Monk Needs a Complete Rework

[Gameovers]

Was Greased Lightning really such a chore to keep up? You have like, 4 different ways of maintaining it. Honestly you could mash random keys next to a boss and probably keep it up more often than not.

This is the third time monk has gotten a rework since the start of Stormblood, and the previous 2 times just made the job worse. Could they have learned what made Monk fun and make it a super-fun and engaging job? Sure. But if they could do that, they would have done it one of the previous times. Frankly, the GL change was done so that Monks wouldn't feel stressed out about keeping it up, and the fact this was their big reveal for the rework shows they are wildly off on their assumptions about why people don't like Monk's gameplay.

GL was a pain due to fights not being designed with monk in mind. Yes we gotten tools to fix that but it being in the background just sounds loads better. And those wasn't reworks, those were them either adding or taking away something. Anaman needs and hopefully goes, TK needs to be useful or go, and RNG needs to be cut from the job. Those I think are the bigger issues, GL being in the background is just a plus in my book. But the other issues are the bigger ones I hope get either fixed so the job flows or just taken out.

[Powercow]

GL was a pain due to fights not being designed with monk in mind. Yes we gotten tools to fix that but it being in the background just sounds loads better. And those wasn't reworks, those were them either adding or taking away something. Anaman needs and hopefully goes, TK needs to be useful or go, and RNG needs to be cut from the job. Those I think are the bigger issues, GL being in the background is just a plus in my book. But the other issues are the bigger ones I hope get either fixed so the job flows or just taken out.

I mean, they used the same terminology before Stormblood and again before Shadowbringers. And yes, the reworks then were them just gutting stuff out of the job and calling it a day. That's fully what I expect this rework to be too. At best they'll throw us a bone and turn TK into Steel Peak.

[VentVanitas]

Am I the only one happy about GL being a thing I don't have to worry about anymore? I feel like I'm the only one who's more on the happy side monk's getting a major overhaul. To put it another way I have faith in the team that they won't fuck it up. I mean, Mch, and ninja play awesome now so 2 out of 3 isn't bad.

History suggests that the 5.4 rework will be a disaster. The only time SE has done a good rework for the job was when they did it by complete accident. But at least someone will be happy with it. I envy your faith, I really do.

I'm genuinely anxious that the rework will just make MNK the exact same job, but no Greased Lightning. But what of Anatman and Tornado Kick, the two moves that would be literally be broken without GL to work off of? I'm sure SE will find some backwards way to make them useless again, even with the golden opportunity to fundamentally change them. (By all means, if SE proves me wrong and makes those two skills into something substantial come December I'll gladly eat my words)

I apologise if it seems like I'm just doomsaying but Powercow is right. If SE thinks that GL was what needed to be changed after making it baby easy to keep then they still don't know why the job is struggling to outdo BLU with player numbers. The only good I can think to take from the rework is that maybe, just maybe, that by no longer having GL will force SE to make something that isn't pointless maintenance skills for future patches.

[Gameovers]

History suggests that the 5.4 rework will be a disaster. The only time SE has done a good rework for the job was when they did it by complete accident. But at least someone will be happy with it. I envy your faith, I really do.

I'm genuinely anxious that the rework will just make MNK the exact same job, but no Greased Lightning. But what of Anatman and Tornado Kick, the two moves that would be literally be broken without GL to work off of? I'm sure SE will find some backwards way to make them useless again, even with the golden opportunity to fundamentally change them. (By all means, if SE proves me wrong and makes those two skills into something substantial come December I'll gladly eat my words)

I apologise if it seems like I'm just doomsaying but Powercow is right. If SE thinks that GL was what needed to be changed after making it baby easy to keep then they still don't know why the job is struggling to outdo BLU with player numbers. The only good I can think to take from the rework is that maybe, just maybe, that by no longer having GL will force SE to make something that isn't pointless maintenance skills for future patches.

I think monk in HW was at it's best honestly. But I can see why they downed it down.. as they downed everything down from HW. As alot of the rotations - mainly the opener- were insane then. I trust them cause they made mch and ninja more playerable so I'm mostly expecting monk to be finally not a train wreck. Long as they fix TK and kill and never return to RNG and anaman I'll be so happy.

[Caitsithhh]

In all honesty(been maining mnk since 2.2) besides the fun of the TK rotation...the current one is fun. It’s very fulfilling to line all your buffs and gcds correctly in say an 18 minute fight like TEA.

Most people I see playing monk play it so BADLY it hurts my soul. Doing the Anatman opener currently and keeping your gcds rolling lines up all your raid and personal buffs perfectly with your rotation. It’s the most un-clunky it’s ever been. Stacks are something no actually decent monk stresses about. The bigger stress is the twin snakes timer. Double True and the Skill Speed tier you must hit for Perfect Balance are the only complicated things for monk(NOT COMPLICATED JUST MILDLY ANNOYING) besides learning a fight.

