Mentors...please!

[Thamorian]

If the systems worked well, you would not see an increase in the number of recommendations, as an attempt to fix it. Be the first to create a thread for thanks, and I will write there. At the moment I'm talking about the problem, I will write here because I consider it necessary and important, whether you like it or not.

Oh you mean the couple dozen posts with suggestions? Yeah I've seen them. That's not a lot of people making suggestions to change it, and it's especially not an increase. But you keep them blinders on and see what you wanna see. Just because a few people relatively have problems with something doesn't mean we need to make a change, because it's really just a very small problem. If you meet an abusive person who is a mentor, just use the report abuse button in game under contact us, sam as you would with any other abusive person. And if you just want to complain because they left a duty or didn't explain anything? Oh well, deal with it, those aren't against the rules. People who left a duty already take a 30 minute lockout from duty finder. As I've said before, the issue is being magnified to look like there is a bigger issue than there really is.

In addition to sophistry with calculations and percentages - didn’t you think about why most normal people prefer not to wear a crown?

Yeah, I've seen quite a few people mention they don't wear the crown because of the negative stigma it has from people like YOU give the crown. People who dump all over mentors in general even though it's not deserved. They don't wear the crown because they don't want to be harassed and put under a microscope all because they wear a crown that says "Hey there newbie, I'm here to help if you need it." Not wearing a crown? Freestyle and be bad all you want. Wearing a crown? You better shut your mouth unless I ask for help! And you better be parsing purple! If we wipe, it's all your fault mr mentor for not explaining anything to us even though I told you that you better shut your mouth unless I asked for help. And god help me if you say anything about my playstyle, Im reporting you to the GMs for abuse! You need to get that chip off your shoulder.

[SoranRigel]

Yeah, negative stigma people like YOU give the crown. You need to get that chip off your shoulder.

Oh. Personally me? You exaggerate my merits.

[RajNish]

because it's really just a very small problem.

Probably I can answer you with your own words.

But you keep them blinders on and see what you wanna see.

Let's leave sophistry and move on to a specific issue. For example, here is a quote not from the "universal" but specific recommendations from the SE.

https://support.eu.square-enix.com/f...6&id=5383&la=2

Offensive expression

"Offensive expression" means an expression in general that inflicts emotional distress by being offensive to another person. Offensive expression may include:

・Aggressive expressions such as violent language/slander/insult/threat.
・Expressions that provoke or belittle another person, such as excessive criticism, negation/ridicule
・Expressions that significantly lack consideration for another person
・Expressions that unilaterally reject another person's opinion
・Expressions that any reasonable person would find offensive
・Expressions that compel a playing style
・Expressions that attempt to unilaterally exclude someone from the game or content/community, etc.
(Except when in accordance with rules set by an administrator such as a Free Company Master)
・Expressions that contravene public order and morals
・Other expressions that are offensive to another person

Offensive expressions are prohibited in all places where expressions can be made in Final Fantasy XIV, including chat (including Quick Chat and Emote), markers, comments and names. Use of an offensive expression in the form of a character name is also regarded as nuisance behaviour.

That is why, what I heard about the "bad day", "bad mood" and so on is absolute nonsense. However, if someone wants to argue with the rules defined by the developers of the game, you can continue to do this. Unfortunately, the issue of correcting the mentor's system remains open, and there are still few constructive proposals.

[Alaeacus]

...There are several thousand people who have unlocked mentor, both who do and don't wear the crown. You hear of what? DOZENS of mentors who are problematic? Um, ok, yeah it's a MAJOR problem. /s

This thread is not showing an illustration, it's showing an illusion, a few loud mouths who complain loudly because they met one bad mentor who left an impression and their friends told them or they read that all mentors are bad, giving a magnifying effect...

^ Exactly this. Adding on to your point: Those few loudmouth people complaining are trying to push massive regulation change (more constraints) on all Mentors because of the negative actions of a small percentage of bad actors. In fact, people stopped wearing the crown because overall public image of Mentors was ruined, also by that small percentage of bad actors.

Almost NOBODY describes FF14 community as being full of toxic people. It's usually the contrary. Almost everyone in the game is patient and helps their fellow players. Some wear crowns and some don't. This "Bad Mentor" crap is not a widespread or major problem, otherwise FF14 would not have the aforementioned good reputation.

[RajNish]

Honestly, the mentors I've encountered have been some of the meanest players in the game.

The same situation. Only a few were really good. But, rather, this is an exception that confirms the pattern. Actually, this discussion confirms it too.

Saddle up and do your own homework before you just throw everything at the mentor system whole-sale.

Why so aggressive? Yes, bad players happen. They probably also have bad days. If we talk about homework, it will be useful to you.

Almost NOBODY describes FF14 community as being full of toxic people. It's usually the contrary.

You can easily find and read "Community for fans of Square Enix's popular MMORPG "Final Fantasy XIV Online" on Reddit. Thread "Why does no one police mentors?" for example, almost 600 comments from "happy" and "thankful" people, 2 years ago.

