Limited Job #2: Beastmaster

[jon041065]

I think this is brilliant. I think they should definitely put BLU and whatever else in DoK rather than calling them limited. that would help with the misunderstandings.

Still wouldn't change that people would want to play those jobs in the full game. No problem with there being content like what you're talking about but there are plenty of players that would not be happy with these jobs being ONLY that type of content.

[Lambdafish]

Still wouldn't change that people would want to play those jobs in the full game. No problem with there being content like what you're talking about but there are plenty of players that would not be happy with these jobs being ONLY that type of content.

What would BLU look like as a full job? I'm sure that idea you have in your head can still be implemented under another name. CHM most likely won't be called CHM because ALC exists, should we condemn ALC as "not the CHM we asked for" because it's a crafter? No, we will get the CHM we want in the form of Salve maker. People want CHM because of the gameplay that it can bring to the game, BLU already emulates the iconic gameplay of BLU in the best way it can as a collection job.

BLU is not limited, it has dungeon running, primal farming, raiding, skill collecting, and solo content that it can do. They might not be shadowbringers raids or primals, but BLU has given new life to old content and made it challenging and interesting again. It's not perfect, but add in a BLU only roulette, PotD (which can't currently be done due to technical limitations, despite dev interest), PF QoL, and possibly the ability to do NG+, and BLU has just as much value, if not more than regular battle jobs.

[ReiMakoto]

What would BLU look like as a full job? I'm sure that idea you have in your head can still be implemented under another name. CHM most likely won't be called CHM because ALC exists, should we condemn ALC as "not the CHM we asked for" because it's a crafter? No, we will get the CHM we want in the form of Salve maker. People want CHM because of the gameplay that it can bring to the game, BLU already emulates the iconic gameplay of BLU in the best way it can as a collection job.

BLU is not limited, it has dungeon running, primal farming, raiding, skill collecting, and solo content that it can do. They might not be shadowbringers raids or primals, but BLU has given new life to old content and made it challenging and interesting again. It's not perfect, but add in a BLU only roulette, PotD (which can't currently be done due to technical limitations, despite dev interest), PF QoL, and possibly the ability to do NG+, and BLU has just as much value, if not more than regular battle jobs.

It's not emulating the party support aspect in normal parties which is a persistent identity of blu mage, despite having a collection aspect, it was still a party job that could run with other jobs as a support, it has about the same collection factor as summoner has in some games. Also your value point is purely subjective, for many it has far less value than normal jobs and even crafters/gathers. As to what it would look like as a full job? Well we can already see that with DPS mimicry's dps rotation which it is doing 90% of any raid, a quirky rotation that could have some party support mixed in, if they would implement it as a new soul crystal it could be Blue Battlemage (like how red mage in ff12 is called red battlemage), but there should be no reason why the limited portion and full game portion of blu couldnt coexist as a menu option

[Lambdafish]

It's not emulating the party support aspect in normal parties which is a persistent identity of blu mage, despite having a collection aspect, it was still a party job that could run with other jobs as a support

Thats just how those games work. BLU's "support" identity isn't the same as what support means in this game. To be more accurate, BLU is about casting debuffs like slow, mini, and doom, and utilitising elemental attacks. You will notice that the masked carnival was built directly around that idea.

https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki...nal_Fantasy_V)

Well we can already see that with DPS mimicry's dps rotation which it is doing 90% of any raid, a quirky rotation that could have some party support mixed in, if they would implement it as a new soul crystal it could be Blue Battlemage

BLU doesn't have a set rotation, it has key skills that are useful like moonflute, song of torment, and various aspected attacks based on libra. What you are asking is to strip away BLUs toolkit down to the 5 skills that are "mandatory". Then what? Do you get white wind? Do you get mighty guard? Do you get bad breath? Which of the 80 spells do you choose to make a DPS class? Because they way it has been implemented allows player choice based on the fight (further emphasised by condensed libra).

if they would implement it as a new soul crystal it could be Blue Battlemage (like how red mage in ff12 is called red battlemage), but there should be no reason why the limited portion and full game portion of blu couldnt coexist as a menu option

Why would the devs do this instead of making a whole new job? This has the same drawbacks as people who ask for advanced jobs like Ranger. And thats without mentioning how messy and haphazard that implementation sounds. Basically what you want is BLU limited job, and then a brand new job also called BLU that works entirely different (and is BLU only in the fact that it takes skill names from BLU) that coexist within a menu?

I get that you want BLU to be a "full job" (a term which honestly doesn't mean anything), but unless you can provide a way in which BLU actually benefits from this change (enough to actually course correct), BLU is better off as a separate piece of content. If the devs did implement BLU in the way you are describing, it would benefit nobody except diehard BLU purists who don't actually care what they get so long as they can play something named BLU in Eden.

[ReiMakoto]

Why would the devs do this instead of making a whole new job? This has the same drawbacks as people who ask for advanced jobs like Ranger.

Because it would be using the same skills/animations as the limited blu, just with specific loadouts, unlike a ranger subset which would use different skills

Edit:
Pretty rude to edit in more information to your post without marking it as such but hey

Blue's support identity shifts from game to game, in some its debuffs, in some its about buffing the party, both of which could be present and could be present in a "full job" (and yes, full job does have a meaning, limited jobs are level limited and cannot use key features meaning by definition there is a pretty large distinction between full jobs and limited jobs), FFV is but one example, one example where it still has a suite of party buffs and a few enemy debuffs, (some of which could be present in content)

DPS blu does have a "set" dps rotation in dps mimicry, 3 spells for each of the mimicry debuffs, sot, bristle, and the primal skills, White wind, mighty guard(reworked to be more like actual mighty guard and not just a tank stance) and bad breath could all be present in a rotation if balanced according

Continueing for my why, my counter would be why not, you say what would provide to actual blu, I'd say a potentially bigger pool of players to do the limited content. You're being incredibly narrow minded saying it would benefit no one, as it would benefit the "Blue Purists" and the people who like the limited content, you get both.

