Did people even ask for changes to AST, like they do / did for MNK and MCH?

[Jirah]

I was made about the Astro changes then leveled up to 80 and thought "sure its simpler but it isnt that bad' Prior to the Divination CD reduced to 120 rather than 180.

My issues with AST is its annoying to play in a all ranged/Physical party and Sleeve draw is useless in that regard as its a 50-50 chance it'll give me that card i want then id have to redraw to another card i dont need. That and Divination as a opener is gone or using Sleeve as a free Lady/Lords DPS buff which is equal or greater than divination giving 3 party members a buff .. in dungoens at least. Sleeve draw was chaotic but to me personally Sleeve wasnt the issue its just AST card system being boring and ineffective in some situations. but i dont raid so im not put to the fire so maybe i dont have valid point on the job

[Recon1o6]

I was made about the Astro changes then leveled up to 80 and thought "sure its simpler but it isnt that bad' Prior to the Divination CD reduced to 120 rather than 180.

My issues with AST is its annoying to play in a all ranged/Physical party and Sleeve draw is useless in that regard as its a 50-50 chance it'll give me that card i want then id have to redraw to another card i dont need. That and Divination as a opener is gone or using Sleeve as a free Lady/Lords DPS buff which is equal or greater than divination giving 3 party members a buff .. in dungoens at least. Sleeve draw was chaotic but to me personally Sleeve wasnt the issue its just AST card system being boring and ineffective in some situations. but i dont raid so im not put to the fire so maybe i dont have valid point on the job

You do have a valid opinion on the job, you've levelled it up past at least 1 level cap. Raiding is not everything. Most of the game and playerbase is outside of raids

surprised to see this thread necro'd

[Reyna_Balmore]

You do have a valid opinion on the job, you've levelled it up past at least 1 level cap. Raiding is not everything. Most of the game and playerbase is outside of raids

surprised to see this thread necro'd

Yea, I just thought it was necessary with the recent Ast changes. I'll let it die again once this all blows over

[Semirhage]

Yes, but with 5.0 Whm now and with 4.0 Ast / Sch, I'd believe would be satisfactory.

I don't think I'll ever understand this community's open double standard when it comes to WHM. One nuke + 1 dot + random occasional oGCD heal? Wonderful, amazing, best the job has ever been. Oh we're talking about a job that's not WHM? Horrible, awful, need to revert immediately, why would anyone enjoy this.

All I'm saying is, now that all three healers have been dumbed down to approximately the same level of boredom, I find it really interesting that most of this forum thinks this is both a wonderful thing for WHMs and a terrible thing for everyone else. Really gets the noggin joggin'.

[Recon1o6]

I don't think I'll ever understand this community's open double standard when it comes to WHM

Actually no, most whm's on this forum want more than just holy/glare/dia with the occasional blood lily. Its usually the other healers that want whm to be treated as the "beginning" healer when that shouldn't be the case. Conjurer is the beginning healer, not whm.

Ask any whm and you'll find that they want 3 things
1. More dps options
2. raid utility to avoid slipping back to HW's boot out by optimising idiots parties
3. the constant stripping of whm staples and nerfs to holy to cease

[bundythenoob]

I see a lot of WHM that say they want fluid aura removed, but why not buff it instead?

I think Fluid could become sort of like Blizzard II, where it could be a 100 potency ability on a 30 second cooldown or something. like a baby holy that can be thrown out, but instead of stunning it holds enemies in place. something small for the early levels that can get an upgrade later down the line

[currentlemon]

I see a lot of WHM that say they want fluid aura removed, but why not buff it instead?

I think Fluid could become sort of like Blizzard II, where it could be a 100 potency ability on a 30 second cooldown or something. like a baby holy that can be thrown out, but instead of stunning it holds enemies in place. something small for the early levels that can get an upgrade later down the line

This. Fluid Aura should be buffed, not removed. Having a Water spell would be great for the job since it LITERALLY fits into WHM lore. If Y'shtola can have water spells in the game, then so can WHM. Seriously, there are water spells coded into the game, yet only Y'shtola can access them! Even in Shadowbringers where she is a Black Mage!

[Gravagar]

Yea, I just thought it was necessary with the recent Ast changes. I'll let it die again once this all blows over

It's alright, we're all sinners here.


I just... really want the current battle team to take a step back and ask other teams for input about how to make healers work. Ask the encounter design teams how healers should work- "well, we design raids / extremes / ultimates to have lots of healer damage time... does that mesh with any player feedback?"
I get that most of the playerbase doesn't run that kind of content, but at the end of the day, nobody is happy when they're given a square peg and told to fit it into a round hole. All content is made by the encounter design team, so if everyone above a certain content difficulty line is complaining about 75% uptime and no variety in that 75%, then chances are pretty good that all content below that line could be a lot more fun by the same types of changes.

[bundythenoob]

It's alright, we're all sinners here.


I just... really want the current battle team to take a step back and ask other teams for input about how to make healers work. Ask the encounter design teams how healers should work- "well, we design raids / extremes / ultimates to have lots of healer damage time... does that mesh with any player feedback?"
I get that most of the playerbase doesn't run that kind of content, but at the end of the day, nobody is happy when they're given a square peg and told to fit it into a round hole. All content is made by the encounter design team, so if everyone above a certain content difficulty line is complaining about 75% uptime and no variety in that 75%, then chances are pretty good that all content below that line could be a lot more fun by the same types of changes.

I believe this may be due to the fact that the FFXIV battle systems development team only has like 4 people working on the jobs, and those devs have openly said that they dislike playing tanks and healers. If anything, square enix needs to use the money they've gotten from SHB sales to hire a dedicated tank and healer dev, or else this problem will persist for the next xpac. I'm not even sure why they didn't hire a dedicated tank and dedicated healer dev with the money they made in STB. I'm not even sure why nobody is questioning this or talking about it more. it seems like a huge problem going forward in my opinion.

[Shalan]

I'm not even sure why nobody is questioning this or talking about it more. it seems like a huge problem going forward in my opinion.

It has been brought up before multiple times since the media tour for ShB but we've never had an official response. When it's discussed on the forums (outside the healer section that is) the posts discussing the issue are usually ignored or it's seen as a non-issue. At times it seems like the lack of engagement on the issue is a sort of tacit approval of the current state of things, which just demoralizes people and prevents further/continued discussion. Defeatism has set in.

I imagine we'll see the issue being picked up again for the next media tour, but who knows how far out that is.


I do think there is a serious disconnect between the devs and the community however. If we look at the ShB media tour again there were multiple examples where the devs outright failed to understand and communicate with the community, Japanese or foreign, when it came to healers. It almost felt as if they didn't know how to handle healers, so they kept trying to brush us under the rug and ignore us or something.

Not going to lie, I'm still a little salty over their lack of any questions/answers during their interviews as well lol. I just hope the next tour is more professional.