I'm not excited about the future patch at all. Just one dungeon?

[AnimaAnimus]

If I wanted to play ff11 I would just go play ff11.

For crying out loud people how many times do we have to tell you.

EUREKA IS NOTHING LIKE XI

It's incredibly obvious you did not play XI, Eureka is nothing like XI. They pulled a few elements from XI, yes, but it was the ones the players hated the most in XI. All this did was show how deaf SE is to the criticisms of their subscribers, nothing more. And I hate how XI is being tarnished by this comparison.

You want to know what XI truly is like? Go play it. It's still there and it still has a large player base.

But this simple statement completely wipes any argument you have into the "doesn't know what they are talking about" pile and is therefore null and void. Want to make a decent argument? Do not compare something to something else, if you have only heard about that other thing from "something this one guy said one time in a party" or worse....google. Because it makes you look incredibly unreliable.

So, criticism voided. Come back when you have a better argument.

[Shurrikhan]

For crying out loud people how many times do we have to tell you.

EUREKA IS NOTHING LIKE XI

As many times as you'd have to kill an at-level mob to max your elemental level.

[Rasikko]

You want to know what XI truly is like? Go play it.

I think for someone who's never played FFXI, jumping into it wont grant them the experience we veterans had to endure because the 75 era is long gone. 99 era, none of that annoying stuff exists now, because exping is no longer an 'event'. No 8-10hr parties, no 2-3 month LFG DDs, etc, and you can just use trust for nearly all the old 75 era content.

[dinnertime]

Oh of course. But you do normal raids until you get your item for the week, which could just be once. Then you do the same for the alliance raid.

I do extreme trials as well, but they have the same problem but even worse. You're guaranteed to get whatever you're farming for after 10 runs, unless you're trying for a mount. Once you have that, you never go back.

It's hardly going to be something to keep you coming back every day, like the tomestone grind is.

The tomestone grind isn't really any different. People tend to stop doing them after a couple weeks if they've gotten the necessary gear especially if combined with the normal raid and alliance raid ones. Some combining them with the extreme trial gear.

Then again, how often these content are being done is subjective to the goals of each individual. What matters more if this type of content is more accessible to more casual players, which they are. We'll be fine with one less dungeon each patch. Not like the second dungeon actually contributed to anything other than aesthetic variety.

[Zakon]

The tomestone grind isn't really any different.

Well it depends on what you're talking about. The normal raid gear will take you a couple of weeks to put together the set you want, but you're locked at one item drop per week, so once you've got that item you don't need to go back again until next tuesday. With the expert roulette it takes a few nights to cap on tomestones, which is a reason to log in and play.

For the EX trials though, there's no weekly cap. If you get in a good group you can get the grind done in an afternoon, again unless you're after a rare drop.

You could just grind out the tomestones in a day if you like pain, I suppose. I enjoy running the dungeons and I'm pretty sure my brain would turn to paste by the end of that.

As for the tomestone gear, collecting the sets is what keeps me coming back. This particular patch cycle I thought the ranged set looked sick, so I collected the full thing along with all three weapons. Sometimes though I'll collect multiple sets that I think look nice. That's actually true of this cycle, I would really like the DRK and NIN outfits as well.

[dinnertime]

Well it depends on what you're talking about. The normal raid gear will take you a couple of weeks to put together the set you want, but you're locked at one item drop per week, so once you've got that item you don't need to go back again until next tuesday. With the expert roulette it takes a few nights to cap on tomestones, which is a reason to log in and play.

But normal raids (and alliance raids) is essentially the same kind of grind though? They both have weekly caps, the only difference is that RNG is involved. If you didn't get the drop you wanted or lost from a higher roll, you try again and again until you get it. It's not really a one and done thing unless you're lucky. Same for EX trials. It's especially worse now that there's more jobs than before, and they still drop one weapon per clear. I remember taking a couple weeks getting my Titania Grimoire because it just wouldn't drop which I ended up buying with the tokens, and I don't play the game that often. In the end, it's pretty subjective.

[Vrankyl]

First off I want to say how much I love this game. FFXIV has been my home. I hate take a break but, considering the future patch just has one dungeon and a raid. There is not alot content for players like me who don't craft or gather. While I do like the gathering and crafting system. And appreciate how they made it more approachable. It is still not content that I enjoy. And I'm upset that this is the way we are getting our relic gear. It's almost as bad a Eureka. (which is something that I never had time for or enjoyed. If I wanted to play ff11 I would just go play ff11)

Uh... our relic has nothing at all to do with the Ishgard Restoration or crafting/gathering at all. Now the Crafter/Gatherer relic is tied to it, but the battle relic will be done in the ruins of the Bojza Citadel. It will be battle content and from the slides it sounds like it will be done with a lot of solo steps.

[Jennah]

I quit playing FF11 around 2004. Eureka was ... very much like its state, back then.

[Zakon]

I quit playing FF11 around 2004. Eureka was ... very much like its state, back then.

Hey that's not true at all, Eureka was nothing like FF11. FF11 was fun.

Low-hanging fruit jokes aside, I actually am old enough to have played the classic MMOs like EverQuest and FFXI and have vivid memories of them. The main difference to me and what made Eureka intolerable to me is that the gameplay of those old games was much, much slower and there weren't complex rotations to keep track of. Eureka had the grind but with modern MMO class design, which is why I didn't like it.

[RokkuEkkusu]

I think there are a few problems with dungeons IMO:

1. If there are multiple branching paths, most players in DF groups will take the shortest route possible. As a result, they forego rewards of side treasure coffer gear, gil, and/or exp that were skipped. This usually leads to faster clears for roulette purposes.

2. If the dungeon has only one single path to clear, there will always be opportunities to see the treasure coffer for gear, gain the exp from enemies more often, and get the gil drops from enemies that apply. Of course this has a higher chance of burning out people if they do dungeons too often as there isn't much variety in dungeon layout.

Either way, it's always trash -> boss -> trash -> boss -> trash -> boss in dungeon order. [Barring a few exceptions]

For endgame content, dungeons aren't the only ways to get endgame Tomestones. There are PVP, roulettes, hunts, cross-server hunt trains, beast tribe daily quests, end game trials, normal/24 man raids, etc. You just need to take the initiative to participate in them if constant dungeon running burned you out and/or it is not your thing to do.