1.21a Paladin Ability Changes

[Geabrielle]

war has amazing tanking skills ,what are you talking about, lol. ever since they took guard ability away gld has sucked, they should just give guard back.

The word "tank" involves the stipulation of self survivability, a thing that warrior does NOT have with out massive mage support. Tanking skills involve more than enmity generation as well, a fact a lot of DDs forget in the glory of 'pulling hate' which gives the illusion of 'tanking'. That's NOT tanking that's holding hate until death or the white mage decides you're a burden. A paladin IS a tank by this defination and a warrior is a placebo. Harsh descriptor perhaps but again I'm looking at it from the view of having to keep said placebo alive withut a backup and it's actually not as efficient as it seems from this side of the fence.

[syntaxlies]

The word "tank" involves the stipulation of self survivability, a thing that warrior does NOT have with out massive mage support. Tanking skills involve more than enmity generation as well, a fact a lot of DDs forget in the glory of 'pulling hate' which gives the illusion of 'tanking'. That's NOT tanking that's holding hate until death or the white mage decides you're a burden. A paladin IS a tank by this defination and a warrior is a placebo. Harsh descriptor perhaps but again I'm looking at it from the view of having to keep said placebo alive withut a backup and it's actually not as efficient as it seems from this side of the fence.

rampart, feather foot, sentinel, second wind, foresight, blood bath. all healing or damage mitigation skills that can be used be war. They may not have as much as glad in that department but they do have them.

[jwang]

My counter argument to the statement that healers will be too high on the hate list is that with the WAR's current damage and threat output, they can actually generate more hate than PLDs can outside of a multiple mob kiting situation. Between Antagonize and Sentinel, the hate generated by your actions should easily allow your damage dealers to remain safely in the yellow zone most of the time, and thus push their DPS higher. Sentinel, Rampart, Featherfoot, Foresight, and Vengeance all reduce damage taken, and the self healing done by Rampage and Second Wind also adds to hate in addition to reducing the amount that healers have to heal, lowering their hate generation. In my experience as tank, I actually have a harder time holding hate as PLD than as WAR since part of my threat generation comes from healing the party and myself. When my MP runs dry, I either have to depend on ethers (which I don't have room or inclination to carry), Outmaneuver (which returns a piddling amount of MP), or Ballad (which requires a specialized group setup). It just simply is easier to go with a WAR tank than a PLD tank, especially since on boss level mobs, it's less about the amount of armor you have and more about the amount of HP you have to give healers more breathing room for their cures, HP numbers that WARs have in spades.

[Darkillumina]

Heaven forbid we have two tanks who can handle the role...

These fixes are great and help out paladin immensely. Each handles the role decently, yes Pally could use a small HP bump but the only people crying about the job in contrast to WAR are min/maxers.

The way the two are specialized at the moment leads to flexibility in the future for specific runs. For 2.0 most will not have all jobs to 50 and be simply looking to min/max to get gear as quickly as possible. Having more than one class for a certain role ensures that parties are easier to find in the future.

[Madruk]

Still no reason to bring a paladin to content that promotes speed over efficiency. Both of the new dungeons are basically pull mass mobs/aoe and the warriors 1600 cyclone crits while a paladin sitting there holding his "sword" doesn't have any comparable ability.

Good revamps but right now it accomplishes nothing. There has to be content to promote the use of a paladin first.

[GreyJorildyn]

They'll add something PLD excels at. It's only a matter of time really. ARC, PGL (MNK), LNC, and MRD all went through this same phase. It's part of the ebb and flow of the MMO raid design we've seen so far.

[Gradd]

SE cannot design tank jobs its XI all over again, (RDM DRK NIN all Shat all over PLD pretty hard in everything in XI in the 75 Era) as long as other jobs can Take damage just fine and Dish out damage at the same time Paladin (just like in XI) will never be a useful job.

Before the update introducing the job system CNJ was tanking Ifrit better than GLD tanks.

I have alot of faith in Yoshi and the Dev Team when it comes to building this game up, but when it comes to a no shit 'You need X-Job Tanking Now' I have no faith whatsoever in SE to deliver us a proper tank job.

[Geabrielle]

I suppose I still carry a greater faith and bias with Paladin, so I'm happy with any changes they get to better facilitate their role. I can admit that especially since my biggest grief as a support class is being stuck with said War as a blatant MP sponge on top of having to care for an entire party besides - on my small server before the impending merge having 2 healers for just about anything DOES NOT EXIST. There for by my experience War is NOT a tank they are a raging deathfest until some giant boss slaps them into the ground then goes after the squishies.

Also, I admit my playtime in XIV is a short span but the rules of tanking designations aren't hugely varied. We see the intent and it's up to us as players to make that intent into action and embrace it instead of shooting it down before we can even see things in action.

[datboycuong]

Basically if you bring a warrior in, you're guaranteed to have to have 2 WHM just because of how much they get hit.

If you have PLD now, maybe they will only need 1 healer

[Phobos]

Basically if you bring a warrior in, you're guaranteed to have to have 2 WHM just because of how much they get hit.

If you have PLD now, maybe they will only need 1 healer

As has been stated in other threads, this is not the case. The second healer is to make things easier and safer in general. It's a safety net because it adds 2 more raises, and it's needed in fights where everyone is taking damage.