You seem to be very good and constructing strawmen of what other people actually want, nowhere did i say i would want it stripped down to 5 skills, or take away from limited content, get a grip man. But I've been here before with you, I don't think we're ever going to agree, nor are you going to be in anyways open to any suggestions

Edit 2:

What I mean by the "set" rotation it already has is in order to do optimal damage on raid bosses on blue you need

1.Off Guard
2. Astral Skill
3. Umbral Skill
4. Physical Skill
5. On Demand Weaving skill (knife or sonic boom)
6. Bristle
7. Song of Torment
8. Magic Hammer
9. Devour
10. Moon Flute
11. Condensed Libra
12. Aetherial Mimicry
13. Eruption/Feather Rain
14. Shock Strike
15. Mountain Buster
16. J-Kick
17. Glass Dance
18. Supranaka
19. Revenge Blast
20. Whistle
21. Final Sting
22. Level 5 Death

This Skills currently form and actually pretty alright rotation for blue mage to follow, this rotation with tweaks is what I would consider for a full blu rotation as a skeleton, without access to 5 death and like self destruct, I could write a large writup on how I would expand on this skillset as a level 80 job, but I'll leave it there for now, and I'm just going to assume people know why these skills form a rotation

[jon041065]

What would BLU look like as a full job? I'm sure that idea you have in your head can still be implemented under another name. CHM most likely won't be called CHM because ALC exists, should we condemn ALC as "not the CHM we asked for" because it's a crafter? No, we will get the CHM we want in the form of Salve maker. People want CHM because of the gameplay that it can bring to the game, BLU already emulates the iconic gameplay of BLU in the best way it can as a collection job.

BLU is not limited, it has dungeon running, primal farming, raiding, skill collecting, and solo content that it can do. They might not be shadowbringers raids or primals, but BLU has given new life to old content and made it challenging and interesting again. It's not perfect, but add in a BLU only roulette, PotD (which can't currently be done due to technical limitations, despite dev interest), PF QoL, and possibly the ability to do NG+, and BLU has just as much value, if not more than regular battle jobs.

To you it has more value than a regular job but to me it definitely doesn't as being strictly side content.

Just like you said that people want CHM for the gameplay it can bring, that's the same reason many of us were asking for blu with the intention of having it as our main. The analogy you're trying to make would make sense for us if blu was a full job but wasn't the role that we would have liked. I personally want a DoM tank and was hoping blu would be that. Yes, I would have been disappointed if it was another role but at least I'd have the option to play it in the content I want to instead of having the choice made for me.

You asked for what I think blu would look like as a full job. I'd really like to see something similar to this https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...concept_pitch/
Or if it was a melee support like the "leak" was saying, then it could have a melee blu spell for each element (fire/ice/thunder/water/wind/earth) and you make combos with these. You're not able to use the same one twice in a row so that leaves 150 combos if we are sticking to 3 part combos still. There's your job gauge and how you fire off other blu spells. Or just finish balancing what's already there since it's so close already as Rei and others have stated.

The chance they adjust blu to being anything more than it is now is low and even more so that they change or open up the roles it can play beyond caster dps so I'd still wanting at least a melee/caster hybrid that is as close to 50/50 as possible if not an actual caster tank. Something similar to what enh shaman used to be on WoW or assassin/shadow tanks were on TOR. Right now I just don't really connect with any of the combat jobs and that's the biggest reason someone like me will unsub.

[Daemius]

snip

If you can't find a main to play with these 17 other jobs that exist, perhaps this is not the game for you. Holding out another 2 years for maybe your dream job being implemented is wild.

[jon041065]

If you can't find a main to play with these 17 other jobs that exist, perhaps this is not the game for you. Holding out another 2 years for maybe your dream job being implemented is wild.

I didn't say I didn't have a main job that I focus on. Just I find current job concepts less compelling than the battle mage one like I said already. So I'm not asking for any specific job but a play style. I thought BLU was the job most likely to have that. It's no different than people requesting other jobs or themes for a job.

[ReiMakoto]

If you can't find a main to play with these 17 other jobs that exist, perhaps this is not the game for you. Holding out another 2 years for maybe your dream job being implemented is wild.

This is a pretty abrasive attitude and answer, for example I've been playing and maining tanks for years at this point GNB being my new passion, but I'm still holding out on an unlimited BLU as I would drop and main it in a heartbeat. This is because its my favourite job across the final fantasy franchise, I even have a BLU cosplay I bring around local events, I use it in every game its available in and I absolutely adore it. Similarly to the person youre replying too I just can't find a caster that enraptures me, so holding out hope for BLU is fine.

[Daemius]

This is a pretty abrasive attitude and answer, for example I've been playing and maining tanks for years at this point GNB being my new passion, but I'm still holding out on an unlimited BLU as I would drop and main it in a heartbeat. This is because its my favourite job across the final fantasy franchise, I even have a BLU cosplay I bring around local events, I use it in every game its available in and I absolutely adore it. Similarly to the person youre replying too I just can't find a caster that enraptures me, so holding out hope for BLU it fine.

You do you. I would think if you adored BLU as much as you say you'd give the 5.1 updates a shot. As I've mentioned before it's quite fun now. Tackling old raid content with a full part of BLUs is great. There's a lot of cool stuff you can do as BLU that you can't with a standard comp.

If BLU becomes homogenized to be in line with the rest of the combat jobs it just becomes another thing that people raise to level cap for their achievements and then just forget about for another expansion. As a limited job, it has its own community and content centered around the job that makes it healthier than it would exist as just another DoM.