[Alaeacus]

You can easily find and read "Community for fans of Square Enix's popular MMORPG "Final Fantasy XIV Online" on Reddit. Thread "Why does no one police mentors?" for example, almost 600 comments from "happy" and "thankful" people, 2 years ago.

1. 600 comments =/= 600 people.

2. Are you trying to say all 600 comments are from people agreeing there is a problem with Mentors? By that logic, you can look at thread we are in right now and say "There are 10 pages worth of "happy" and "thankful" people" Flawed rationale.

3. LOL! The top two comments of that thread you reference "Why does no one police mentors?", with over 150 upvotes each, basically tell the OP that "this is the way it is" and report those players at the Support Desk. You actually have to scroll for a long time to find any post actually agreeing that SE needs to do something extra to police Mentors. It's mostly just people anecdotally complaining. So...bad example doesn't help your argument much.

[Tsalmaveth]

Why so aggressive? Yes, bad players happen. They probably also have bad days. If we talk about homework, it will be useful to you.

Maybe because of this entire thread, and the many before, repeatedly thrashing mentors without possibly looking at the sprouts who have bad attitudes is enough to set my ire on point. Y'all need to stop.

And no, not all skip-potion users are 'raiders on alts'... people throwing out the 'you don't pay my sub' or whine about being told how to play by mentors just wanting to actually get the ex-duty they got thrown into in the roulette done are vets. A lot of this is just passing the buck and throwing blame without looking in the mirror. I'm being a tad bit curt and short, sure... but it's COMPLETELY warranted because this is one-sided finger-pointing. 'Only mentors having bad days can be bad' is what is being said... if a sprout has a bad day and cops attitude... oh well. The mentors have to suck it up and smile, right? That's what it means to wear the crown. Just take it, right? RIGHT?

NAAAAAAAH. I'm not up with that. Mentors can say enough and back out of a duty. No, they shouldn't be abusive and if you see one being ABUSIVE... report them. But they are not there to be forced into things, either. You have a report system for ANY player that behaves over the line, but ANY player has the right to leave an instance, duty, etc that they do not want to be in or that is undesirable for them past a point. They are punished for it with a lockout. That's the punishment the devs have decided is 'right' for doing so. That's it. End of story. There isn't any need to do more than that.

[ForteNightshade]

So I want to put this out there and it has been mentioned before, but mentors need another re-work. Just because a person gets commendations does not mean you are suitable to be a mentor. I cannot tell you how many countless times I have joined a roulette or party and I see the mentors go. "You should just go in unsynched." or they just leave. There should be a counter for how many times they just up and abandon a duty that way if they do it many times their mentor roulette becomes suspended. There should also be a report mentor function that needs to be reviewed so that if someone is abusive to other players as a mentor it should be taken away.

As someone who enjoys teaching people how to do a fight and learning as we go, it is horrible to see someone join in and say "Just do it unsynched." What great mentor advice! This is a major issue for a healthy community and the future growth of this game. Mentor status should be an honor and a chance to show your skills to help others achieve a great goal! So please FFXIV reword the mentor status again and make it to where being a mentor isn't just something to get a roulette and rewards. Make it for people who want to help.

Just to play devil's advocate here. Now you have someone who...

1. Does not want to be there
2. Has a forced incentive to stay if they're farming for the mount
3. Will still be unlikely to explain or say anything, possibly because they don't know any of the mechanics

All in all, this is recipe for disaster as that person may be inclined to simply pull repeatedly to encourage a Vote Abandon. Is it a crappy thing to do? Absolutely. But the mistake SE made was locking a reward behind something intended to be altruistic. You will get people who only care about the mount regardless of whatever restrictions are put in place. Is it not far better they leave and maybe get replaced by someone who might be willing to help than forcing them to stay?

[Neoom]

Easy fix to bad mentors; Report them to the GM's. If someone is breaking the rules or abusing others, they will get the penalty and if enough people actually REPORT they will lose the shiny name glamour
But god forbid mentors not being sunshines 24/7 when people literally spit on their faces and refuse to actually listen OR refuse to even try to understand whats being told to them. Maybe just maybe this is not only about bad mentors but also about bad sprouts/non mentor players who refuse to listen.
I understand, in your head there is only bad mentors and all of them should play according to you and if they say hello the wrong way theyre bad and should feel bad. You can bring the rule book out as much as you want, but dude, bro, the non mentor people are breaking them too. And as I said and multiple people before me; REPORT FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING GOOD REPORT THEM!!! As seen in many other online games, if someone receives enough reports they will get penalty from their actions and in this case lose the name glamour.
(Also report anyone who is breaking the rules and being abusive in the game, not only mentors, no one gets a free pass on being an ass)

[SoranRigel]

The game rules, unfortunately, do not specify how many "bad days" per month each player may have, but I will take the courage to remind that everyone present pressed the "Accept" button under them.