Why do you want auto-attack? (discussion)[dev1022]

[SnowTiger]

If combat is so boring that auto-attack is the only way you can think of fixing it, then that batle system needs more than autoattack... trust me.

All auto-attack does is add a background DPS rate to your attacks, meaning that mob hp will be adjusted accordingly. Rendering the whole thing futile.

You're entitled to your opinion on it, but I completely disagree. The direction I think they should go in, is one where each player has a wide arsenal of abilities and commands at their disposal, many of which are specialized to put value and emphasis on their chosen role.

Teamwork and coordination would also be imperative, and strategy would be key. Mobs would need a whole new range of abilities as well, so that players would have reason to respond to the ever changing situation with ever changing tactics, which still fit into the general strategy being employed.

Each action any given player makes at any given time should be chosen. Which means, there would be alternatives to any given action. With basic attacks eating up all your commands, that doesn't happen. You just spam attack. It's dull.

Right now, the game is a long way from that, and to be honest, I don't think it will ever get to where I'd take it if I was running the show... But then again, neither will any other mmo's on the market, but the difference with this game is at least they're still tinkering with it, and that gives some hope of a decent system, where the other games I've played and looked at aren't even considering making more out of their systems.

There's a great deal of potential though... With things like various stances that both the mobs and players could take, enfeebles and buffs, various types of damage, combined abilities that serve two purposes, such as an enfeebling attack, but that don't excel at either, various countermeasures to mob actions, the traditional tank/healer interactions, limb damage and angled attacks, nearly endless mob specific abilities that could be added, and not to mention, the potential of battle regiments and a whole spectrum of effects that those could have. That's just to scratch the surface. Really, the skies the limit to what could be done, but the more intricate and detailed they want it, the more time and money it will cost, which greatly diminishes the chances of us seeing anything of spectacular depth.

So yeah, if they really knocked it out of the park, there would be ample degrees of both strategy and tactics, and many ways to approach a fight. Players could be kept busy and engaged in the combat, without needing to mindlessly spam normal attacks. Auto-attack would be more about having a timer on the TP gain, which utilizes various stats, giving further use to things like gear, buffs, and food. With all that, and a party that works in tandem together, all you need is a wide spectrum of challenges, including exceedingly hard ones at one end, and relatively easy ones at the other.

Or, you know... We could all just mash the same button for 5 minutes, and then rinse and repeat. With strategy going no farther than not standing in the wrong spot. Way too many games today cater to the lowest possible level of thought, but I think that if you presented gamers with a more thought intensive combat system, they'd be more than capable of acclimating to it. One where every choice has a deliberate and decisive impact, and not just spamfests with the occasional larger attack or routine cycle of buffs and debuffs. Mmo's are the perfect place for even the more casual of gamers to be able to adjust to such a combat system, as the long road to the level cap would be an ideal way to gradually hone your skills, and then at cap, the game could really open up on a number of levels.

But again, a combat system like what I'm imagining here is extremely unlikely to take shape anytime soon. Too many people have resigned to wanting their games to require little thought, and to be a relaxed mellow experience. A little intensity and strategy would really liven things up though. And I know for a fact that the vast majority of gamers would be more than capable of not only utilizing a system like that, but enjoying it as well. But it seems neither the players nor the developers want to really give such a thing a chance.

What is the point of chatting while in combat? I don't want to talk when I fight. I want to fight when I fight.

And erm, well... If not for the sake of socializing, then to plot attacks or a similar manner of scheming? But to each their own. Still, it is an mmo, and socializing with your team is part of the experience. If it wasn't, they'd just give everyone their own offline server, and replace other players with npcs and bots.

At any rate, I'm not getting my hopes up too high. And the game doesn't need to be perfectly tailored to my ideal concept of a game either, I'll take what comes along and enjoy it for whatever it's worth. At the end of the day, it is just a game after all. :P

Oh and sorry for responding with a rambling wall of text... I tend to do that lol. ^.^

[Evovenom]

All the content the developers have planned for us is purely in response to the player polls and individual player's comments/demands. SE has reached the point where they are appealing and conceding to every self-proclaimed expert rather than seeking to improve their own vision for the game. A cursory glance at the changes released so far or slated for release in the future (i.e., aggro indicator, AH, auto-attack combat) is enough to prove that they will compromise on artistic integrity and palatability just for the sake of pleasing their current players. Sadly, most of the people who still play are FFXI fanatics or WoW players, so much so that the polls are slanted in their favour, as opposed to being slanted in favour of an overall better game.