It may hurt to hear this, but not every monk wants to play a brain dead class with a stupidly rigid rotation such as DRG/SAM in the melee tree. DRG has no variables and SAM’s only variable is how many filler gcd’s you use before hagakure...

Actual changes I hope for are of course less RNG, a timer buff/nerf to Twin Snakes, SSS and TK merged/merged-changed, and guaranteed meditation stacks granted just from doing your core rotation. The only good coming from traiting GL is no more super cold reopener on Perfect Alex. There’s other changes im hoping will be acceptable. Though I hope only the things I mentioned and the skills that are obviously useless after traiting GL are dealt with.

The trend of dumbing classes down and changing them multiple times an expansion needs to die. Please SE....

[Arrius]

The trend of dumbing classes down and changing them multiple times an expansion needs to die. Please SE....

I think most are just content with giving the Monk more breathing room regarding their self buffs.
Greased Lightning and Twin Snakes require a substantial amount of time to ramp up and to maintain compared to the duration they have.

On quite a few fights you lose out on both when you get into battles that incapacitates/fetters you for longer than 15 seconds, or even have transitions where you cannot hit them pre-Form Shift (Shiva and Leviathan springs to the mind).
That just really feels bad to start off again with -25%/-30% damage and need 12-15 seconds to get back 'up to speed', while dragoons and samurai can manage their +damage/skill speed buffs more easily with at least double the duration than Twin Snakes.

[Sqwall]

I think most are just content with giving the Monk more breathing room regarding their self buffs.
Greased Lightning and Twin Snakes require a substantial amount of time to ramp up and to maintain compared to the duration they have.

On quite a few fights you lose out on both when you get into battles that incapacitates/fetters you for longer than 15 seconds, or even have transitions where you cannot hit them pre-Form Shift (Shiva and Leviathan springs to the mind).
That just really feels bad to start off again with -25%/-30% damage and need 12-15 seconds to get back 'up to speed', while dragoons and samurai can manage their +damage/skill speed buffs more easily with at least double the duration than Twin Snakes.

I believe this is the plan to be fixed in 5.4, IF SE decides to trait GL instead of a ramp up. It would honestly make more sense to give a GL speed/damage buff at leveled amounts. GL I at 15, GL II at 45, GL III at 55, and GL IV at 75. This would allow monks to just naturally gain GL over the leveling process and also gradually stronger. SE should still make the pre 50 grind compelling, much like it felt leveling NIN pre 50, and just became very fluid afterwards. Speed and damage just come with natural leveling, currently being level 80 you are still punished by GL which is something we monk's should have mastered at 50! Alas, we still cut off our own legs and are forced to "ramp up" to GL IV. The current form of GL ramp up should be abolished and should have been done in Stormblood.

The broken record continues to skip over and over with monk concerning:
Anatman,
TK,
SSS,
Chackra RNG,
The forced crit melding,
choice of stances (but only Wind matters),
Riddle of Earth self harm for "True North" and still a heavy reliance on positionals,
awkward buff timers,
Perfect Balance still being used as burst phase instead of fast ramp up,
Form Shift undermines Anatman and SSS....the list goes on.

Monk used to be one of the best DPS in the game due to it's shear damage and versatility in raids. Now it's s SHADOW of it's former self which pales in comparison to SAM, NIN, DRG, BLM, SMN, hell EVEN MCH!

I have been playing monk form 2.0 to current and I will continue to say this "BRING on the RADICAL changes!", because anything changed can ONLY get better then the current garbage that is monk NOW.

This is rock bottom for monk...5.4 can ONLY go up.

[Jirah]

I think most are just content with giving the Monk more breathing room regarding their self buffs.
Greased Lightning and Twin Snakes require a substantial amount of time to ramp up and to maintain compared to the duration they have.

On quite a few fights you lose out on both when you get into battles that incapacitates/fetters you for longer than 15 seconds, or even have transitions where you cannot hit them pre-Form Shift (Shiva and Leviathan springs to the mind).
That just really feels bad to start off again with -25%/-30% damage and need 12-15 seconds to get back 'up to speed', while dragoons and samurai can manage their +damage/skill speed buffs more easily with at least double the duration than Twin Snakes.

Breathing room, i can tell theyll overdo it and have both be like 90 second buffs if not delete 40% of the jobs to continue the devs trend of dumbing down jobs. I wanna be proven wrong but AST and MChH and most of the jobs dont convince me otherwise

[Noctisnine]

I would love to see something like, you do all your positionals correct for let's say 2 full rotations and then you unlock a free tornado kick stack, a bit like black mage. That would give us an extra motivation. Obviously anatman needs to be fully reworked.

[Jirah]

Agreed, so far every time SE changes a job its usually for the worse or a complete lobotomy which my bets are on the latter. If Monks get that treatment i just wanna say i totally called it

As 5.4 is due to appear next month, This is still valid.