Monk Needs a Complete Rework

[Ramura_Sono]

Missing the positional on Bootshine isn't as bad as you make it out to be because a Crit still has a chance to occur even without a positional. In theory you could miss every Bootshine positional and still do the same damage as someone who hit every positional. It is still bad but closer to missing 4 other positionals rather than 7.

Missing the guaranteed crit on bootshine is worse, because we go from a flat 70% chance to generate a chakra down to around 20%. Bootshine has far more hidden potency because of it's interaction with Deep Meditation.
As far as Dragonkick is concerned, it's effect should have been something along the lines of "increases positional potency by (some arbitrary number or %)". A short timer is all that's needed to maintain the alternating betwixt Dragonkick and Boothsine within the rotation.

[inhaledcorn]

As far as Dragonkick is concerned, it's effect should have been something along the lines of "increases positional potency by (some arbitrary number or %)". A short timer is all that's needed to maintain the alternating betwixt Dragonkick and Boothsine within the rotation.

So, kinda like Dragoon's Raiden Thrust, but on all the skills instead of getting a bonus skill for doing that? I dig it.

[Mahrze]

Missing the guaranteed crit on bootshine is worse, because we go from a flat 70% chance to generate a chakra down to around 20%. Bootshine has far more hidden potency because of it's interaction with Deep Meditation

Which more or less adds to both arguments of:


* MNK is too dependent on crits and gated behind all the RNG it has just makes it inconsistent.
* MNK's current design more or less is front-loading its power when it reaps the most benefits over one particular skill. Even if the math overall makes it all even in potency.

[Kaiserdrache]

What about this for 6.0:

Telekinesis: 200 potency damage, range 25y, costs all remaining MP (1000 minimum)

Do you evedn understand and know what the word Telekinesis means? Lol, because I believe you don't

To make it short, Telekinesis is the ability to move objects via pure willpower from one point to an other one, like thinking about how you move a chair by the power of your mind behind you, so that you can sit down.

That is in terms of fantasy for RPGs like FF what people understand correctly under Telekinesis and thats definetely NOT an ability that a martial artistic monk will ever have, it suits not at all to the Job, would have FF14 a kind of Mentalist/Mesmer/Psionic/Illusionist Job, that would be a suiting skill for that in fact

[SpeckledBurd]

Anyway, what I came here to post:

After further reading, I think Tornado Kick does need a rework, and I had two ideas:

Idea 1: making it more like Foul, as in you can use it as long as you keep GL up for a certain amount of time. With the update to Form Shift, this can make a fairly consistent big hit.

Idea 2: to play off the gaining of Chakra and my earlier suggestion of gaining Gates for each gain/refresh of GL, this is another Chakra skill, but it sits on a timer, like how you have your spammable Kenki/Ninki skills, then that one that you build up to use.

I think I'd rather have the former than the latter, imo, as I feel the Foul-like mechanic would be more fun. However, if this becomes a Chakra skill, Six-Sided Star could become the Foul-like skill for Monk, as I really feel it could benefit from it.

Fist stances: I think Wind and Fire should become passives, with Earth becoming similar to Riddle of Earth (cooldown that resets GL and reduces incoming damage) until Riddle of Earth is learned, replacing it outright (which grants the ignore positional buff).

The sad thing is a lot of these suggestions have been suggested in the past and have been pretty well received here and on other forums/reddit.

[Imshail]

There's not much of a chance the devs will listen to feedback on this specific job, they've made that painfully clear

[StriderShinryu]

Definitely not as in depth on Monk as everyone else here (should just be hitting 80 shortly) but even in my experience so far it does feel like it needs something. More than any other class I've played, it feels like they had a solid concept of the class going through to 50 or maybe 60 but then the plan ran out so they just started adding stuff that seemed cool at the time. It really does feel like all of the tools are there to make for a really interesting and complete class but the way they work doesn't, well, work in a smooth and logical way.

I don't really have any specific ideas to improve things but it could absolutely use a rework.

One thing I will mention is that not having any sort of ranged attack is really annoying but that also feels like a strange part of the identity of the class.

[Shurrikhan]

The sad thing is a lot of these suggestions have been suggested in the past and have been pretty well received here and on other forums/reddit.

By those who don't care if GL remains only a vague bonus rather than an actual mechanic.

[Ramura_Sono]

By those who don't care if GL remains only a vague bonus rather than an actual mechanic.

Remove the haste buff from it and make it instead a monk passive, and GL can become an actual mechanic. The vast majority of Monk players want to go fast, and stay fast. Hell, TK itself was something we built up to and blew our stacks on in it's initial inception in the HW beta.

Every other jobs maintenance buff is a non mechanic. GL being an actual mechanic is arguably why Monk itself has become so stagnated.

If the desire is to return GL to being an actual mechanic, then how about we - for once - get something other than situational GL upkeep skills to interact with it?

[Shurrikhan]

Remove the haste buff from it and make it instead a monk passive, and GL can become an actual mechanic. The vast majority of Monk players want to go fast, and stay fast.

A passive haste gain is not a mechanic. It has no trigger. It has no decision-making. It has no unique reward system.

Hell, TK itself was something we built up to and blew our stacks on in it's initial inception in the HW beta.

It was only something "to just blow stacks on" -- which is not what's being suggested here, btw -- in HW beta because it was 500 potency at a time where Monk's 2nd highest direct damage skill was 340 potency and it cost 2.5 GCDs of uptime, with the next best oGCD being 220 potency.

Every other jobs maintenance buff is a non mechanic. GL being an actual mechanic is arguably why Monk itself has become so stagnated.

And they were each arguably far more engaging when they were mechanics. The difference is that the losses to their core gameplay has at least been compensated for over the later levels, while ours has remained untouched aside from having our means of and rewards for manipulating it skillfully reduced with the expansion. You can afford to get stale bread with a meal otherwise large and tasty enough to outright forget about the bread and enjoy everything else, but Monk has no 'everything else'; it's just the bread, which happens to be bordering on stale. And taking the filler components from other jobs just because they're analogous to what we need fixed in our own kit does nothing to improve those parts or by extension, our kit.

Let's at least look at what's fun about the other kits, rather than just tangentials like "Well, they don't have to worry about any core mechanics!" that are only salvaged by those fun parts that, while they might provide nothing in themselves, they at least don't get in the way of. It would be nice if our kit itself were already so damn fun that whether our core mechanics and playflow were interesting or not were irrelevant... but it's not, and at that point we might as well think about how the core experience itself can be improved upon.

If the desire is to return GL to being an actual mechanic, then how about we - for once - get something other than situational GL upkeep skills to interact with it?

I'm all for that. But turning it into just an extra layer of free potency as suggested above, let alone RNG-based potency via Chakra, is not that. Neither of those situations has anything in common with manipulating GL. One is RNG potency. The other is "I continued to exist without, at worst case, forgetting Form Shift also exists" potency.