If they think a combat system centred on auto-attack is going to be a drawcard against the upcoming MMOs like Guild Wars 2 and TERA, then FFXIV has a surprise coming. Similarly, if they merely think that changing FFXIV into FFXI-2 is going to save them, then again, all they are doing is shuffling current subscribers between games, and in the end aren't gaining any revenue.

This is an artistic issue as much as a practical one. Auto-attack is boring and many players who aren't FFXI losers would agree, hence why FFXIV will fail if it seeks only to appeal to such players and not the majority.

But whatever. Enjoy your slowly degenerating game while you still can.

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out, mr cool guy.

[Evovenom]

Im only thinking of the game's welfare.

But if you are prepared to sacrifice FFXIV's longevity just because you want to chat up some miqotes during combat, by all means, go ahead. But I hope you know even PS3 wont be this game's salvation what with Blade & Soul and DCUO already existing or soon-to-be contenders.

And I find it a pretty specious claim to say that the potential market on the PS3 is even enough to, not only rejuvinate FFXIV, but sustain it also.

I wish you luck with FFXIV too, you sure are going to need it.

You are one freaking retard, ignorant, dumb ass kid, look at FFXI susbcription base idiot. It has done well, doesn't need 11million kids running around jumping. This game is here and here to stay. They always have xbox 360 to later port.

[Corrderio]

They always have xbox 360 to later port.

This is assuming Microsoft meets SE's terms.

[Evovenom]

If combat is so boring that auto-attack is the only way you can think of fixing it, then that batle system needs more than autoattack... trust me.



All auto-attack does is add a background DPS rate to your attacks, meaning that mob hp will be adjusted accordingly. Rendering the whole thing futile.



What is the point of chatting while in combat? I don't want to talk when I fight. I want to fight when I fight.

You must be looking for wrong type of game, you see, this is MMO, where you play this rpg game but it's online with OTHERS, you join with fights with OTHERS, you fight together side by side with OTHERS, you can play alone, you can be a loser in the cornor by all means but this is MMO after all...

they have other offline games where you can fight, fight, and fight, no need to sit and chat.

not because your a 2 times loser and some of us actually have people to talk to means auto attack is bad or as you put it "ruining my game" opps i mean "ruining our game" who the F is this we you speak to highly of, you and your cat?

[gifthorse]

who the F is this we you speak to highly of, you and your cat?

Please refrain from making absolutely no sense in the future. Ok?

[Lamhirh]

you see for people who really enjoy current system, autoattack will ruin it, but to those who find that only way to fight is spam 1, its just minior inconvinience ( the lack of it i mean)

[Dargoth_Draconia]

I don't know how anyone can hate auto attack especially over the current system where you just spam normal attack endlessly and hope that when you want to hit a weapon skill the delay doesn't allow you for 5 seconds. I liked the system at first but soon after I much rather have an auto attack so my damage can be optimized and battle speed can pick up. The reason they are changing it is because the current system isn't working as intended and is slowing the battles down and with them lowering the group sizes from 15 to 8 that have to tweek the battle system so that the game moves at a fluid pace and not because the people are too lazy to spam 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 for 20-30 minutes straight.

[Lamhirh]

hnope you dont spam normal attack needlesly. i use it only few times per fight, i use other skills too. If you spam 1 1 1 1 , than you need to lern how to use other attacks. Only way to solve the problem is L2P. Cos if opeople dont use skills
they wont use it with autoattack . So what change is it?

Systejm IS working as intended. all it need is some balancing to skill efficiency. Autoatack wont solve that, it will just apeal to WOW crowd. And also saying you will be able to chat is a bullcrap. if you rreally play game you use skills, witch leaves no time for chatting anyway ( and when you fight easy mobs, it doesnt matter anyway if you pause attacks for 5 seconds to type something.

[Skeeter]

Auto attack is coming, get over it. There is no reason to argue against it anymore, it isn't going to change their mind.