

Is it toxic? I think yes. He does not care about the group. All he wants is to quickly finish the dungeon and get out of there. Although, as a mentor, he could just slow down a bit, put marks at least. It seems to be nothing offensive, right? But his actions are completely selfish and he does not care what happens to the group. There is absolutely nothing to write a report on. It's his choice. But this does not combine with the concepts of "helpful" and "etiquette".

I do not think this behaviour is toxic. Being silent, is neither rude nor toxic nor abusive or anything.
If someone in the group had a question or wanted help, they could have asked as well. Unsolicited advice is most of the times answered with unfriendly comments or ignored completely, so I definetly understand why mentors/players just don't talk and rather have others figure out stuff on their own.
You can be helpful and have etiquette when being approached and asked something. No mentor should feel compelled to move out of their way and push their advice or help onto someone. Funny enough a lot of times ppl complain about 'too pushy' mentors that want them to play their way and are forcing 'their playstyle' onto others. lmao

In the end this is just a difference of opinion, but claiming someone who remains silent is toxic is... well, obv SE does not find this toxic so you cannot report it and I agree with this sentiment.



You don't know about these mentors that stay silent. Maybe they did give unsolicited advice before and got toxic sprouts that got angry about being 'told how to play' instead of being left so they could find out on their own? There are bad apples on both sides so I find it rather close-minded to claim it's only ever mentors who are at fault.

[Neoom]

Up to 50 lvl, maybe. But on 70 the strange begins. Here is an example. Ala Mhigo. Tank mentor, in the group, there are two newcomers. And it is clear that they have no idea what to do. He takes a large pool, but the DPS is very low. Wipe. Here it would be nice to stop, explain tactics and go more carefully. But he again makes a large pool without saying a word.

First of all, there is no ''tactics'' to normal big pulls in dungeons. Second of all, every mentor who remains silent has learned it the hard way, people go out of their way to yell back at you when you helped without being asked. So after it keeps happening, they learn to wait so people ask for help, since then they want it. Most times unwanted help gets bad mouthing from people. Sure they could have said ''If you need help ask'' but people need to learn how. to. ask. HELP.

[RajNish]

You don't know about these mentors that stay silent. Maybe they did give unsolicited advice before and got toxic sprouts that got angry about being 'told how to play' instead of being left so they could find out on their own? There are bad apples on both sides so I find it rather close-minded to claim it's only ever mentors who are at fault.

I was not talking about silence. Pulls ahead of the tank, ignoring group capabilities, ignoring the mechanics, trolling, this is toxic. And, unfortunately, such actions are most noticeable if the player with the crown does it. This tank could be silent, but at least stop and think, the group can’t cope, make the pulls smaller.