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  1. 01-11-2020 07:17 AM #1
    Avidria
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    Gridania
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    Avi Taro
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    Behemoth
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    Bard Lv 100
    I dunno anything about any of those weapons, but I would enjoy more of Gaius.
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodric View Post
    The use of a chemical weapon was to avoid excessive losses among a force that is incapable of using aether. The protagonists can paint it as a 'horrific' approach to warfare but conveniently it does no such thing when it comes to other traumatic methods of death such as blasting people with fireballs, running them through with swords, afflicting opponents with magical diseases or drowning/crushing them with water and debris as we saw with the fall of Doma Castle.

    The use of Black Rose was a sound enough move and the real complication lay in the unintended side effects in the form of a Calamity. The weapon was also only used in response to Garlemald itself being invaded and in an alternative universe at that, so...
    I've got a couple thoughts on this, that kinda split apart here, but... I don't see Black Rose on the same level as the kind of warfare Eorzea and Garlemald are usually stuck in the middle of. War is ugly in itself, whether you're shooting someone or blasting them with magical fire. What's horrific about Black Rose, imo, is that it's a large scale aetheric weapon that kills indiscriminately - if it got used on a battlefield, it would kill everyone regardless of what side they're on. I'm not sure how far its effects would go on non-humanoid life without the boost from the rejoining, but it probably still would've been pretty bad for more than just the people. With or without the influx of light from the first, it still had the potential to be devastating, and in the wrong hands, catastrophic even if not on a cataclysmic scale.

    As for magical diseases being used in warfare, I definitely don't see how the narrative paints that as anything but horrific. What was done to Sil'dih was monstrous, and what happened in Nym was horrific. The people making decisions in Ul'dah and Mhach of their time were both guilty of committing atrocities. Magic wasn't seen in a good light after what some of those fallen civilizations did for very good reason.

    Also, I didn't think Garlemald itself actually got invaded - unless I missed that? I thought they were just being pushed back - pushed back from their own invasion, no less.

    I am curious, though, to go back a ways... what experiments were the Sharlayans doing, and where do we learn about them? I honestly don't remember much about them other than what we see in the AST questline. <.<
    (1)
    "Run when you have to, fight when you must, rest when you can." - Elyas Machera, The Wheel of Time
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  2. 01-11-2020 07:43 AM #2
    Melichoir
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    Melichoir's Avatar
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    Desia Demarseille
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    Sargatanas
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    Dark Knight Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Avidria View Post
    I've got a couple thoughts on this, that kinda split apart here, but... I don't see Black Rose on the same level as the kind of warfare Eorzea and Garlemald are usually stuck in the middle of. War is ugly in itself, whether you're shooting someone or blasting them with magical fire. What's horrific about Black Rose, imo, is that it's a large scale aetheric weapon that kills indiscriminately - if it got used on a battlefield, it would kill everyone regardless of what side they're on. I'm not sure how far its effects would go on non-humanoid life without the boost from the rejoining, but it probably still would've been pretty bad for more than just the people. With or without the influx of light from the first, it still had the potential to be devastating, and in the wrong hands, catastrophic even if not on a cataclysmic scale.

    As for magical diseases being used in warfare, I definitely don't see how the narrative paints that as anything but horrific. What was done to Sil'dih was monstrous, and what happened in Nym was horrific. The people making decisions in Ul'dah and Mhach of their time were both guilty of committing atrocities. Magic wasn't seen in a good light after what some of those fallen civilizations did for very good reason.
    The weapon on paper is very pragmatic. It cant be effectively defended against, covers a wide area at low cost, easy to deploy (relatively) with (supposedly) low risk to the users, and was ultra effective and psychologically horrifying.

    Problem ends up that yeah, it really is that horrifying and uncontrollable. Real world reference, its why Bio and Chem Weapons are considered violation of the Geneva Protocols and will land the leader of a country that employs them as a war criminal. Theyre that bad and caustic a weapon that most nations willingly agree to not employ them in conflicts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Avidria View Post
    Also, I didn't think Garlemald itself actually got invaded - unless I missed that? I thought they were just being pushed back - pushed back from their own invasion, no less.
    IIRC, What happened with the Garlean people through out history was essentially they were at a perpetual disadvantage due to their people being unable to use magic. As a result, they had invaders from neighboring countries come in often enough and enslave/displace the garlean people because said invaders could magic BTFO them with impunity. Im not 100% sure about the following, but they did develop magitek as a way to get equal footing, reclaimed their own homelands, then expanded outwards to deal with the primal menace after all that.
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